centerfire load help?

thealex · May 20, 2012, 11:16 AM

Greetings.
I recently acquired a lot of 500 cinterfire frangible .45 acp 155 grain bullets and out of my 4 loading books only the lee has any data for them. I loaded a handfull last night and i had some feed issues so i played with the length and charge and all that did was give me ejection problems too.
Has anyone had any luck with accu #5, win 231, blue dot or unique? As those are what I have on hand.
Your help is appreciated. Thanks. Alex

Lost Sheep · May 20, 2012, 12:33 PM

Most feed issues are due to the magazine. Though your magazine(s) have proven reliable with other bullets, the nose shape of these might give problems. 155 grains is a pretty short bullet. What is your cartridge overall length? Is this your Glock 21 g4 (I dug through your other posts) having the problems? Do you have any other 45 ACP guns to try them in? Do you have a chronograph?

Can you post some pictures of these bullets? Measure the length of the bullet for us and post some pictures of the loaded rounds, please.

The ejection problems are seldom a problem with the magazine. Please describe the failures. Failure to eject the round at all and leaving the empty casing still chambered? Stovepipe jam?

Without details I would speculate they are probably due to the strength of the recoil spring in relation to the energy and momentum of the round.

Can you provide a list of the lengths and powder charge weights used and the nature of the failures with each? We may be able to see a pattern.

example
W231 x.x grains OAL 1.xx" feed: stops at feed ramp. ejection: OK

W231 x.x grains OAL 1.xx" feed: stops at chambering. Ejection: stovepipe (caught in ejection port)

W2331 x.x grains OAL 1.xx" and so forth.

The following comments are pure speculation:

I suspect such a light bullet does not generate enough momentum to cycle the slide fully. Tighten your grip (or even brace the gun's butt against an immovable object) and see if that improves the ejection. If that helps, a lighter recoil spring for these loads might work.

I suspect such a short bullet does two things. At a full length cartridge, there may be more volume inside the case, leading to less than full pressure to drive the bullet. Are your cases sooty on the outside? That is a sign of pressure too low to properly seal the chamber. If you seat the bullets deeply enough to leave the volume UNDER the bullet what is normally expected in a 230 grain bullet, the cartridge may be too short to feed reliably. Magazine feed lips can be reshaped easily enough with no risk to the gun, but may not cure the problem. Reshaping the feed ramp modifies the gun itself and may cause problems with full-sized cartridges. It's more risky. Having a special magazine customized for use only with these 155 grain bullets is one thing. Having a special gun customized for use only with these 155 grain bullets is quite another.

Help us help you. Pictures and detailed symptoms will help.

Lost Sheep

rg1 · May 20, 2012, 12:58 PM

Hodgdon Reloading Data Center has loads for the 155 Sfire frangible. They list an overall length at 1.220". You could use their data to compare. Sinterfire lists an overall length at 1.210". Accurate Arms also lists data on-line for the 155 SF frangible and their oal recommendation is 1.210.

thealex · May 20, 2012, 05:47 PM

Ok, Thanks you guys. I figured the light bullet was causing the ejection issues. Stovepipe, closed slide on empty and closed slide after firing, so I increased the powder charge to near max.(I was middle of the road to start and slowly raised it) I also had the oal too long @1.250 and 1.230 which was causing the feeding issues. I have it at 1.215 now.
That was a new one for me. I have shot about 5 different types and weights of bullets through my G 21 gen 4 and not had that happen once.
So after just running another batch I just greased a steel plate with a resounding ping every time. Thanks again for the input. Alex

May 20, 2012, 11:16 AM	#1
thealex Member Join Date: January 31, 2012 Posts: 35	centerfire load help? Greetings. I recently acquired a lot of 500 cinterfire frangible .45 acp 155 grain bullets and out of my 4 loading books only the lee has any data for them. I loaded a handfull last night and i had some feed issues so i played with the length and charge and all that did was give me ejection problems too. Has anyone had any luck with accu #5, win 231, blue dot or unique? As those are what I have on hand. Your help is appreciated. Thanks. Alex

May 20, 2012, 12:33 PM	#2
Lost Sheep Senior Member Join Date: January 24, 2009 Location: Anchorage Alaska Posts: 3,341	Most feed issues are due to the magazine. Though your magazine(s) have proven reliable with other bullets, the nose shape of these might give problems. 155 grains is a pretty short bullet. What is your cartridge overall length? Is this your Glock 21 g4 (I dug through your other posts) having the problems? Do you have any other 45 ACP guns to try them in? Do you have a chronograph? Can you post some pictures of these bullets? Measure the length of the bullet for us and post some pictures of the loaded rounds, please. The ejection problems are seldom a problem with the magazine. Please describe the failures. Failure to eject the round at all and leaving the empty casing still chambered? Stovepipe jam? Without details I would speculate they are probably due to the strength of the recoil spring in relation to the energy and momentum of the round. Can you provide a list of the lengths and powder charge weights used and the nature of the failures with each? We may be able to see a pattern. example W231 x.x grains OAL 1.xx" feed: stops at feed ramp. ejection: OK W231 x.x grains OAL 1.xx" feed: stops at chambering. Ejection: stovepipe (caught in ejection port) W2331 x.x grains OAL 1.xx" and so forth. The following comments are pure speculation: I suspect such a light bullet does not generate enough momentum to cycle the slide fully. Tighten your grip (or even brace the gun's butt against an immovable object) and see if that improves the ejection. If that helps, a lighter recoil spring for these loads might work. I suspect such a short bullet does two things. At a full length cartridge, there may be more volume inside the case, leading to less than full pressure to drive the bullet. Are your cases sooty on the outside? That is a sign of pressure too low to properly seal the chamber. If you seat the bullets deeply enough to leave the volume UNDER the bullet what is normally expected in a 230 grain bullet, the cartridge may be too short to feed reliably. Magazine feed lips can be reshaped easily enough with no risk to the gun, but may not cure the problem. Reshaping the feed ramp modifies the gun itself and may cause problems with full-sized cartridges. It's more risky. Having a special magazine customized for use only with these 155 grain bullets is one thing. Having a special gun customized for use only with these 155 grain bullets is quite another. Help us help you. Pictures and detailed symptoms will help. Lost Sheep Last edited by Lost Sheep; May 20, 2012 at 05:16 PM.

May 20, 2012, 12:58 PM	#3
rg1 Senior Member Join Date: November 6, 2001 Posts: 1,125	Hodgdon Reloading Data Center has loads for the 155 Sfire frangible. They list an overall length at 1.220". You could use their data to compare. Sinterfire lists an overall length at 1.210". Accurate Arms also lists data on-line for the 155 SF frangible and their oal recommendation is 1.210. Last edited by rg1; May 20, 2012 at 01:10 PM.

May 20, 2012, 05:47 PM	#4
thealex Member Join Date: January 31, 2012 Posts: 35	Ok, Thanks you guys. I figured the light bullet was causing the ejection issues. Stovepipe, closed slide on empty and closed slide after firing, so I increased the powder charge to near max.(I was middle of the road to start and slowly raised it) I also had the oal too long @1.250 and 1.230 which was causing the feeding issues. I have it at 1.215 now. That was a new one for me. I have shot about 5 different types and weights of bullets through my G 21 gen 4 and not had that happen once. So after just running another batch I just greased a steel plate with a resounding ping every time. Thanks again for the input. Alex