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Old January 30, 2019, 11:30 AM   #26
fourbore
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50 cases! I get it 50 rounds.
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Old January 30, 2019, 12:05 PM   #27
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My 2 35 remington rifles are circa 1945 for the 141 and 1965 for the 336.
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Old January 30, 2019, 12:40 PM   #28
Mike Irwin
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"The cartridge was designed to be used in the compact pump action 14 and 141 rifles along with several other cartridges in the same power class as 30-30."

The .35 Remington, and the other three Remington rimless cartridges, were not designed to be used in pump action rifles.

They were designed for, and introduced with, the John Browning designed Model 8 semi-automatic rifle, which was introduced a number of years before the Pedersen-designed pump actions were brought to market.
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Old January 30, 2019, 01:42 PM   #29
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Quote:
"The cartridge was designed to be used in the compact pump action 14 and 141 rifles along with several other cartridges in the same power class as 30-30."
Mike is correct (as usual) this statement is "cart before the horse". The Remington family of rounds (.25,.30, .32, and .35) were introduced before the Remington pump (model 14) which was designed to be able to use the rounds with its unique "spiral" tube magazine. The 141 was a refinement of the 14.

So, in this case, the pump rifle(s) were designed to use the ammo, rather than the ammo being designed to be used in that rifle.
Quote:
With a pointed plastic tip 180, both the max and the 35 Remington can still be in the 1500 - 1600 fps range at 200 yards.

For comparison, this close to what a typical 357 magnum revolver does at the muzzle with a 158.
I think the numbers are overly optimistic for the Maximum and under rating the .35 Rem. And, please, do tell us what TYPICAL .357 revolver gets over 1500fps MV with a 158gr, today.??

You can do it with heavy loads out of an 8" N-frame or similar revolver, but they aren't the typical .357s today...
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Old January 30, 2019, 02:04 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by fourbore View Post
50 cases! I get it 50 rounds.
Correct.
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Old January 30, 2019, 02:18 PM   #31
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I think the numbers are overly optimistic for the Maximum and under rating the .35 Rem. And, please, do tell us what TYPICAL .357 revolver gets over 1500fps MV with a 158gr, today.??

You can do it with heavy loads out of an 8" N-frame or similar revolver, but they aren't the typical .357s today...
.357 Mag has a wide variety of loadings, from .38 +P+ levels to Buffalo Bore, which while premium .357 ammo, its price is in the same ballpark as .35 Remington factory ammo. Not as powerful, but powerful enough for most uses.

It's .357 Maximum where I see the glaring weakness for .35 Rem. I just saw over the weekend a video of handloads being shot from a 24 inch T/C Encore barrel with 180 grain bullets averaging 1950 fps, likely 2000 fps with another grain of powder. While not a 200 grain bullet like we see in .35 Remington, I'm not sure when an extra 20 grains of lead is needed for the cost and rarity of the brass.
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Old January 30, 2019, 03:03 PM   #32
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I don't know that I'd call the brass rare. It's not going to fill up an 8 foot section of shelves at the store, but factory 35 Remington ammunition can be found, at least where I live this is the case. Hornady LeverEvolution and Remington Corelokt are usually what I see. I have found some Winchester before as well.
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Old January 30, 2019, 03:23 PM   #33
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Quote:
.357 Mag has a wide variety of loadings, from .38 +P+ levels to Buffalo Bore, which while premium .357 ammo....
On the other hand, an apples-to-apples comparison of premium ammo:

BuffaloBore Ammo
.357 Magnum - 180 @ 1400 fps/785 fpe
.35 Remington - 220 @ 2200 fps/2365 fpe.

I wouldn’t shoot elk, bear or moose with the little magnum, but wouldn’t hesitate with the .35 rimless load above. I really don’t care what the OP does with his cases, but some other readers might be......mislead.


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Old January 30, 2019, 03:53 PM   #34
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I have wanted a 35 Remington rifle for a long time. A little over a year ago I bought one off GB for around $400 IIRC. I also bought dies, brass and bullets. My loads should be getting between 2100-2200fps with a 200gr bullet. I haven't killed anything with it but its a lot of fun to shoot and has a step up in recoil over the 30-30. There is a fellow on the cast bullet forum that makes brass from 308 brass that is a little thicker and stronger. I need to order a 100 pieces.

Go here to the Marlin Owners forum and you can read to your hearts content about the 35 remington. There is a lotta love for this round and the Marlin rifle that shoots it. Of course you have the option of shooting 357 pistol bullets from the rifle. Even low power lead bullets for cheap practice and smaller game.

https://www.marlinowners.com/forum/35-remington/
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Old January 30, 2019, 07:50 PM   #35
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35 vs 30-30....Dad and I went at it for years. He loved his 30-30 and I loved the 35. As for penetration, I shot deer, and a lot of them, and every 200 grainer penetrated through all of them. As for useful range, I always considered it a 150 yard gun, though I did reach out to 260 on one spike.

I don’t know which one is really better, but I remain a 35 fan.
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Old January 30, 2019, 08:12 PM   #36
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I saw a beauty marlin in this a few years back at an LGS--I hemmed and hawed about it for a while--and then when I finally made my mind up and went back it was gone. A mid-power 358 sounds great to me, perfect for a lever gun. I'm having lots of fun with my new Henry 45 70--but after a while your teeth start to hurt from rattling about in your head.
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Old January 30, 2019, 09:11 PM   #37
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My first deer rifle in early 60s was a Rem 8 in 35Rem. I only went 100lbs and I moved me around a good bit. Got my first deer with it. Then busted my but to get a 742 in 3006 like
the older guys had. Short honeymoon with it, worst rifle I ever owned. By the time I was 16 I was in 35 fever. I had a 8-81-14-141 and 336. In the woods they put the hammer on deer.
I have thinned them down a little, got rid of Marlin, still have the others. My favorite is 141.
I have shot a truck load of deer with about every caliber you can think of. Over half were shot with 35Rem. Only problem I ever had with the 35 was shooting through a buck and hit a doe in the guts. Out of state with no doe permit, lucky to find a local to tag it. It's ideal game rifle when you are hunting woods where shoots over 100yds are rare. The Marlin was
the only one I scope, the others had tangs and reciever sights. Always used 200RN.
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Old January 31, 2019, 02:52 AM   #38
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bucket .35

My first deer rifle was a Rem 14 in .30 Rem, but I always wanted a .35. A vintage pump would be nice and I wouldn't pass on a 14/141 in .35 at the right price.

But an attractive option was the half magazined, 24" barrel Marlin 336A. I talked myself into getting one shortly after we moved into our home, a good 25 yrs ago. The price was right, even with years of house payments ahead. When I went back, it was gone
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Old February 11, 2019, 03:15 AM   #39
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I’m into lever guns and own a 336CS in .35 Remington. I also have a Marlin 336 in 30-30 but I prefer the .35. I picked the .35 up several years back at an estate sale, made in 1950’s and had an old Weaver x4 power scope on top. Minor adjustments and it was back in the small circle. I have a hog hunt in a few weeks and I’m going to leave the autos home and let my lever guns out to play. I figure the old .35 will do just fine for me.
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Old February 11, 2019, 05:37 PM   #40
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It's really a very simple set of circumstances. The most important thing to remember is that the .358 bore has never been a popular item, never in the history of cartridge development. Only a few numbers were actually designed, very few reached any great popularity, and generally speaking, they are all now defunct or running at very low production.

The .35 remington was created in the early 1900s, as the first serious .358 rifle caliber. Since it was created by Remington and released along with rifles to use it, it obviously created its own market. People liked it for what it was, a hard hitting medium bored and heavy bullet. We were still fixated on the old black powder numbers such as the .45-70, and the .308 caliber had not yet won the hearts of american shooters.

Soon we had the .35 whelen. It was a much stronger round, harder to love, and even more problematic, a custom number for decades. When we came out with a norma magnum, well, there wasn't much of a need for it. We had .338 and 458 magnums, and the majority of americans would keep these american numbers in their minds rather than a european caliber like the norma. The remington magnum was a stinker. The .358 winchester was far too late to the game, and not necessarily an improvement over any of the others. The hold that the .35 remington had on its market was safe.

It's a simple fact that the .35 remington in a lever, pump, or semiauto is a wonderful combination for deer or elk, or other similar game, in reasonable ranges. 200 grains and what was it, 2,200 or so? A big hole. You have huge regions of america that this combination excels at.

So we have three combined things that have put this century old round in a stil viable position.

It was designed for a very popular rifle action and it has never gone out of usefulness.

It works extremely well with its intended use within the limits that are obvious.

The only competing rounds that were created were too specialized, and didn't fulfill the needs that a .35 remington fulfilled so well.

The .357 maximum is a fluke. If it had been create in the period that the .35 remington had been made, it wouldn't be around. Only in these affluent days would a gun so specialized be created. There was no handgun hunting back then, and the lever or pump rifle were already well served.
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Old February 11, 2019, 06:10 PM   #41
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I have both a 358 win and a 35 Whelen--the 358 bullet is a superb short to short/mid-range bullet IMO.
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Old February 12, 2019, 12:03 AM   #42
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I consider all of them to be excellent tools for what they are. Neither of the three is what I would consider for a round to fire where long open country might be involved. I always thought that if I could get a barrel for my 742 remington in .35 whelen it would be the ultimate woods gun for the northeast where you might hunt moose or bear in short ranges.
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Old February 12, 2019, 11:21 AM   #43
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Well, it's popular with me!!!!!!! My list of 35s:

- Winchester model 70 FW, barreled to 358 Win.

- Remington model 7600, 35 Whelen

- Remington model 7600, 35 Rem. This one is tricked out all tactical with an AR style collapsible stock and XS sight systems tactical peep with front post. Designated bad weather gun.

- Remington model 14, circa 1928 with an original Lyman R14 tang sight. Just got this one last fall and it has not scored a white tail by my hand yet

I shot my very first deer, a doe in 1975, with a borrowed Marlin 336 in 35 Remington.

Within 100 yards, I've never seen a deer be able to tell the difference between getting hit with a 35 Remington and my .35 Whelen. The 35 rem has been called "The hammer of Thor" in some circles and for good reason. You do your part, it puts'em down.
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Old February 13, 2019, 07:29 AM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by briandg
I always thought that if I could get a barrel for my 742 remington in .35 whelen it would be the ultimate woods gun for the northeast where you might hunt moose or bear in short ranges.
If your 742 is currently a .30-06, then simply have the barrel rebored...

Same magazines and bolt face...

I believe the cost is $245 at JES Reboring...
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Old February 13, 2019, 10:38 AM   #45
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"The most important thing to remember is that the .358 bore has never been a popular item, never in the history of cartridge development. Only a few numbers were actually designed, very few reached any great popularity, and generally speaking, they are all now defunct or running at very low production."

Yep. Sad but true.

The second most popular .35 caliber cartridge in the United States (behind the .35 Remington) was likely the .351 Winchester Self Loading, and its popularity was primarily due to police forces taking a liking to the rifle.

It's predecessor cartridge, the .35 WSL, was a monumental flop.
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Old February 13, 2019, 05:50 PM   #46
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Yep it's a 150 yds cartridge (just like the .30-30 if we're being honest), but it's 200 gr bullet does better on deer. I've hunted with a Marlin .35 for 35+ years, killed better than a dozen deer with one and not one ran farther than 50 yds. Hit in the slats, the 35's a through and through cartridge leaving a good blood trail for a short trail up.

Exit holes with Remington's Core Lock 200 gr RN are over an inch with chest cavity placement. Penetration is not a problem, nor is bullet break up. I also like and use RCBS cast 200 gr FP at 210 gr, a FP well worth trying, and every bit the equal to the Remington, Speer, Sierra and Federal 200 grainers.

Accuracy runs 2" or a bit less at 100 yds with a 2.5x scope mounted on my 336. If you get a Marlin, check out Marlin Owners forum for specifics on accurizing any 336. In my case I loosened the front fore end band and groups were cut in half. The 336, like the Winchester 94, is a wonderful deer gun...nestles right down in a gloved hand due to its narrow receiver. Even with a low power scope mounted, it's far better toting over hill and dale than ANY bolt action.

Peep sights are a good bet on any lever gun, and the Winchesters and Marlins in this caliber are well suited to its use. Accuracy, with a good gun/muzzle crown, can be relied on at 2" at 100 yds. (Even with my 72 yo eyes doing the steering). Light, easy to carry, & ideally suited to a saddle scabbard, the lever gun is a joy to use.

Back to the .35 Remington cartridge. Brass can be a problem, and nearly impossible to make from another cartridge. Buy it when you find it. Currently it's available as loaded Remington rounds here in Louisville. But Cabelas recently had Hornady 50 round count bags of brass available. I've laid 400 aside for use in my Marlin just in case.

Bullets: the best in factory rounds are Remington 200 gr Core Locks. Not currently sold as reloading components, but still available as loaded ammunition. They'll open up into perfect mushrooms at most any velocity over say 1500 fps all the way out to 150 yds. Hornady's 180 gr FP's are also good and can be loaded to over 2100 fps in my carbine. They have a good following for deer hunting and open up at carbine muzzle velocities (~2000 fps). The Hornday 220 gr FP is just too hard and can't be launched fast enough to open from a 20" carbine. Sierra's 200 gr RN is also good, equal in accuracy to the Remington, tho a bit harder, read; slower to expand on impact. In cast bullets, RCBS's 200 gr FP is excellent for accuracy but killing power, is due to through and through penetration, expansion being limited. It's a great bullet when cast from an alloy of 50-50 lead to wheel weights & gas checked.

All in all, the .35 is the perfect deer rifle for woods or timber hunting. Range is limited to 150 yds...but in all honesty, in 60 years of deer hunting, over variety of terrain in Washington state, Colorado, Texas, Connecticut, and Kentucky, of the more than 60-70 deer I've taken in those varied covers, I've killed exactly 2 at more than 150 yds...it just doesn't happen for me. And for that experience, the .35 is perfect. Scope it if you want (and have a 336 Marlin, or mount a peep on the Winchester or Marlin), and enjoy deer hunting as it was meant to be.

HTH's Rod
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