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Old May 10, 2006, 11:35 PM   #26
Pointer
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Texas heart shot.
I love it

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Old May 11, 2006, 09:21 AM   #27
taylorce1
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Texas Heart Shot!:barf:
That was the first discussion on this forum that I posted in. I still wouldn't do it no matter what I was hunting except for coyote and prarie dogs.
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Old May 11, 2006, 09:52 AM   #28
Wild Bill Bucks
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30.06- 150 gr.BT- 2910fps Muzzle Velocity= Point Blank Range of 287 yards with 1776 ft lbs.- Mid range trajectory is 3" @ 145 yards.

.308- 150 gr BT- 2822fps Muzzle Velocity= Point blank range of 275 yards with 1599 ft lbs- Mid range trajectory is 3" @ 135 yards.

Looking in about 4 reloading manuels, I don't see enough difference to be argueing about.
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Old May 11, 2006, 10:20 AM   #29
Harley Quinn
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Harder hitter is my thought

The 300 Win Mag or H&H.
Majestic Animal. Use the gun that is appropriate.

Lot more energy and fps. But then you might not be able to shoot it as well as the 308. The placement and distance is very important.
At one hundred yards, it is one thing, at three hundred it is another.

The idea of use enough gun is still important. My thoughts

If you are calm, cool and collected, a good hunter and the terrain is not bad and can get close. Well that is what this board is all about, discussion.

HQ
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Old May 11, 2006, 11:41 AM   #30
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I will be damn impressed if you can make a texas heart shot on a prairie dog - and even more impressed if you can forensically determine whether or not you did, from the remains.
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Old May 11, 2006, 08:05 PM   #31
taylorce1
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I used the ballistics part of Federal web site to compare cartridge performance on the .270 Win, .308 Win, .30-06 Spr, and .300 Win mag. Ballistics were generated at 300 yards for sea level with a temp of 59 degrees and a 10mph cross wind.
http://www.federalcartridge.com/default.asp?br=1
I'll give you the best and worst performer with factory loads.

Bullets used

.270 150 grain Sierra Game King BC .480

.308 180 grain Nosler Partition BC .474

.30-06 180 grain Nosler Partition BC .474

.300 Win Mag 180 grain Speer Hot-Core SP BC .439

Velocity at 300yds in FPS

.300=2346
.308-2089

Energy at 300yds in ft-lbs

.300=2201
.308=1745

Wind drift at 300yds in inches

.270=6.3
.308=7.3

Trajectory at 300yds in inches

.300=-7
.308=-9

With this info there is little difference in these fine hunting cartridges at normal hunting ranges inside of 300 yards. There is a lot of factors that are not on this web site such as firearm used and length of barrel. But the answer is still yes the .308 is plenty for Elk.

Texas Heart Shots on prairie dogs are not hard to do as long as they are moving away and you have an eye witness in your back pocket!
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Old May 12, 2006, 10:14 AM   #32
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Quick tangent question

In the unlikely event I can afford to go Elk gun hunting this fall, I will be down to 2 best choices for a primary rifle: An AR10 semi-auto in .308, or a Savage 110 in 7mm remmag. Since I've heard so many stories of lost elk, I like the idea of being able to double-tap - 1 perfectly placed shot, then a second shot as fast as I can pull the trigger, hopefully also in the vitals. Not to mention that the .308 is a bigger bullet than 7mm (180/.30 vs. 175/.28). But the Savage is likely to be more accurate, and lighter to carry around. But assuming I find a 180 gr .308 load that my AR can shoot into 2 MOA, and assuming no shots beyond 250 yards, then until I get my .30-06 or .35 whelen, which of these two would you choose as the primary - of course I'll also take the other of the 2 as a backup rifle. But what of this idea of a double-tap - is it unethical? I wouldn't think so as it would just be a "gravy" shot to the very good first shot. I would not want to lose any elk, let alone a trophy. Oh, and I ain't takin' my P17 in .30-06 into the field.
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Old May 12, 2006, 10:30 AM   #33
Harley Quinn
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I understand where you are coming from.

First Freedom,
One of the reasons I like my 760 pump. It is in 06 but it is still a heck of a good choice. Just the reason you are mentioning. Lever actions the same reason. Out to 250 yds. good stuff.

The 7mm mag has a better record for distance but it is still a bolt. Some are pretty good at the second shoot though or the third one, Practice comes to mind.

HQ
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Old May 12, 2006, 10:55 AM   #34
taylorce1
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FF, I would use the Savage, first of all elk are not bulletproof second if you shoot the Savage well you probably won't have to shoot twice. I've only harvested two cow elk and hope to get a third elk this season. I shot one with a .30-06 and my second with a .270 Win.

Shot the first elk with a borrowed .30-06 is the only one I needed more than one bullet on. I was above her and to the side about 30 yards away, I aimed just behind her shoulder blades the bullet entered through her spine and exited her rib cage, she dropped where she stood. After I climbed down to her she was still alive, I totally missed the vitals, so I shot her behind the ear because her front legs were still working.

The second was taken at 250 yards broadside with the .270 150gn Hornady ammo. That cow spun around took a couple of steps and slid down the hill about ten feet. I took out both lungs and the bullet went clean through leaving an exit wound about the size of a half dollar.

The important thing with hunting is using a firearm you are comfortable with and using a bullet that functions well for type of firearm you are using. Don't use pistol bullets in rifles or rifle bullets in pistols when hunting large game unless that is what your firearm is designed to use. The most important thing is to know where to shoot the animal study the vital area from different angles. Plus a 7mm Rem Mag pushing a 175 grain bullet doesn't give up much to a 30 cal bullet in 180 grains, your 7mm will be devastating with a properly placed shot.
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Old May 12, 2006, 12:45 PM   #35
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let the flames begin ,the 33 cal is the perfect elk round others will work but nothing is better than a 33 ,338Win mag,340 Weatherby ,338 RUM, 338-378,338 laupa mag . the .308 will work but at long range a 33 gets her done better .and you will also be able to go for bigger game with it . Elk for dinner and a 33 to put it on the table ,sounds about right to me .
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Old May 12, 2006, 09:34 PM   #36
DobermansDoItGoofy
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no flames...

I have two .308's and a 375h&h... I prefer the .308 ie. fairly pleasant to shoot and versatile. The 375h&h is actually more versatile than some folks think & won't blow up game like a smaller higher velocity round(with the wrong bullet)but it's not the most pleasant round to shoot. My 243 and my 30/30 are very pleasant to shoot... I know of a fellow who routinely uses a TC Encore 375H&H with a bipod and muzzle break who shoots whitetail long range...and it works. What I like about the 308 is the short action and shorter barrel length make the rifle relatively light and handy...in much the same way a 30/30 is light and handy. In 308 vs. 30.06 I like the shorter action. Of course another set of 'elk' rounds that nobody's mentioned - are the 7mm Rem. and the 270&257 Weatherby... Lots of rounds will get the job done...
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Old May 13, 2006, 01:34 PM   #37
Harley Quinn
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Heres one for you, the 264 Win. Mag.

That is a real mans gun. LOL.

It needed the 26 inch barrel to be better then the 270 in a 22/24 inch barrel.
When you look at the mistakes Winchester has made in the past regarding rifles and calibers, it is very apparant why they are no longer in business.

8 mm Mauser in the FN 49, is a good choice. Why? Because I have one

HQ
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Old May 20, 2006, 09:27 PM   #38
taylorce1
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No flames here

I'm going to use my .338-06 this year on elk, I bought it with the hopes of a moose in my future and I didn't draw for an elk last year. Beautiful custom job on a 1903 action, or maybe I'll try my 35 Whelen I bought this year, probably not the stock is too pretty to bang up. I also picked up a .280 at a gun show I have about $15 in after trading, could use that since someone mentioned the 7mm calibers and I'm not afraid to bang that one around. With all that said I'll probably stick to my good o'l .270 though, I shoot that very well.

I don't think I would drop to the .25 caliber or the 6.5 for elk I like to use at least a 150 grains of lead to stop these beasties. I know some guys who hunt elk with .25-06 and .243's but their not for me. No Magnum rifles for me as well, unless you want to cout my .22 WMR might land me in jail if I shoot an elk with that. Nothing wrong with the magnums just haven't needed one yet so don't flame at me.
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Old May 23, 2006, 09:24 AM   #39
Jack O'Conner
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I doubt if many guides are impressed when a client states, "this dead elk I killed with my 338 magnum is a whole lot deader than the bull Jack killed with his .308"

Its easy to see who has been brainwashed by Craig Boddington and his journalist friends payrolled by HUNTING magazine. How do you like paying for that expensive ammo which pounds your shoulder into a painful bruise?

You can hunt elk with whatever you choose. I really do not care at all. But when someone says their rifle is better at killing I have to wonder about experience and common sense. Dad often stated to me that, "common sense ain't that common".
Jack
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Old May 23, 2006, 09:33 AM   #40
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Jack,

Absolutely correct. Most of the time when hunting - more is just more...it doesn't make the animal any more dead than a ' lesser ' caliber.

If I remember correctly a professional elephant hunter by the name of Bell used many different rifles and finally decided that the 6.5 x 55 swede was the best for elephant hunting. The last time I checked an elk was smaller than an elephant.....

If you like shooting a super delux wizz bang ultra short super long death ray magnum then by all means keep using it and have a great hunt.

However, the elk will not be impressed.

a .308 win 180gr bonded bullet in the lungs will do the same as any of the fad magnums. AND most of us can shoot one better than the magnum.
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Old May 23, 2006, 09:52 PM   #41
DobermansDoItGoofy
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It's hard to beat a .308/30-06...

I saw a nifty and beautiful little Rem.7 full stock mannlicher style for about $1400 in .350 Rem... I looked up the ballistics of the 350 Rem. and noted the 20 inch barrel of the Model 7....and thought that I'd struck gold ie. the 350 Rem...would give a little more ooomph in the short range... I liked the .350 Rem...but the more I looked at it and the prospects of having to reload it...and the cost vs. benefit...the more I realized 'again' that the little .308 is hard to beat. The .308/30-06's are not flashy corvettes or porsches - but just honest muscle cars that get the job done.
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Old May 23, 2006, 10:51 PM   #42
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The .308/30-06's are not flashy corvettes or porsches - but just honest muscle cars that get the job done.
They're the Chevelle/Impala SS-396's that surprise the elitists with their performance.
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Old May 26, 2006, 04:23 PM   #43
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They're the Chevelle/Impala SS-396's that surprise the elitists with their performance.
Here, here!!

Quote:
the little .308 is hard to beat.
The BIG 30-06 can do it!
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Old June 18, 2006, 11:35 PM   #44
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308 for ELK?

I've shot ELK with .270 Win, 308 Win, 7MM MAG, 300 Win Mag. Every one went down with one shot within 50 yards. Ranges were from 50 yards to 275 yards. If I was going for a big bull, I would opt for the 7mm mag or 300's. Killing a cow vs a big bull is a bit different at any range. At 200 yards or under, any cartidge I mentioned or many others will suffice. I've hunted with a fellow who always hunts for cows (meat hunter) and he only takes head shots and under 100 yards. He loves hunting the timber. He has used a 30-30 succesfully at times. Shot placement over rides muzzle energy. Good shooting!
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Old June 19, 2006, 06:17 AM   #45
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338 win mag..... belived by many to be the best elk caliber ever. but a 308 would work fine.
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