Ultra-light copper solids

mapsjanhere · October 6, 2009, 10:37 AM

I found a supplier in Germany that makes extremely light copper solid bullets, e. g. 140 gr .338s. The shipping always stopped me from buying, but I'm flying over there next month, and was thinking about getting some. Does anyone have experience with these kind of bullets? They advertise very straight ballistics, with zeroing a .338 WM at 230 yards.

Magnum Wheel Man · October 6, 2009, 10:50 AM

My only expirience here has been with Barnes banded solids in boat tail spitzer point configuration for both 270 & .224... nothing bigger... I do like both of those bullets alot for reloading though...

mapsjanhere · October 6, 2009, 04:20 PM

The Barnes solids are standard weight, e. g. 250 gr in .338. These are 40% lighter.

bfoosh006 · October 6, 2009, 08:39 PM

Interesting bullets,while I haven't heard of them, ...I'd be interested in looking at a web link.

mapsjanhere · October 6, 2009, 10:40 PM

http://saxtech.eu/8,5-mm/338-WM-KJG.htm
sorry it's in German, but as they say, a picture is worth a 1000 words

impalacustom · October 7, 2009, 12:22 AM

I have seen and read about them. You need faster twist in a rifle to shoot these because of the length of the bullet. They have super high BC's and a super high price as well. They are for target shooting mainly though.

SL1 · October 7, 2009, 07:26 AM

That site is interesting. You can "translate" it by pushing a button in Google, but it is a literal translation, so it comes out with VERY odd sentence structure.

The bullets look like they are solid copper with large internal cavities, so there could be some concentricity issues for accuracy that don't occur with solid copper bullets. But, the site showes pictures that make the bullets appear to be very accurate (of course).

The interesting thing to me is the exterior dimensions, which have very thin driving bands around a bore-diameter body. I would think that this would keep pressures down and allow higher velocities. But, I wonder how easy it would be to mess-up those bands when seating the bullets in a case.

I am a little interested, because I have a Contender in .30 Herrett with a unusually fast twist and about 0.3" of freebore. It would probably be happy with an unusually long but light bullet. So, does anybody know of a U.S. source for them?

With regard to hunting, the site showes several game animals taken with these bullets.

SL1

**Unclenick** · October 7, 2009, 10:43 AM

I looked at the specs. I don't see anything outstanding or defficient about the .361 BC, given the projectile shape. The tip probably takes up enough room to account for the 138.8 grain weight. The stability, at a gyroscopic stability factor that meets Harold Vaughn's or Don Miller's estimates for best precision on a target (s=1.4 or 1.5, respectively) requires the barrel twist be about 14" at 3500 fps. The common 10" .338 WM twist will give about s=2.75 at 3500 fps, which approaches the upper limit of s=3, that Sierra techs like to use, but doesn't exceed it. Should be good to go.

You'll need relatively fast powders (compared to what you usually use) with this light bullet to avoid secondary pressure spikes. Texas gunsmith Charlie Sisk has blown the muzzles off some .338's using slow powders with light bullets. QuickLOAD suggests IMR3031 would do quite well with that light bullet, but YMMV.

bfoosh006 · October 7, 2009, 07:24 PM

http://translate.google.com/translat...istory_state0=

Translated.

October 6, 2009, 10:37 AM	#1
mapsjanhere Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Location: Albuquerque Posts: 2,832	Ultra-light copper solids I found a supplier in Germany that makes extremely light copper solid bullets, e. g. 140 gr .338s. The shipping always stopped me from buying, but I'm flying over there next month, and was thinking about getting some. Does anyone have experience with these kind of bullets? They advertise very straight ballistics, with zeroing a .338 WM at 230 yards. __________________ I used to love being able to hit hard at 1000 yards. As I get older I find hitting a mini ram at 200 yards with the 22 oddly more satisfying.

October 6, 2009, 10:50 AM	#2
Magnum Wheel Man Senior Member Join Date: July 26, 2006 Location: Southern Minnesota Posts: 9,333	My only expirience here has been with Barnes banded solids in boat tail spitzer point configuration for both 270 & .224... nothing bigger... I do like both of those bullets alot for reloading though... __________________ In life you either make dust or eat dust...

October 6, 2009, 04:20 PM	#3
mapsjanhere Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Location: Albuquerque Posts: 2,832	The Barnes solids are standard weight, e. g. 250 gr in .338. These are 40% lighter. __________________ I used to love being able to hit hard at 1000 yards. As I get older I find hitting a mini ram at 200 yards with the 22 oddly more satisfying.

October 6, 2009, 10:40 PM	#5
mapsjanhere Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Location: Albuquerque Posts: 2,832	http://saxtech.eu/8,5-mm/338-WM-KJG.htm sorry it's in German, but as they say, a picture is worth a 1000 words __________________ I used to love being able to hit hard at 1000 yards. As I get older I find hitting a mini ram at 200 yards with the 22 oddly more satisfying.

October 7, 2009, 10:43 AM	#8
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,063	I looked at the specs. I don't see anything outstanding or defficient about the .361 BC, given the projectile shape. The tip probably takes up enough room to account for the 138.8 grain weight. The stability, at a gyroscopic stability factor that meets Harold Vaughn's or Don Miller's estimates for best precision on a target (s=1.4 or 1.5, respectively) requires the barrel twist be about 14" at 3500 fps. The common 10" .338 WM twist will give about s=2.75 at 3500 fps, which approaches the upper limit of s=3, that Sierra techs like to use, but doesn't exceed it. Should be good to go. You'll need relatively fast powders (compared to what you usually use) with this light bullet to avoid secondary pressure spikes. Texas gunsmith Charlie Sisk has blown the muzzles off some .338's using slow powders with light bullets. QuickLOAD suggests IMR3031 would do quite well with that light bullet, but YMMV. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

October 6, 2009, 08:39 PM	#4
bfoosh006 Senior Member Join Date: February 17, 2009 Posts: 1,089	Interesting bullets,while I haven't heard of them, ...I'd be interested in looking at a web link.

October 7, 2009, 12:22 AM	#6
impalacustom Senior Member Join Date: January 26, 2009 Posts: 492	I have seen and read about them. You need faster twist in a rifle to shoot these because of the length of the bullet. They have super high BC's and a super high price as well. They are for target shooting mainly though.

October 7, 2009, 07:26 AM	#7
SL1 Senior Member Join Date: November 8, 2007 Posts: 2,001	That site is interesting. You can "translate" it by pushing a button in Google, but it is a literal translation, so it comes out with VERY odd sentence structure. The bullets look like they are solid copper with large internal cavities, so there could be some concentricity issues for accuracy that don't occur with solid copper bullets. But, the site showes pictures that make the bullets appear to be very accurate (of course). The interesting thing to me is the exterior dimensions, which have very thin driving bands around a bore-diameter body. I would think that this would keep pressures down and allow higher velocities. But, I wonder how easy it would be to mess-up those bands when seating the bullets in a case. I am a little interested, because I have a Contender in .30 Herrett with a unusually fast twist and about 0.3" of freebore. It would probably be happy with an unusually long but light bullet. So, does anybody know of a U.S. source for them? With regard to hunting, the site showes several game animals taken with these bullets. SL1

October 7, 2009, 07:24 PM	#9
bfoosh006 Senior Member Join Date: February 17, 2009 Posts: 1,089	http://translate.google.com/translat...istory_state0= Translated.