357 mag loads using 2400 and 125gr XTP's

awaveritt · July 11, 2011, 01:13 PM

My Speer #14 Manual lists the following 357Mag loads for 125gr JHP w/ Alliant 2400 Powder:
Starting: 16.5
Maximum: 17.5

So, I split the middle and loaded up 50 rds of Hornady125 XTP-HP at 17.0 grains thinking these would be within safe limits.

Then I peeked at the Hornady #7 manual in my LGS and read where Hornady's maximum load for the 125gr. XTP-HP is only 16.9gr. putting me .1 grain above their maximum. My COAL is 1.587 and bullets are firmly crimped.

These are intended for my Ruger New Vaqueros and a Marlin 1894c. Does anyone think this load is too hot for these firearms?

recarga · July 11, 2011, 01:27 PM

I do follow speer and hornady I use the speer load more times because it has given me
The best results,
Now one thing you need,that is to watch what kind of primer you use, on the 2700 hornady does not tells you to use regular (non magnum) but the speer does, 2700 is a very hot powder that will work better with the regular primer.

awaveritt · July 11, 2011, 01:30 PM

Quote:

Now one thing you need,that is to watch what kind of primer you use

Yes, thanks. I should have mentioned that they are loaded with CCI500 standard primers and new, unfired R-P brass.

recarga · July 11, 2011, 01:41 PM

that is my piggy load deadly up to 100yds. Have fun N be safe

Shootest · July 11, 2011, 01:55 PM

Quote:

These are intended for my Ruger New Vaqueros and a Marlin 1894c. Does anyone think this load is too hot for these firearms?

NO, not at all. Lyman lists 17.7 as max. I always load 17.1g for my Blackhawk and Python.

**Unclenick** · July 11, 2011, 03:17 PM

Shootest,

I understand the newer Vaquero is not as strong as a Blackhawk. Someone else chime in on this, as I only own a Blackhawk myself, but I heard some changes in the Vaquero were made to lighten it. I just haven't verified that.

Awaveritt,

This serves as a reminder that powder and bullet weight aren't the only things you need to match to get similar performance from a listed load. Primer and case and bullet and bullet seating depth all need to match up, too. But if you want really similar pressure and velocity, so do your chamber and bore dimensions have to match the test gun's, and that's something you usually cannot arrange to do.

An important rule you violated (at least to my thinking) is never to start in the middle of a listed load range. 99 times out of 100 you'll get away with it, but twice in my life I've run into listed starting loads that proved to be maximum loads in the particular gun I was loading for and am glad I went no higher.

In your case I would get some additional cases or pull bullets from 10 of your existing loads, then use the Hornady data because it is Hornady's bullet. The Speer book has data for their own 125 grain bullet, but it isn't the XTP. Different brands can have different lengths or different jacket thicknesses, so they may not behave the same even if they weigh the same. I would go back to the Hornady book and go up through the loads they list from 13.9 grains to 16.9 grains in .3 grain steps, while watching for pressure signs at each step. It'll be good practice for you. Assuming you arrive at 16.9 with no pressure signs, then 17.0 is likely to be fine. When you get more experience you can think about going outside manual limits, but early on I wouldn't push it.

CherokeeT · July 11, 2011, 04:40 PM

Load some with starting load data and see how they work. Work up to 17.0 gr before shooting the ones you have.

July 11, 2011, 01:27 PM	#2
recarga Member Join Date: July 8, 2011 Location: big TX,USA Posts: 45	I do follow speer and hornady I use the speer load more times because it has given me The best results, Now one thing you need,that is to watch what kind of primer you use, on the 2700 hornady does not tells you to use regular (non magnum) but the speer does, 2700 is a very hot powder that will work better with the regular primer. __________________ IT IS BETTER TO DIE ON YOUR FEET THAN TO LIVE ON YOUR KNEES.

July 11, 2011, 01:41 PM	#4
recarga Member Join Date: July 8, 2011 Location: big TX,USA Posts: 45	that is my piggy load deadly up to 100yds. Have fun N be safe __________________ IT IS BETTER TO DIE ON YOUR FEET THAN TO LIVE ON YOUR KNEES.

July 11, 2011, 03:17 PM	#6
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,061	Shootest, I understand the newer Vaquero is not as strong as a Blackhawk. Someone else chime in on this, as I only own a Blackhawk myself, but I heard some changes in the Vaquero were made to lighten it. I just haven't verified that. Awaveritt, This serves as a reminder that powder and bullet weight aren't the only things you need to match to get similar performance from a listed load. Primer and case and bullet and bullet seating depth all need to match up, too. But if you want really similar pressure and velocity, so do your chamber and bore dimensions have to match the test gun's, and that's something you usually cannot arrange to do. An important rule you violated (at least to my thinking) is never to start in the middle of a listed load range. 99 times out of 100 you'll get away with it, but twice in my life I've run into listed starting loads that proved to be maximum loads in the particular gun I was loading for and am glad I went no higher. In your case I would get some additional cases or pull bullets from 10 of your existing loads, then use the Hornady data because it is Hornady's bullet. The Speer book has data for their own 125 grain bullet, but it isn't the XTP. Different brands can have different lengths or different jacket thicknesses, so they may not behave the same even if they weigh the same. I would go back to the Hornady book and go up through the loads they list from 13.9 grains to 16.9 grains in .3 grain steps, while watching for pressure signs at each step. It'll be good practice for you. Assuming you arrive at 16.9 with no pressure signs, then 17.0 is likely to be fine. When you get more experience you can think about going outside manual limits, but early on I wouldn't push it. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

July 11, 2011, 01:13 PM	#1
awaveritt Senior Member Join Date: December 30, 2008 Location: Central Texas Posts: 259	357 mag loads using 2400 and 125gr XTP's My Speer #14 Manual lists the following 357Mag loads for 125gr JHP w/ Alliant 2400 Powder: Starting: 16.5 Maximum: 17.5 So, I split the middle and loaded up 50 rds of Hornady125 XTP-HP at 17.0 grains thinking these would be within safe limits. Then I peeked at the Hornady #7 manual in my LGS and read where Hornady's maximum load for the 125gr. XTP-HP is only 16.9gr. putting me .1 grain above their maximum. My COAL is 1.587 and bullets are firmly crimped. These are intended for my Ruger New Vaqueros and a Marlin 1894c. Does anyone think this load is too hot for these firearms?

July 11, 2011, 04:40 PM	#7
CherokeeT Senior Member Join Date: April 23, 2008 Location: Medina, Ohio Posts: 273	Load some with starting load data and see how they work. Work up to 17.0 gr before shooting the ones you have. __________________ God Bless America US Army, NRA Endowment TSRA Life, SASS