Gun free zones and empty holsters

[Lohman446]

In the past I have often simply unclipped my holster, put it and the pistol in the locked compartment in my truck, and entered the gun free zones I had to for various reasons. At other times, knowing I was going to be in a gun free zone, I have simply opted to leave my pistol at home.

The other day I went into the school to pick up my daughter. I simply removed my pistol, unloaded it, and locked it in the truck. As I was standing at the school I thought how stupid this was that I had an empty holster. Further as we are talking a bunch of "defenseless" kids with no clear sign of retreat it occurred to me that I, and whatever improvised weapon I could find, would have to attempt to do something. Maybe the various coaches, teachers, and administrators have had similar thoughts before they actually engaged and active shooter.

I have made it clear to my family that in the unlikely event such occurs that it is their duty to point to the empty holster on my belt often and repeatedly because such resistance is likely to be fatal.

So why am I discussing this? It seems that those most vocally favoring gun control have gotten very good at making sure "no tragedy goes wasted" and "our" response has been "a good guy with a gun..." My challenge: make certain when you do enter gun free zones, for whatever reason, it is clear in the event of an incident that you were unarmed only because of the law. An empty holster seems to me to make that statement better then leaving the holster and firearm in the truck. If these tragedies are going the threaten our individual rights maybe we should learn the lessons of the "use" of them.

Edit for clarification: I am not advocating for an empty and visible holster. Simply not removing your concealed holster which would, by its nature, remain concealed. The only time it would be evident you had an empty holster would be after the fact. I'm not advertising the fact that there may be a gun locked in my vehicle.

[WW2]

Bad idea! If you were in an active shooter situation, the responding LEO's would likely consider you as a suspect that ditched his firearm. People pointing at your empty holster would likely scream "Look, he is the shooter!"

In this day and age, kids are getting suspended for chewing their Pop Tarts in to the shape of a gun. An empty holster can only cause grief. I recommend that you put the holster and gun in the lock box before entering a gun free zone.

[Lohman446]

I should clarify: I don't mean wearing a visible empty holster as a sign of protest. My holster is concealed by nature of normally carrying a concealed handgun. No one there is going to know its on me unless I am killed by an active shooter (an extremely unlikely event). If I overcome an active shooter with an improvised weapon I doubt the empty holster is going to be an issue.

[Rachen]

Bad idea! If you were in an active shooter situation, the responding LEO's would likely consider you as a suspect that ditched his firearm. People pointing at your empty holster would likely scream "Look, he is the shooter!"

In this day and age, kids are getting suspended for chewing their Pop Tarts in to the shape of a gun. An empty holster can only cause grief. I recommend that you put the holster and gun in the lock box before entering a gun free zone.

Yep, exactly. These days, I prefer to carry concealed and I mean completely concealed, as in not drawing any attention to myself which may reveal that I am potentially carrying a firearm or any other weapon. With the exception of an NRA plate which I sometimes display on my work truck, I don't like to give off any impression that I am packing heat. Firstly, for the above quoted reason. Less likely of me being singled out as a potential perpetrator in the event of the fecal matter hitting the blades of the rotating air-distributor. Secondly, by keeping a low profile gives me the advantage in the case of an active shooter situation, or common mugging or street crime where I may be in the position to respond decisively. Not paying attention to "that man in the old jacket sitting in the corner of the restaurant" means that an active shooter or armed mugger/any criminal might just be plugged from behind by that "man sitting in the corner" because he failed to spot a potential deterrence to his actions beforehand.

There had been a time in the past when I have supported open carrying and have done so myself. "Oh look at me ladies, I am a COWBOY!". But over time, tactical and situational necessity have overruled any macho or romantic notion associated with open carrying for me.

[In The Ten Ring]

I know of at least one case where a man entered a store intent on an armed robbery but saw an open carrier and left. He cited that event as "turning his life around." I can copy and paste what I read on that, if I saved it.

There is an empty holster group active on college campuses.

[Evan Thomas]

I've deleted several posts; the failings of school systems are off-topic here.

[Glenn E. Meyer]

Evan said not to go off topic. Please don't.

[rickyrick]

I am pretty sure that having anything that looks like a gun to the wrong person could bring you a lot of grief at a minimum, but it could be downright dangerous.

[Lohman446]

I am failing to communicate the concealed nature of the empty holster. It’s concealed when a gun is in it. It will be equally or more concealed empty

[rickyrick]

I reread the original post and I get what you are saying now.

[Sevens]

Got my license to carry in 2008 and way back then (and still today) I could not wrap my head around the thought process where the State of Ohio has considered me personally and made the decision to allow me to legally carry a concealed handgun out in the world, in my car, on my lawn, in a park, in a grocery store, HOWEVER, goodness gracious, cannot let the same man walk in to a school where his children are.

That's ludicrous and cannot be explained rationally.

[5whiskey]

First off, the man is not advocating that you walk around with a holster in plain view. Its a great post and we are in the weeds hyperventilating about "OMG don't scare people with a holster in the open." Not at all the spirit, or intent, of his post.

Second off, walking around with an empty gun holster, anywhere, may get dirty looks or unwanted attention but will have no legal recourse. I know of no law, anywhere, that outlaws a piece of leather or kydex appurtenance hanging on your belt, whether it be designed to hold a cell phone or a gun in place. Even in a... Gasp... School.

I'm not advocating walking around OCing an empty holster, but I also offer no tongue lashings for anyone who would.

[WW2]

This is the line from post #1 that I was commenting about:

I have made it clear to my family that in the unlikely event such occurs that it is their duty to point to the empty holster on my belt often and repeatedly because such resistance is likely to be fatal.

This implies that the holster is clearly visible. If it is concealed, I would instruct my family to say nothing.

[Lohman446]

After the fact. If I’m killed in a gun free zone with an empty holster on my belt I want my family to point it out. Over and over again. And blame some of the casualties on my being disarmed by the law

[TailGator]

I have left my IWB holster on while disarming to go into a prohibited area. I thought I was doing it for convenience; I didn't realize I was making a political statement.

To give you a serious answer, I prefer to reholster by putting the pistol in the holster, then returning the holster to my belt. My next choice is to return the pistol to my holster while it is on my belt and I am standing up. My least favorite is to return the pistol to the holster while wearing it seated. Unfortunately, the latter is the way you have to do it if you keep the holster on and return to your car in a public area after visiting a place that doesn't allow carry. For that reason, I remove the holster. I suppose you could remove the holster when you got back to the car in order to make your statement, but since your statement requires your death, I hope you don't make it.

[Lohman446]

The chances of it ever happening where I am are extremely low. Though I did graduate from CMU

[Koda94]

I get what the OP is saying and in a dark sad way hes right, it would make a huge statement.... if the media actually reported it.

I'm not certain though it would get thru to the antis, they are literally appalled at the idea that a non-professional armed citizen has the ability to defend themselves with a firearm in any scenario especially a mas shooting. That kind of logic cant be reasoned with.

[hagar]

I would rather carry with no holster, than carry an empty holster..

[DaleA]

--the antis, they are literally appalled at the idea that a non-professional armed citizen has the ability to defend themselves with a firearm in any scenario especially a mas shooting. That kind of logic cant be reasoned with.

This ^.

[brian33x51]

The best you can to obey an immoral law is to go with a quickclip kydex holster and remove the whole system. I'm not technically sure how legal it is to carry pepper spray onto school property but I'm sure you wouldn't get in as much trouble having some with you.