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Old October 24, 2016, 12:21 PM   #1
Join Date: April 14, 2010
Posts: 36
Anschutz 9mm RF 1365 Gartenflinten proof load

It's shoots a 9mm Flobert brass cartridge. Proof House was located in Ulm w/date of 70. Though many of these single shot rifles were small, considered boys size, this model is full sized sporting the eagle N proof on 25.5" brl.

The lowly 9mm "double charge" Flobert brass cartridge offered by Fiocchi contains a quarter oz load, 109.375 grn, of #6, 7.5, 8, 9 or 10 coming out at 600 fps for a ME of 87 ft lbs. By contrast a CCI .22 SHP at 27 grains obtains 73 ft lbs ME.

I'm not seeking a mini-mauser rnd, but the arm bears the German nitro proof. My limited research found a statement proclaiming that to be two proof loads fired at 30% more than the accepted maximum load for said calibre. No such notation on what either load may be.

Granted, it fires the Flobert 9mm, however when compared to other 9mm Flobert arms the build is more robust. So, forty-six year ago in an Ulm proof house this arm was approved for nitrocellulose-based gunpowder as the N stamp has represented since 1952.

But, how much charge under how much load? The simple bolt action, as other 9mm Flobert arms, certainly wasn't intended to hold heavy charges/loads. One & quarter ME is only 108.75. I'd bet the farm on that though it isn't quite where I'd like the round to be.

Yet, I wonder if a ME around 120-130 ft lbs wouldn't be safe. The Fiocchi offering X1.5[126 ft lbs ME]. Perhaps 5/16 oz load, 136.718 grain, 640-660 fps for 124-132 ft lbs ME. Still mild report w/ 1.25X more shot for better coverage. Or the same 1/4 oz at 720-740 fps for a wee bit more punch

There's precious little room in the thin brass cartridge. If they were centerfire they could be fire formed and reloaded easy enough w/bit extra volume. The entire bell at the base contains primer/powder/wad though I haven't the foggiest on type/weight/density of powder or how much wad.

Yet, I'm putting the cart before the horse. How do I determine the proof load of this arm? I know this model was made at least into the 80's. Even if I could round up a contact w/same Ulm proof house I've no clue if they would have records on file or share them.

As is 'tis somewhat as looking at the 38 S&W and 32 Long current offerings wondering how much they've been watered down. For fear of someone loading a BP era arm.
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Old October 25, 2016, 01:14 AM   #2
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Well, CIP pressure standards are available online here, and they say 830 bar max average operating pressure, so just under 12,000 psi, same as other shotshells. My biggest questions about reloading them would be:
* how are you going to reload a rimfire case,
* why would you even want to try, considering the challenges with pressure testing and load development and the lack of wads, shot cups, or other components
* since commercial ammo is available, why bother?

Like its name says, it is a garden flintlock, designed for shooting marauding mice or perhaps cantankerous cottontails. Your energy calculations are not applicable to shotshells, where you generally measure the energy of each pellet, which in your case would be about 1/4 as much as the same pellet in a 12 ga or 20 ga since the velocity is about 1/2 (just that you have a lot fewer pellets).
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Last edited by Scorch; October 25, 2016 at 01:20 AM.
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