How do you fire a warning shot?

Doug.38PR · November 18, 2005, 02:59 PM

I have heard a sheriff deputy say once that police cannot shoot someone running from them, unless it is at night, unless they first call out to them once or twice, and then fire a warning shot in the air and then shoot them. Now, warning shots have their place I'm sure although the way they are required today on police seems a bit absurd as between the time it takes for you to call out again and again and fire a warning shot the criminal has put more distance between you and him making him a much harder target to hit and increasing the chance of missing him and hitting something or someone

else. (remember the scene in It's A Wonderful Life in the end when alternate universe Burt the Cop pulls out is OP and yells "Stand Back!" and opens fire on George Bailey ACROSS THE TOWN SQUARE where people are walking all over the place

) But as far as warning shots themselves go, how would you do it safely. Firing it in the air, as I understand police are allowed and even required to do, seems to be dangerous to me as that bullet has to come down somewhere (or one someone

). Seems to me it would be better placed in the back of the criminal. Perhaps a warning shot fired into the ground would be better...then again, in urban areas there is so little actual ground around you can't really do that. You certainly can't fire it into the concrete as it will ricochet into something (or someone

). So unless I am in a front or back yard or in a fieldor wooded area, I really can't employ firing it into the ground. I could fire it into an object like a car or a tree, but as far as a car goes, that is damage to property. And a tree, you have to take aim and even then it could ricochet.

So what about warning shots? In my view they are a bad option (or requirement) for police and an equally dangerous option for the rest of us.

Radiki · November 18, 2005, 03:21 PM

warning shots are a waste of ammo and will usually do nothing but get you in trouble. Even if fired into grass, it could bounce off a sprinkler head, rock, muffler, cat or anything else you don't see. Also, you just fired your weapon in a public area, since you did not hit a target that was considered an immenient threat then you have surely violated many laws and comprimised public saftey. There should only be a verbal warning, then the warning shot is the one in center mass, warning the BG that a second is coming.

CraigJS · November 18, 2005, 03:25 PM

Warning shot into the air? Where's the bullet going to land.. That violates one of the first rules of safely firing any gun, know your back stop! Call out once or twice, then a warning shot, then shoot them as they run away? Sounds like a lazy cop out in a field somewhere, at night, again violating possible safe gun handling know your target. (harder as distance increases) Glad their not on our police force!!

Seven High · November 18, 2005, 03:25 PM

At the law enforcement agencys that I am familiar with warning shots are forbidden by department general orders. This is for obivious reasons.

dave_in_delaware · November 18, 2005, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doug.38PR

I have heard a sheriff deputy say once that police cannot shoot someone running from them, unless it is at night, unless they first call out to them once or twice, and then fire a warning shot in the air and then shoot them.

Last I heard, it was illegal for anyone to shoot someone in the back, regardless of any warnings, at night, or being some sort of LEO, when they are RUNNING AWAY FROM YOU. Aren't we taught to only draw our weapons IF and only IF we feel our lives are in grave danger? Someone running away from you isn't a threat anymore. So, if you shoot them, regardless of warning shots, nighttime, etc., you'll go to jail.

Unless I've missed something, like this person shot you twice first, then ran?

Warning shots can go anywhere, and can be dangerous to people around the problem. The more urban the area is, the worse the problems a warning shot can cause. From my readings, warning shots are a big no-no.

Glenn E. Meyer · November 18, 2005, 03:35 PM

You can shoot someone who is fleeing from YOU if you are positive they are on the way to do more immediate harm. So a dude comes at you with an AX, you challenge him and he turns and runs howling towards the school bus.

Might be oversimplifying the doctrine but I think that's it.

Warning shots are a universal no - no - unless you get the new IPOD which attaches to the rail on your 1911 and plays guns shots and the ever popular racking of your shotgun.

Doug.38PR · November 18, 2005, 03:40 PM

Okay, everyone seems to agree with me , warning shots bad idea.

well, it used to be I think before the lawyers brought in all these so called civil-rights for those poor not-so innocent criminals, you could shoot a perpetrator as he was running away (at least police could). A robbery or violent crime was committed Police wanted to question some thug, they take off running, they have obviously done something wrong...otherwise why run. If they spot someone mugging someone and they take off, popum one if they don't halt. It makes sense to me. the police can't just let them get away, can't always run after them, what if they are faster runners than the cop, what if the cop does run them down, tackles them and they pull a knife and stick the cop. as they are running, they put other innocent people in danger while they are loose, best to just stop them there wounding them possible but stop them never the less.

threefivesevenmag · November 18, 2005, 03:42 PM

That was very fun Glenn. If another new iPod or iTool comes out in the next month...I'll just have to buy stock in Macintosh.

Warning shots don't exist. Never do them. Not an option unless signaling for help when lost in an abundance of wilderness. Even then, not a great option.

You can shoot someone who is fleeing, as Glenn pointed out. I believe you would have to have witnessed them do an extremely violent crime or murder in order to do so and that you believe they are capable or will repeat their actions. It's a huge if question.

As civilians, I believe witnessing an axe murder would be quite rare, although that would surely be grounds for lethal force.

They should make a tactical iPod. I'm sold on it.

Lion In Winter · November 18, 2005, 04:03 PM

Always remember to put a finger in the ear nearest the gun.

chrisandclauida2 · November 18, 2005, 05:53 PM

You Dont.

12-34hom · November 18, 2005, 08:02 PM

That's odd... all the warning shots i've ever fired, not one has ever bounced off a cat.

But that's just me.

12-34hom

Blackwater OPS · November 18, 2005, 08:36 PM

LOL, bounce off a cat, must those ninja cats, my friend has one of those.

smince · November 18, 2005, 08:47 PM

A friend who was an embassy guard in a war-torn country said SOP was:
(In the event of encountering an insurgent)
1. Fire warning shot
2. Yell "HALT!"
3. Engage BG

Actual sequence:
1. Shoot enemy
2. Yell "HALT!"
3. Then fire warning shot

Our training in the USAF clearly stated (as well as signs all over the base): WARNING SHOTS ARE NOT AUTHORIZED!

Probably afraid we might accidently shoot down a KC135

k9lwt · November 18, 2005, 09:12 PM

You can't fire warning shots-if you fire, deadly force must be justified.

You can shoot a fleeing felon if you have probable cause that the person will do imminent harm if he contiunes to flee- screaming freak with a gun, knife, etc.

This in MA.

model 25 · November 18, 2005, 09:20 PM

Never pull a gun unless you are in personal danger and can prove so in court, then when you do put two to the body as a warning then one to the head if BG fails to heed that warning.

IMHO that is all the warning the criminals should get.

25

rapier144 · November 18, 2005, 09:23 PM

What the hell is a warning shot?

rapier144 · November 18, 2005, 09:29 PM

O those are the shots you missed

exoduster16 · November 18, 2005, 09:49 PM

There is only need to fire one shot: the one that impacts the BG right between the eyes. His/her/its warning is the sound of the gunshot.

IZinterrogator · November 19, 2005, 12:02 AM

When I was in Bosnia, the ROE called for a warning shot. When we did our convoy brief every morning before rolling out for a mission, the team sergeant always briefed that the warning shot would be aimed COM, and the real shot would be aimed at the spot where the BG was lying on the ground bleeding. Best convoy briefs I ever got.

BradS · November 19, 2005, 12:21 AM

Warning Shot ?

Only in the movies.

Oct_97 · November 19, 2005, 07:26 AM

Was that Deputy's name Barney Fife?

Weeg · November 19, 2005, 10:55 AM

Maybe it was the guy from "Loaded Weapon"

"Ah-ah-ah...I know what you're thinkin'...Did he fire 173 shots or 174?...Well, do you feel lucky?"

USP45usp · November 19, 2005, 11:05 AM

IZ beat me to it.

Warning shot = COM

If they (the BG) don't heed the the warning, then the real shots go COM and Head if able

.

Wayne

mvpel · November 19, 2005, 11:28 AM

The thing is, under the law a warning shot is usually considered to be the use of deadly force, and if you're not justified in shooting the BG COM, then you're not justified in firing a warning shot.

Radiki · November 19, 2005, 11:44 AM

Quote:

LOL, bounce off a cat, must those ninja cats, my friend has one of those.

Ninja cats are pretty durable creatures.... and you have to kill them nine times

catniplegalized.jpg

cat.jpg

You have to watch out for those cats!!!

November 18, 2005, 02:59 PM	#1
Doug.38PR Junior member Join Date: January 18, 2005 Posts: 3,298	How do you fire a warning shot? I have heard a sheriff deputy say once that police cannot shoot someone running from them, unless it is at night, unless they first call out to them once or twice, and then fire a warning shot in the air and then shoot them. Now, warning shots have their place I'm sure although the way they are required today on police seems a bit absurd as between the time it takes for you to call out again and again and fire a warning shot the criminal has put more distance between you and him making him a much harder target to hit and increasing the chance of missing him and hitting something or someone else. (remember the scene in It's A Wonderful Life in the end when alternate universe Burt the Cop pulls out is OP and yells "Stand Back!" and opens fire on George Bailey ACROSS THE TOWN SQUARE where people are walking all over the place ) But as far as warning shots themselves go, how would you do it safely. Firing it in the air, as I understand police are allowed and even required to do, seems to be dangerous to me as that bullet has to come down somewhere (or one someone ). Seems to me it would be better placed in the back of the criminal. Perhaps a warning shot fired into the ground would be better...then again, in urban areas there is so little actual ground around you can't really do that. You certainly can't fire it into the concrete as it will ricochet into something (or someone ). So unless I am in a front or back yard or in a fieldor wooded area, I really can't employ firing it into the ground. I could fire it into an object like a car or a tree, but as far as a car goes, that is damage to property. And a tree, you have to take aim and even then it could ricochet. So what about warning shots? In my view they are a bad option (or requirement) for police and an equally dangerous option for the rest of us.

November 18, 2005, 03:25 PM	#4
Seven High Senior Member Join Date: December 11, 2004 Posts: 650	Warning Shots At the law enforcement agencys that I am familiar with warning shots are forbidden by department general orders. This is for obivious reasons.

November 18, 2005, 03:35 PM	#6
Glenn E. Meyer Senior Member Join Date: November 17, 2000 Posts: 20,064	You can shoot someone who is fleeing from YOU if you are positive they are on the way to do more immediate harm. So a dude comes at you with an AX, you challenge him and he turns and runs howling towards the school bus. Might be oversimplifying the doctrine but I think that's it. Warning shots are a universal no - no - unless you get the new IPOD which attaches to the rail on your 1911 and plays guns shots and the ever popular racking of your shotgun. __________________ NRA, TSRA, IDPA, NTI, Polite Soc. - Aux Armes, Citoyens

November 18, 2005, 08:02 PM	#11
12-34hom Senior Member Join Date: June 8, 1999 Location: Iowa - northeastern Posts: 1,810	That's odd... all the warning shots i've ever fired, not one has ever bounced off a cat. But that's just me. 12-34hom __________________ This is my rifle. There are many like it, but this one is mine. My rifle is my best friend, it is my life. I must master itas i master my life.Without me my rifle is useless, without my rifle i am useless. I must fire my rifle true. I must shoot straighter than my enemy who is trying to kill me. I must shoot him before he shoots me. I Will. Before God i swear this creed. My rifle and myself are defenders of my country. We are masters of our enemy. We are saviours of my life. So be it until there is no enemy, but peace. Amen.

November 18, 2005, 08:36 PM	#12
Blackwater OPS Senior Member Join Date: September 11, 2005 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 1,152	LOL, bounce off a cat, must those ninja cats, my friend has one of those. __________________ "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." -Ben Franklin Spc. Jeremy M. Campbell Died 9/1/2005 and the best DS ever MSG Matthew Ritz Died 11.23.2005 matthewritz.com For those who have had to fight for it, Life holds a special meaning that the protected will never know. (\__/) (='.'=) Someone set us up the bunny! (")_(")

November 18, 2005, 03:21 PM	#2
Radiki Senior Member Join Date: February 22, 2005 Posts: 145	warning shots are a waste of ammo and will usually do nothing but get you in trouble. Even if fired into grass, it could bounce off a sprinkler head, rock, muffler, cat or anything else you don't see. Also, you just fired your weapon in a public area, since you did not hit a target that was considered an immenient threat then you have surely violated many laws and comprimised public saftey. There should only be a verbal warning, then the warning shot is the one in center mass, warning the BG that a second is coming.

November 18, 2005, 03:25 PM	#3
CraigJS Senior Member Join Date: July 31, 2005 Posts: 372	Warning shot into the air? Where's the bullet going to land.. That violates one of the first rules of safely firing any gun, know your back stop! Call out once or twice, then a warning shot, then shoot them as they run away? Sounds like a lazy cop out in a field somewhere, at night, again violating possible safe gun handling know your target. (harder as distance increases) Glad their not on our police force!!

November 18, 2005, 03:40 PM	#7
Doug.38PR Junior member Join Date: January 18, 2005 Posts: 3,298	Okay, everyone seems to agree with me , warning shots bad idea. well, it used to be I think before the lawyers brought in all these so called civil-rights for those poor not-so innocent criminals, you could shoot a perpetrator as he was running away (at least police could). A robbery or violent crime was committed Police wanted to question some thug, they take off running, they have obviously done something wrong...otherwise why run. If they spot someone mugging someone and they take off, popum one if they don't halt. It makes sense to me. the police can't just let them get away, can't always run after them, what if they are faster runners than the cop, what if the cop does run them down, tackles them and they pull a knife and stick the cop. as they are running, they put other innocent people in danger while they are loose, best to just stop them there wounding them possible but stop them never the less.

November 18, 2005, 03:42 PM	#8
threefivesevenmag Senior Member Join Date: May 8, 2005 Posts: 406	That was very fun Glenn. If another new iPod or iTool comes out in the next month...I'll just have to buy stock in Macintosh. Warning shots don't exist. Never do them. Not an option unless signaling for help when lost in an abundance of wilderness. Even then, not a great option. You can shoot someone who is fleeing, as Glenn pointed out. I believe you would have to have witnessed them do an extremely violent crime or murder in order to do so and that you believe they are capable or will repeat their actions. It's a huge if question. As civilians, I believe witnessing an axe murder would be quite rare, although that would surely be grounds for lethal force. They should make a tactical iPod. I'm sold on it.

November 18, 2005, 04:03 PM	#9
Lion In Winter Member Join Date: January 22, 2005 Posts: 67	Always remember to put a finger in the ear nearest the gun.

November 18, 2005, 05:53 PM	#10
chrisandclauida2 Senior Member Join Date: September 21, 2005 Posts: 312	You Dont.

November 18, 2005, 08:47 PM	#13
smince Junior member Join Date: October 9, 2004 Location: Northeast Alabama Posts: 2,580	A friend who was an embassy guard in a war-torn country said SOP was: (In the event of encountering an insurgent) 1. Fire warning shot 2. Yell "HALT!" 3. Engage BG Actual sequence: 1. Shoot enemy 2. Yell "HALT!" 3. Then fire warning shot Our training in the USAF clearly stated (as well as signs all over the base): WARNING SHOTS ARE NOT AUTHORIZED! Probably afraid we might accidently shoot down a KC135

November 18, 2005, 09:12 PM	#14
k9lwt Senior Member Join Date: June 13, 2005 Location: Posts: 123	You can't fire warning shots-if you fire, deadly force must be justified. You can shoot a fleeing felon if you have probable cause that the person will do imminent harm if he contiunes to flee- screaming freak with a gun, knife, etc. This in MA.

November 18, 2005, 09:20 PM	#15
model 25 Senior Member Join Date: October 27, 2005 Location: out west Posts: 892	Never pull a gun unless you are in personal danger and can prove so in court, then when you do put two to the body as a warning then one to the head if BG fails to heed that warning. IMHO that is all the warning the criminals should get. 25

November 18, 2005, 09:23 PM	#16
rapier144 Senior Member Join Date: October 2, 2005 Location: tennessee Posts: 686	What the hell is a warning shot? __________________ Scan and Breathe Scan and Breathe Stupidity should hurt

November 18, 2005, 09:29 PM	#17
rapier144 Senior Member Join Date: October 2, 2005 Location: tennessee Posts: 686	O those are the shots you missed __________________ Scan and Breathe Scan and Breathe Stupidity should hurt

November 18, 2005, 09:49 PM	#18
exoduster16 Senior Member Join Date: July 27, 2005 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 148	There is only need to fire one shot: the one that impacts the BG right between the eyes. His/her/its warning is the sound of the gunshot. __________________ Mine: Weatherby Vanguard in 7mm Rem Mag Remington Model 572 Pumpmaster Remington Model 11-87 12 guage Remington Model 870 Express 12 Gauge w/18.5 in. barrel And plenty of ammo for all of them

November 19, 2005, 12:02 AM	#19
IZinterrogator Senior Member Join Date: November 8, 2004 Location: Prescott Valley, AZ Posts: 2,457	When I was in Bosnia, the ROE called for a warning shot. When we did our convoy brief every morning before rolling out for a mission, the team sergeant always briefed that the warning shot would be aimed COM, and the real shot would be aimed at the spot where the BG was lying on the ground bleeding. Best convoy briefs I ever got. __________________ "If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!” - Samuel Adams

November 19, 2005, 12:21 AM	#20
BradS Senior Member Join Date: July 8, 2005 Location: Salisbury,Pennsylvania Posts: 173	Warning Shot ? Only in the movies.

November 19, 2005, 07:26 AM	#21
Oct_97 Member Join Date: June 17, 2004 Posts: 29	Was that Deputy's name Barney Fife?

November 19, 2005, 10:55 AM	#22
Weeg Senior Member Join Date: November 7, 2005 Posts: 463	Maybe it was the guy from "Loaded Weapon" "Ah-ah-ah...I know what you're thinkin'...Did he fire 173 shots or 174?...Well, do you feel lucky?"

November 19, 2005, 11:05 AM	#23
USP45usp Junior member Join Date: May 17, 2000 Location: Eugene, OR Posts: 3,427	IZ beat me to it. Warning shot = COM If they (the BG) don't heed the the warning, then the real shots go COM and Head if able . Wayne

November 19, 2005, 11:28 AM	#24
mvpel Senior Member Join Date: May 18, 2000 Location: Hooksett, NH Posts: 1,847	The thing is, under the law a warning shot is usually considered to be the use of deadly force, and if you're not justified in shooting the BG COM, then you're not justified in firing a warning shot. __________________ Not a blacksmith could be found in the whole land of Israel, because the Philistines had said, "Otherwise the Hebrews will make swords or spears!" 1 Samuel 13:19