marco first model dragoon patent 442

Tono2014 · January 28, 2014, 05:06 PM

Recently acquired a USMR first model dragoon.
I'm assuming its a replica as it has made in Italy
in several places. Its 14 inches long & quite heavy.
It has the cowboys annd indians fighting on the barrel.
It had the word marco on the left side and
on the right side it has PN with the star above
it which i understand to be Gardone Proof House.
It also has the letters XX7 & also what appeard to be a
box with something in it and above that what appears to
be a star in a circle. ?
Its a nice looking gun. Someone said black powder.
It has a wood handle.
Can anyone give me information on this gun.
Thannkyou for your response.

Lt. Skrumpledonk Ret · January 28, 2014, 05:33 PM

Wikipedia has yet to let me down.

Dfariswheel · January 28, 2014, 07:04 PM

You have a modern replica of the Colt Walker, or a 1st, 2nd, or 3rd Model Dragoon, made in Italy by Armi San Marco.
They made lower quality replicas of Colt black powder revolvers.
The Walker weights about 4 1/2 pounds and has a spring latch for the loading lever under the barrel.
The three models of the Colt Dragoon have a latch at the front of the lever that locks into a block near the muzzle, and are both slightly lighter and have a slightly shorter barrel then the Walker.

The engraving on the cylinder is of the famed "Texas Rangers and Indians" incident where the Texas Frontier Battalion of the Texas Rangers engaged a large force of Comanche indians with early Colt Patterson revolvers, and shot the indians to pieces.

As above, you have a black powder, muzzle loading revolver.
All of the various stamps are the usual Italian proof marks.

Doc Hoy · January 29, 2014, 04:20 AM

Welcome to the forum.

If you do a search on Google for "Italian Firearms Proof Marks" you will get some good images which will help you to interpret the markings on the pistol.

There will also be some images of the Italian Date codes so that you can understand when the revolver was made.

The Armi San Marco organization was (IMO) an under-rated manufacturer. They are said to suffer from soft internal parts but I have not found that to be the case when compared with other replica builders at that time. I have ten revolvers from ASM including one example of the First Model Dragoon. When compared to other revolvers from contemporary replica manufacturers, they are second only to Armi San Paolo. (And I don't think ASP made the Dragoon or the Walker)

I shoot only round balls and a .454 works best for me. A lot of folks like conicals in this revolver. I started with a charge of 30 grains (using a thirty grain setting on the measure) and then worked up in two to three grain increments to a good consistently accurate load. I think I recall that 40 grains of 777 works correctly. Use a different powder and you may well have to start all over. I don't shoot any of my BP revolvers a lot, but I can tell you that my Dragoons are some of my favorite shooters. (I like a lot of noise, smoke and fire.)

I don't know how you acquired the revolver or what you paid, but you will find that of Dragoon replicas of that era, there are not many that are better.

Doc Hoy · January 29, 2014, 04:34 AM

I have a Walker and because it is a good bit heavier and a good bit longer I have a tough time holding and aiming it at arms length. The Dragoons are a little more user friendly.

I said in the earlier post that I like an emotional experience (Smoke, fire and noise). The Dragoon takes a smaller charge than the Walker but the shorter barrel and lighter weight makes the recoil is more detectable than when shooting the Walker.

A heavy pistol with black powder accelerates rearward slowly and so the sensation is a push rather than a pop.

I love all of my handguns and I have no less regard for my Dragoons than any other that I own.

Doc Hoy · January 29, 2014, 04:54 AM

The Dragoon represents an improvement over the Walker in one area.

The Walker loading lever had a holding catch which did not work on originals and does not work on replicas. The effect is that when you fire the revolver with a heavy charge, the loading lever drops and in some cases it goes so far that the ram engages the chamber on the cylinder and you have to raise the lever before you can cock the revolver and advance the cylinder.

The problem was so significant that shooters came up with ways to hold the lever in place. None of them would have been workable in battle. (Wrap a piece of leather around the barrel and lever, Tape, reshape the catch with a file.) I developed a little clip that works real well.

The latch on the Dragoon is Colt's attempt to correct the problem. It is an interesting solution and not the final design but it works well. The Second Dragoon and subsequent Colt revolvers had a latch which was easier to use.

maillemaker · January 29, 2014, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Recently acquired a USMR first model dragoon.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colt_Dragoon_Revolver

http://home.comcast.net/~dsmjd/tux/d...ch/dragoon.htm

Steve

January 28, 2014, 05:06 PM	#1
Tono2014 Junior Member Join Date: January 28, 2014 Posts: 1	marco first model dragoon patent 442 Recently acquired a USMR first model dragoon. I'm assuming its a replica as it has made in Italy in several places. Its 14 inches long & quite heavy. It has the cowboys annd indians fighting on the barrel. It had the word marco on the left side and on the right side it has PN with the star above it which i understand to be Gardone Proof House. It also has the letters XX7 & also what appeard to be a box with something in it and above that what appears to be a star in a circle. ? Its a nice looking gun. Someone said black powder. It has a wood handle. Can anyone give me information on this gun. Thannkyou for your response.

January 29, 2014, 04:20 AM	#4
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	Tono Welcome to the forum. If you do a search on Google for "Italian Firearms Proof Marks" you will get some good images which will help you to interpret the markings on the pistol. There will also be some images of the Italian Date codes so that you can understand when the revolver was made. The Armi San Marco organization was (IMO) an under-rated manufacturer. They are said to suffer from soft internal parts but I have not found that to be the case when compared with other replica builders at that time. I have ten revolvers from ASM including one example of the First Model Dragoon. When compared to other revolvers from contemporary replica manufacturers, they are second only to Armi San Paolo. (And I don't think ASP made the Dragoon or the Walker) I shoot only round balls and a .454 works best for me. A lot of folks like conicals in this revolver. I started with a charge of 30 grains (using a thirty grain setting on the measure) and then worked up in two to three grain increments to a good consistently accurate load. I think I recall that 40 grains of 777 works correctly. Use a different powder and you may well have to start all over. I don't shoot any of my BP revolvers a lot, but I can tell you that my Dragoons are some of my favorite shooters. (I like a lot of noise, smoke and fire.) I don't know how you acquired the revolver or what you paid, but you will find that of Dragoon replicas of that era, there are not many that are better. __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.

January 29, 2014, 04:34 AM	#5
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	I wanted to add a comment about the experience of shooting the Dragoon I have a Walker and because it is a good bit heavier and a good bit longer I have a tough time holding and aiming it at arms length. The Dragoons are a little more user friendly. I said in the earlier post that I like an emotional experience (Smoke, fire and noise). The Dragoon takes a smaller charge than the Walker but the shorter barrel and lighter weight makes the recoil is more detectable than when shooting the Walker. A heavy pistol with black powder accelerates rearward slowly and so the sensation is a push rather than a pop. I love all of my handguns and I have no less regard for my Dragoons than any other that I own. __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.

January 29, 2014, 04:54 AM	#6
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	Lets talk about the design The Dragoon represents an improvement over the Walker in one area. The Walker loading lever had a holding catch which did not work on originals and does not work on replicas. The effect is that when you fire the revolver with a heavy charge, the loading lever drops and in some cases it goes so far that the ram engages the chamber on the cylinder and you have to raise the lever before you can cock the revolver and advance the cylinder. The problem was so significant that shooters came up with ways to hold the lever in place. None of them would have been workable in battle. (Wrap a piece of leather around the barrel and lever, Tape, reshape the catch with a file.) I developed a little clip that works real well. The latch on the Dragoon is Colt's attempt to correct the problem. It is an interesting solution and not the final design but it works well. The Second Dragoon and subsequent Colt revolvers had a latch which was easier to use. __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.

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January 28, 2014, 05:33 PM	#2
Lt. Skrumpledonk Ret Senior Member Join Date: May 30, 2012 Location: Oh, Jesus. Posts: 226	Wikipedia has yet to let me down.

January 28, 2014, 07:04 PM	#3
Dfariswheel Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2001 Posts: 7,478	You have a modern replica of the Colt Walker, or a 1st, 2nd, or 3rd Model Dragoon, made in Italy by Armi San Marco. They made lower quality replicas of Colt black powder revolvers. The Walker weights about 4 1/2 pounds and has a spring latch for the loading lever under the barrel. The three models of the Colt Dragoon have a latch at the front of the lever that locks into a block near the muzzle, and are both slightly lighter and have a slightly shorter barrel then the Walker. The engraving on the cylinder is of the famed "Texas Rangers and Indians" incident where the Texas Frontier Battalion of the Texas Rangers engaged a large force of Comanche indians with early Colt Patterson revolvers, and shot the indians to pieces. As above, you have a black powder, muzzle loading revolver. All of the various stamps are the usual Italian proof marks.