switch barrel rifle systems...

1stmar · December 16, 2018, 11:18 AM

Besides Savage, is anyone familiar with these systems? Seems to work like the savage with a nut that locks the barrel in place at the appropriate head spacing. Looking for info on:

Is there a loss in accuracy
Are they field replaceable - can anyone do it, what tools do you need
Are they really cost effective
Recommendations on who to have install
Do can you order replacement barrels from Hart, Kreiger etc already set up or do you need to ship the barrel out for this service

Thanks

RC20 · December 16, 2018, 02:49 PM

If you cold be more specific.

Blasser (sp?) makes an expensive system.

Remington can be changed into a Savage type setup.

Robertson Arms makes a switch barrel Semi auto rifle that uses a dimple index with a slightly cross threaded screw that does not come out (and it returns to POA really well by the way)

Savage you have to sight in again as you never get it quite back to where it was.

1stmar · December 16, 2018, 03:03 PM

Did some searching on you tube and came up w this. This sounds exactly like what i am looking for.
https://youtu.be/UZbXrMKe8cg

Mobuck · December 16, 2018, 08:31 PM

I wouldn't really consider the Savage barrel attachment as "switch barrel" since it requires the use of gauges to properly set the headspace when changing barrels.
I've changed a couple of Savage barrels over the years and it's not as simple as some might indicate. The threads don't always loosen easily and may require considerable torque to move.

Wyosmith · December 17, 2018, 12:59 AM

The Browning BLR can be had in a take-down system, so I assume you could order one with 2 or more barrels.

I am making one right now on a small ring Mauser with 2 barrels. One in 9X57 and one in 257 Roberts. But such custom work is not cheap. My way of doing it involves 2 barrels with 2 forends and 2 scopes. So when you swap the barrel you also do so with the scope and they are pre-zeroed. I include a set of dies for each caliber and the load the barrel/scope is zeroed with.

old roper · December 17, 2018, 06:41 AM

1stmar, This maybe what your looking for

https://westtexordnance.com/switchlug/

You can pin recoil lug on Rem action make switch barrel.

http://forum.accurateshooter.com/thr...l-lug.3864489/

RC20 · December 17, 2018, 11:14 AM

Quote:

I wouldn't really consider the Savage barrel attachment as "switch barrel" since it requires the use of gauges to properly set the headspace when changing barrels.
I've changed a couple of Savage barrels over the years and it's not as simple as some might indicate. The threads don't always loosen easily and may require considerable torque to move.

I am not sure what I am seeing there, it almost looks like a pre set nut remage hand tight.

While not as quick as the RA XCR, not as bad as you seem to have run into.

The initial nut removal can be a bugger, once that is done, you just need the wrench and the gauge.

Pop off the old one, head space the new one, tighten the nut and good to go (I do use nickle anti seize)

I still use the nut wrench to put 50 lbs or so of torque on it.

SIGSHR · December 17, 2018, 03:34 PM

There is the SIG SHR 970, discontinued alas.
Cost effective ? 1 receiver in different calibers.

1stmar · December 17, 2018, 05:56 PM

Old roper thats what i was looking for. Looks to be about $135 per barrel once the pin is set.

Thanks

F. Guffey · December 17, 2018, 07:30 PM

There are switch barrel systems and then there are those that can build a system that is a switch barrel system. I built a 30 Gibbs riffle, I built the rifle with one receiver, one bolt and one barrel. And then I built two more rifles with different receivers with the same barrel and same bolt. There was not .001" difference in length between all of the chambers.

F. Guffey

1stmar · December 17, 2018, 09:27 PM

Thanks for the replies. Certainly finding the right smith is key. If i decide to pursue will give justin sip a call.

Dfariswheel · December 17, 2018, 09:29 PM

My buddy is a VERY excellent long range shooter and a President's 100 shooter.

He's had two precision rifles built that can have the barrels switched on the range.
Each part is built by different builders; One man built the aluminum steel insert receivers and bolts, another the barrels, another to stock them, and another to nitride the barrels.
He mounts his own scopes.

The first is a total custom setup with custom receiver, stock, barrels, bolts, semi-custom Schmidt & Bender scope and titanium silencer.
Total cost: About $15,000 BEFORE he started buying the extra bolt and extra barrels.

He has the one receiver with two bolts; one for 6mmBR and .308 and one bolt for .223.
He has custom barrels in .223, .308, 6mm and last I heard one other caliber.
To change the barrel he has a barrel vise he can mount on his truck's trailer hitch and a action wrench made for him by the receiver maker.
He can pop one barrel off, and tighten another on using a small torque wrench.
He says he's usually only off target by less then 1/2 inch at 100 yards.
He says he doesn't have to torque the barrels that tight.

Granted all this is very high end equipment built by the best makers in America, and who are talking to each other about how the barrels, receivers, and bolts are going to fit with each other.

old roper · December 18, 2018, 09:14 AM

When I was shooting BR my light rifle was Panda action. I could call Kelby get barrel already chamber for that action and change barrel myself.

This is little order article on switch barrel rifles.

http://forum.accurateshooter.com/thr...ction.3899009/

1stmar · December 18, 2018, 07:08 PM

For this to work for me it has to be idiot proof, no tools. The one i linked was $3300 for the rifle. Not sure about the additional barrel. Seemed reasonable. To replace a match grade barrel its roughly $350 for the barrel and another $350 or so for the install. Throw some shipping in and your at $800-900 plus the turn around time while your are without the rifle. Looking to drive down the cost and turn around time. If i can spend a little more up front and then send the barrel to a smith have him retrofit and install my self could cut down on time without my rifle and possibly costs.

old roper · December 18, 2018, 09:52 PM

1stmar, I had barrel vise and action wrench for changing barrels on that Panda action. I ordered barrels from Kelby and I order couple so I always had barrel. I think you need to talk to who's ever is going to furnish switch barrel system and find out on extra barrels.

1stmar · December 18, 2018, 11:10 PM

Old roper, totally agree.

dgludwig · December 19, 2018, 11:00 AM

I'd rather have a second (or third, ad infinitum) rifle.

RC20 · December 19, 2018, 12:46 PM

Quote:

I'd rather have a second (or third, ad infinitum) rifle.

Looks like the OP got his answer.

Vearing off topic, having worked with two switch barrel types (XCR and Savage) I agree with the above.

DPI7800 · December 19, 2018, 12:53 PM

I started down that road a while ago. I quickly determined that the systems that allow for where still to restrictive for what I really wanted to eventually do which is not be limited to one head size. I started to look areound some more and kept finding my self looking at the Sakko TRG M10 and the AI AXMC.

The TRG was cheaper up front until I found that the only way to do other calibers mother than factory offered is you had to purchase a factory BBL to sacrifice and press off the chamber extensions and then have that pressed on to the BBL of your choice. No thanks.

The AI doesn’t have this issue. Able to get a huge variety of calibers, only restriction is on the AI action length you choose, SA or magnum length. If magnum length action your restriction is to cases that have .473, .532 or .588 head diameters which allows more choices than I’ll be able to acquire in my lifetime most likely.

RC20 · December 19, 2018, 07:40 PM

My issue was moving back and forth and wanting to work with a given caliber was disruptive.

I though the XCR idea would be good for the milgary as they could have kept a stock of barrel in various length at home base and then issued as needed (ie not done on patrol or combat)

QQB in Iraq seemed to favor the 14 inch M4 highly. Shades of WWII where about half the Infantry Rifle companies wound up with sub machine guns (not issues do likely traded with tankers who did have them as issue - at least the US side tended to not need them (alwyas excpeitons) as they were on the attack.

Afghanistan it seem to be longer was better but at least some short when searching Villages and all short if fully in town QQB again.

J.G. Terry · December 27, 2018, 11:51 AM

T/C Dimension: Space gun looks.

5R barrels. Accurate. Conversions available for a number of common cartridges.

armednfree · December 27, 2018, 01:29 PM

There is the Savage and the Remage. There is no reason a standard barrel can't be cut for any bolt action rifle and they be interchanged, bench resters do that sometimes. The reason for the remage is that you don't need a machinist to set the barrel.

None of those barrels are you going to willy nilly change daily on a whim. Typically you would use an external action wrench requiring removal of scope and bases. You can use an internal wrench since you are not hogging it down.

So basically you would do something like change the rifle to 22-250 for woodchucks and then over to 308 for deer. In a country where you are restricted in how many guns you own and have to jump through hoop to get them that makes sense, but not here.

So all this does is allow you to change a rifle without a gunsmith.

1stmar · December 27, 2018, 06:57 PM

Check out the link in my second post. Thats pretty much what im looking for. Not sure how many gunsmiths can built it but may give that guy a call.

emcon5 · December 30, 2018, 02:26 AM

Interesting engineering exercise, but I admit I still don't get what problem is this a solution to.

Mobuck · December 30, 2018, 07:22 AM

"but I admit I still don't get what problem is this a solution to."

As mentioned, this is applicable to areas of restrictive gun ownership OR traveling hunters needing 2 significantly different calibers on the same "numbered action" to meet import regulations.
A true "switch barrel" should not require barrel/action vises, barrel nut wrenches, bench vises, pipe wrenches, or such tools. Often only a small torque wrench or maybe even just a T-handle hex/torx wrench is required.

December 16, 2018, 11:18 AM	#1
1stmar Senior Member Join Date: March 21, 2012 Location: Connecticut Posts: 2,378	switch barrel rifle systems... Besides Savage, is anyone familiar with these systems? Seems to work like the savage with a nut that locks the barrel in place at the appropriate head spacing. Looking for info on: Is there a loss in accuracy Are they field replaceable - can anyone do it, what tools do you need Are they really cost effective Recommendations on who to have install Do can you order replacement barrels from Hart, Kreiger etc already set up or do you need to ship the barrel out for this service Thanks

December 16, 2018, 02:49 PM	#2
RC20 Senior Member Join Date: April 10, 2008 Location: Alaska Posts: 7,014	If you cold be more specific. Blasser (sp?) makes an expensive system. Remington can be changed into a Savage type setup. Robertson Arms makes a switch barrel Semi auto rifle that uses a dimple index with a slightly cross threaded screw that does not come out (and it returns to POA really well by the way) Savage you have to sight in again as you never get it quite back to where it was. __________________ Science and Facts are True whether you believe it or not

December 17, 2018, 06:41 AM	#6
old roper Senior Member Join Date: June 11, 2007 Posts: 2,155	1stmar, This maybe what your looking for https://westtexordnance.com/switchlug/ You can pin recoil lug on Rem action make switch barrel. http://forum.accurateshooter.com/thr...l-lug.3864489/ __________________ Semper Fi Vietnam 1965 VFW Life member NRA Life Member

December 18, 2018, 09:14 AM	#13
old roper Senior Member Join Date: June 11, 2007 Posts: 2,155	When I was shooting BR my light rifle was Panda action. I could call Kelby get barrel already chamber for that action and change barrel myself. This is little order article on switch barrel rifles. http://forum.accurateshooter.com/thr...ction.3899009/ __________________ Semper Fi Vietnam 1965 VFW Life member NRA Life Member

December 18, 2018, 09:52 PM	#15
old roper Senior Member Join Date: June 11, 2007 Posts: 2,155	1stmar, I had barrel vise and action wrench for changing barrels on that Panda action. I ordered barrels from Kelby and I order couple so I always had barrel. I think you need to talk to who's ever is going to furnish switch barrel system and find out on extra barrels. __________________ Semper Fi Vietnam 1965 VFW Life member NRA Life Member

December 16, 2018, 03:03 PM	#3
1stmar Senior Member Join Date: March 21, 2012 Location: Connecticut Posts: 2,378	Did some searching on you tube and came up w this. This sounds exactly like what i am looking for. https://youtu.be/UZbXrMKe8cg

December 16, 2018, 08:31 PM	#4
Mobuck Junior member Join Date: February 2, 2010 Posts: 6,846	I wouldn't really consider the Savage barrel attachment as "switch barrel" since it requires the use of gauges to properly set the headspace when changing barrels. I've changed a couple of Savage barrels over the years and it's not as simple as some might indicate. The threads don't always loosen easily and may require considerable torque to move.

December 17, 2018, 12:59 AM	#5
Wyosmith Senior Member Join Date: December 29, 2010 Location: Shoshoni Wyoming Posts: 2,713	The Browning BLR can be had in a take-down system, so I assume you could order one with 2 or more barrels. I am making one right now on a small ring Mauser with 2 barrels. One in 9X57 and one in 257 Roberts. But such custom work is not cheap. My way of doing it involves 2 barrels with 2 forends and 2 scopes. So when you swap the barrel you also do so with the scope and they are pre-zeroed. I include a set of dies for each caliber and the load the barrel/scope is zeroed with.

December 17, 2018, 03:34 PM	#8
SIGSHR Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2005 Posts: 4,700	There is the SIG SHR 970, discontinued alas. Cost effective ? 1 receiver in different calibers.

December 17, 2018, 05:56 PM	#9
1stmar Senior Member Join Date: March 21, 2012 Location: Connecticut Posts: 2,378	Old roper thats what i was looking for. Looks to be about $135 per barrel once the pin is set. Thanks

December 17, 2018, 07:30 PM	#10
F. Guffey Senior Member Join Date: July 18, 2008 Posts: 7,249	There are switch barrel systems and then there are those that can build a system that is a switch barrel system. I built a 30 Gibbs riffle, I built the rifle with one receiver, one bolt and one barrel. And then I built two more rifles with different receivers with the same barrel and same bolt. There was not .001" difference in length between all of the chambers. F. Guffey

December 17, 2018, 09:27 PM	#11
1stmar Senior Member Join Date: March 21, 2012 Location: Connecticut Posts: 2,378	Thanks for the replies. Certainly finding the right smith is key. If i decide to pursue will give justin sip a call.

December 17, 2018, 09:29 PM	#12
Dfariswheel Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2001 Posts: 7,478	My buddy is a VERY excellent long range shooter and a President's 100 shooter. He's had two precision rifles built that can have the barrels switched on the range. Each part is built by different builders; One man built the aluminum steel insert receivers and bolts, another the barrels, another to stock them, and another to nitride the barrels. He mounts his own scopes. The first is a total custom setup with custom receiver, stock, barrels, bolts, semi-custom Schmidt & Bender scope and titanium silencer. Total cost: About $15,000 BEFORE he started buying the extra bolt and extra barrels. He has the one receiver with two bolts; one for 6mmBR and .308 and one bolt for .223. He has custom barrels in .223, .308, 6mm and last I heard one other caliber. To change the barrel he has a barrel vise he can mount on his truck's trailer hitch and a action wrench made for him by the receiver maker. He can pop one barrel off, and tighten another on using a small torque wrench. He says he's usually only off target by less then 1/2 inch at 100 yards. He says he doesn't have to torque the barrels that tight. Granted all this is very high end equipment built by the best makers in America, and who are talking to each other about how the barrels, receivers, and bolts are going to fit with each other.

December 18, 2018, 07:08 PM	#14
1stmar Senior Member Join Date: March 21, 2012 Location: Connecticut Posts: 2,378	For this to work for me it has to be idiot proof, no tools. The one i linked was $3300 for the rifle. Not sure about the additional barrel. Seemed reasonable. To replace a match grade barrel its roughly $350 for the barrel and another $350 or so for the install. Throw some shipping in and your at $800-900 plus the turn around time while your are without the rifle. Looking to drive down the cost and turn around time. If i can spend a little more up front and then send the barrel to a smith have him retrofit and install my self could cut down on time without my rifle and possibly costs.

December 18, 2018, 11:10 PM	#16
1stmar Senior Member Join Date: March 21, 2012 Location: Connecticut Posts: 2,378	Old roper, totally agree.

December 19, 2018, 11:00 AM	#17
dgludwig Senior Member Join Date: February 12, 2005 Location: North central Ohio Posts: 7,486	I'd rather have a second (or third, ad infinitum) rifle. __________________ ONLY AN ARMED PEOPLE CAN BE TRULY FREE ; ONLY AN UNARMED PEOPLE CAN EVER BE ENSLAVED ...Aristotle NRA Benefactor Life Member

December 19, 2018, 12:53 PM	#19
DPI7800 Senior Member Join Date: July 15, 2014 Posts: 208	I started down that road a while ago. I quickly determined that the systems that allow for where still to restrictive for what I really wanted to eventually do which is not be limited to one head size. I started to look areound some more and kept finding my self looking at the Sakko TRG M10 and the AI AXMC. The TRG was cheaper up front until I found that the only way to do other calibers mother than factory offered is you had to purchase a factory BBL to sacrifice and press off the chamber extensions and then have that pressed on to the BBL of your choice. No thanks. The AI doesn’t have this issue. Able to get a huge variety of calibers, only restriction is on the AI action length you choose, SA or magnum length. If magnum length action your restriction is to cases that have .473, .532 or .588 head diameters which allows more choices than I’ll be able to acquire in my lifetime most likely.

December 19, 2018, 07:40 PM	#20
RC20 Senior Member Join Date: April 10, 2008 Location: Alaska Posts: 7,014	My issue was moving back and forth and wanting to work with a given caliber was disruptive. I though the XCR idea would be good for the milgary as they could have kept a stock of barrel in various length at home base and then issued as needed (ie not done on patrol or combat) QQB in Iraq seemed to favor the 14 inch M4 highly. Shades of WWII where about half the Infantry Rifle companies wound up with sub machine guns (not issues do likely traded with tankers who did have them as issue - at least the US side tended to not need them (alwyas excpeitons) as they were on the attack. Afghanistan it seem to be longer was better but at least some short when searching Villages and all short if fully in town QQB again. __________________ Science and Facts are True whether you believe it or not

December 27, 2018, 11:51 AM	#21
J.G. Terry Senior Member Join Date: January 24, 2014 Posts: 577	T/D Dimension T/C Dimension: Space gun looks. 5R barrels. Accurate. Conversions available for a number of common cartridges. __________________ Intentionally Antagonizing Another MemberInsults and Ad Hominems

December 27, 2018, 01:29 PM	#22
armednfree Senior Member Join Date: October 30, 2016 Posts: 211	There is the Savage and the Remage. There is no reason a standard barrel can't be cut for any bolt action rifle and they be interchanged, bench resters do that sometimes. The reason for the remage is that you don't need a machinist to set the barrel. None of those barrels are you going to willy nilly change daily on a whim. Typically you would use an external action wrench requiring removal of scope and bases. You can use an internal wrench since you are not hogging it down. So basically you would do something like change the rifle to 22-250 for woodchucks and then over to 308 for deer. In a country where you are restricted in how many guns you own and have to jump through hoop to get them that makes sense, but not here. So all this does is allow you to change a rifle without a gunsmith.

December 27, 2018, 06:57 PM	#23
1stmar Senior Member Join Date: March 21, 2012 Location: Connecticut Posts: 2,378	Check out the link in my second post. Thats pretty much what im looking for. Not sure how many gunsmiths can built it but may give that guy a call.

December 30, 2018, 02:26 AM	#24
emcon5 Senior Member Join Date: July 10, 1999 Location: High Desert NV Posts: 2,850	Interesting engineering exercise, but I admit I still don't get what problem is this a solution to.

December 30, 2018, 07:22 AM	#25
Mobuck Junior member Join Date: February 2, 2010 Posts: 6,846	"but I admit I still don't get what problem is this a solution to." As mentioned, this is applicable to areas of restrictive gun ownership OR traveling hunters needing 2 significantly different calibers on the same "numbered action" to meet import regulations. A true "switch barrel" should not require barrel/action vises, barrel nut wrenches, bench vises, pipe wrenches, or such tools. Often only a small torque wrench or maybe even just a T-handle hex/torx wrench is required.