Scope Mounting S&W(Howa)1500 - Page 2

haliwa04 · September 10, 2013, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jrhilde

this is the one mounted on the Weaver bases in the Burris rings with the nylon inserts-

What do the nylon rings do exactly? I'm sure they prevent ring marks. Any other noticeable advantages?

reynolds357 · September 10, 2013, 08:30 PM

They work like linear bearings and correct all misalignment issues. Basically, you get a set of lapped rings without lapping.

jrhilde · September 10, 2013, 11:24 PM

Reynolds is right, they will help correct any misalignment of the rings--also, they hold like crazy, I must have loosened the ring caps half a dozen times while getting the scope aligned vertically and positioned far enough back to get the correct eye relief---I've seen a scope "creep" when tightened down in steel or aluminum rings, but never in these inserts--they hold totally tight and yet leave no marks on the scope at all---I always use the three slot Weaver bases, [ sometimes they have to be special ordered ], so that you have enough mounting options to get the scope back far enough to use properly---another reason for the choice of Prostaff and the Bushnells, they have longer rear bells or eyepieces than many other scopes----

Always seems to come out about right for me when the rear of the scope is directly above the lowest point in the top of the rear section of the stock, the joining area between the pistol grip section and the start of the butt---

haliwa04 · September 10, 2013, 11:29 PM

Thanks for the info. I'll definitely add the nylon lined rings to the list. And if you have anymore info on the 3 slot bases, pm me.

I actually ran across a guy selling a Sightron S1 3-9x40 for $50 and a SII 3-9x42 for $100. I think I'll grab both and slap the S1 on my 10/22. That is if they check out and are genuine.

haliwa04 · September 11, 2013, 01:43 PM

I cant find anything on the Burris site about the Posi-Align inserts being made of nylon, they actually look like steel/metal inserts. Is there something i'm missing here?

jrhilde · September 11, 2013, 05:37 PM

They are called Burris Signature Zee rings, the nylon inserts are split in an upper and lower half to match the lower ring half unit and the upper ring cap--the inserts are just a tad wider than the rings so that no metal touches the scope--had to have my LGS special order them due to he usually only stocks one pair and had just sold them, also, the Weaver bases are the set with the three notches in one pad and two in the other---allows for considerably more front to rear movement to put the scope where you want it--both the rings and bases are pretty common and your local shop should have no trouble ordering them----

reynolds357 · September 11, 2013, 08:19 PM

The Signature inserts are made of some non-metal material that is very hard. Nylon? Nyletron? Some kind of hard plastic type material.

cdbeagle · September 11, 2013, 08:41 PM

We have three Vanguards in the family and I have Warne Bases and Rings mounted on them as we'll as all of our other rifles. They do take the Rem 700 bases.

I have two Vortex Vipers and a Crossfire that sits on a Marlin Model 60. The Vipers are great, don't purchase the Crossfire. I've owned three Fulfield II's and have an E1 2x7 on a 336W. I am a fan of them, they are my favorite scope in their price range and someplace usually has them on sale at a very good price.

cdbeagle · September 11, 2013, 08:53 PM

It is also irritatating to me when you ask a question on a forum and people insist on giving advice on something else, like with your scope choice. Even after you stated that the Simmons was what you were stuck with a few people still HAD to tell you what to do with a scope instead of staying on the subject of rings and bases.

reynolds357 · September 11, 2013, 09:31 PM

CDbeagle, people are just trying to help. If you are interested in having a rock solid mounting system, it would be logical to mount something in that mounting system that will perform equally well. I have a couple of 15 year old Simmons scopes that are very good scopes. They were not made in China. The new breed of Simmons is going to cause you anguish. Mounting a Simmons in a set or Warnes, Talley's, or Burris signatures, is kind of like buying a set of custom wheels for your truck and mounting dry rotted tires on them.

haliwa04 · September 11, 2013, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cdbeagle

It is also irritatating to me when you ask a question on a forum and people insist on giving advice on something else, like with your scope choice. Even after you stated that the Simmons was what you were stuck with a few people still HAD to tell you what to do with a scope instead of staying on the subject of rings and bases.

Yea, I know, very annoying. But, I just keep on rolling with the topic at hand. I lucked upon a sightron s1 and s2 for $150 for both, so I will be getting better quality glass, but still saving quite a bit of cash. That extra cash is going to go to ammo and other hunting items I may need.

haliwa04 · September 11, 2013, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by reynolds357

CDbeagle, people are just trying to help. If you are interested in having a rock solid mounting system, it would be logical to mount something in that mounting system that will perform equally well. I have a couple of 15 year old Simmons scopes that are very good scopes. They were not made in China. The new breed of Simmons is going to cause you anguish. Mounting a Simmons in a set or Warnes, Talley's, or Burris signatures, is kind of like buying a set of custom wheels for your truck and mounting dry rotted tires on them.

And that is your opinion. It will make sure I get the best of the scope that I do mount. This is about bases and rings, not the scope.

cdbeagle · September 12, 2013, 04:52 AM

[QUOTE]CDbeagle, people are just trying to help. If you are interested in having a rock solid mounting system, it would be logical to mount something in that mounting system that will perform equally well. I have a couple of 15 year old Simmons scopes that are very good scopes. They were not made in China. The new breed of Simmons is going to cause you anguish. Mounting a Simmons in a set or Warnes, Talley's, or Burris signatures, is kind of like buying a set of custom wheels for your truck and mounting dry rotted tires on them.[\QUOTE]

You proved my point. Very few people care to hear unsolicited advice.

reynolds357 · September 12, 2013, 09:56 AM

If you do not care to hear unsolicited advice, internet discussion forums are the wrong place for you to be.

csmsss · September 12, 2013, 10:14 AM

While we're discussing rings, I would not hesitate to recomment Dednutz one piece mounts. As long as you can find one that matches your receiver and scope combination, they completely eliminate all alignment issues.

http://www.opticsplanet.com/dednutz-...130912151157:s

haliwa04 · September 12, 2013, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by reynolds357

If you do not care to hear unsolicited advice, internet discussion forums are the wrong place for you to be.

If you provide unsolicited advice in internet forums, you should expect and respect the honest, sometimes rude answer you may receive.
I had a man tell me yesterday over the phone that the 34 acre plot I live on isn't appropriate for rifle hunting. I had contacted him about hay bales for my dog pens and for my blind. I kindly and respectfully told him thank you, but I've been doing it for two years now, and have yet to have a single problem. He continued to try to argue, so he got the answer that I originally held back, which was to mind his business, and if he had a problem, to do something about it.
Moral of the story kids: stick to the topic at hand and you won't get your feelings hurt or start an argument.

reynolds357 · September 13, 2013, 08:58 PM

I definitely do not get my feelings hurt by someone I could not care less about.

For someone to hurt my feelings, I would have to assign some degree of value to that person. Basic psychology.

It takes a pretty insecure person to be so easily annoyed by such small degrees of criticism.

jrhilde · September 13, 2013, 09:45 PM

Yep, sort of tough to keep these question /answer things on the subject as each of us is coming from a different background, different hunting situations, and often with a different firearm than the guy posting the thread---how many times have I had to grit my teeth and keep quiet while someone tore into the Remingtons again and commented very poorly on my choice of scope, [inexpensive]---I've been totally happy with the results I get with Bushnells, Nikons and a Leopold or two---
Just got to roll with the input from the forum, everyone has an opinion so just use the info you asked for in the first place, usually when these things go on for two to three pages, you will have the answer to the original question----

haliwa04 · September 14, 2013, 03:08 AM

I picked up the sightron s1 today for $50, going to get the s2 next weekend. For now its in weaver rings on basic weaver bases. I have a pair of leupold rifleman rings, but I believe they only fit rifleman scopes as they were way too small for the s1. Its nice and clear, I like it so far, but I can't wait to shoot the gun with it on.

pilothunter · September 14, 2013, 08:44 AM

Your chosen Weaver rings/base set-up should work fine. I have the multi-slotted bases on a M700Ti I own and they allow for a wide range of ring placements which should allow you to set your eye relief perfectly. I'd suggest setting the eye relief at the lowest or near lowest power. Most rifles are carried with the scope set at low power to enable a wider field of view should a deer "pop" up as you are still-hunting or even simply moving to/from your stand location.

I normally also leave my scope set at low power when sitting on stand and only increase magnification, which normally also changes eye relief, when needed. When game appears at longer ranges and you "zoom" up, you should have time to adjust your cheek weld on the stock for the slightly different eye relief there; same thing at the range. However, if eye relief is not set at low power and you have a quick chance at a short range opportunity, trying to find the target with the wrong eye relief set can cost you a shot.

Good luck with that new rifle & scope!

jrhilde · September 14, 2013, 04:42 PM

Pilothunter is right--it's amazing how much easier it is to set up your scope with the correct eye relief when you use the Weaver bases--if I remember correctly the more common bases have two slots in one pad and and maybe two in the other, these work for some but do limit the scope movement somewhat, whereas the pad set with one pad that has three slots and two in the other makes a big difference----sounds like you are getting pretty well set up and as far as I'm concerned the Sightrons are fine scopes, I know two people who have them and are totally satisfied--- I think you'll end up with a great rifle-----enjoy-----

haliwa04 · September 17, 2013, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pilothunter

Your chosen Weaver rings/base set-up should work fine. I have the multi-slotted bases on a M700Ti I own and they allow for a wide range of ring placements which should allow you to set your eye relief perfectly. I'd suggest setting the eye relief at the lowest or near lowest power. Most rifles are carried with the scope set at low power to enable a wider field of view should a deer "pop" up as you are still-hunting or even simply moving to/from your stand location.

I normally also leave my scope set at low power when sitting on stand and only increase magnification, which normally also changes eye relief, when needed. When game appears at longer ranges and you "zoom" up, you should have time to adjust your cheek weld on the stock for the slightly different eye relief there; same thing at the range. However, if eye relief is not set at low power and you have a quick chance at a short range opportunity, trying to find the target with the wrong eye relief set can cost you a shot.

Good luck with that new rifle & scope!

I cannot find the multi slot bases to save my life. I've looked online, asked a couple shops about them, nothing. Maybe if I give weaver a call. One of the bases was missing a screw, so I called and someone returned my call within 45 minutes and had two new screws in my mailbox in 2 days.
I also set my scopes up at the lowest magnification. Just seems to make sense. I wound up putting the s1 and leupold rings on my 10/22. I'm picking up the s2 Friday, so I figured I'd use the better of the two on my hunting rifle. I measured my longest hunting lane, it came to about 215 yards. I doubt I'll have to take a shot that far, but it'll be comforting to know that I can if the situation comes up. My other stands are max 75 yards, so I'm all good. I'm a little worried about the parallax on both scopes being set at 100 yds but I should be able to work around it.

reynolds357 · September 17, 2013, 07:07 PM

I do not know what power s2 your bought, but if it is under 12 power, parallex will not be significant enough to even be a mild annoyance.

haliwa04 · September 17, 2013, 08:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by reynolds357

I do not know what power s2 your bought, but if it is under 12 power, parallex will not be significant enough to even be a mild annoyance.

Its 3-9x42. What's the best way to fully test for optic quality and find any quirks? When deer season is over, I'll be trying my luck with target shooting and maybe some longer(3-400yard) ranges. My ccp instructor teaches precision rifle and does some swat and law enforcement snipe training, so I was hoping to save up enough to buy some range time with him.

reynolds357 · September 17, 2013, 08:21 PM

The way to test for optical quality is look through it in extreme bright conditions and extreme low light conditions. Can you see in low light through the optic? Do you get a lot of glare in bright light? Do objects look bent close to the edge of the field of view? Do the testing throughout the power range.

To test for mechanical quality, run a box test. At the least, move POI 4" right and 4" up and see if the bullet actually goes where the scope adjustments were supposed to send it. Then, move it back and see if the POI goes back to zero.
The S2 is a good scope. I doubt you will have problems with it. The S1 may or many not meet your expectations.

September 10, 2013, 11:29 PM	#29
haliwa04 Member Join Date: January 15, 2013 Location: Townsville, NC Posts: 93	Re: Scope Mounting S&W(Howa)1500 Thanks for the info. I'll definitely add the nylon lined rings to the list. And if you have anymore info on the 3 slot bases, pm me. I actually ran across a guy selling a Sightron S1 3-9x40 for $50 and a SII 3-9x42 for $100. I think I'll grab both and slap the S1 on my 10/22. That is if they check out and are genuine.

September 11, 2013, 08:41 PM	#33
cdbeagle Senior Member Join Date: January 3, 2012 Location: Justin Texas Posts: 313	We have three Vanguards in the family and I have Warne Bases and Rings mounted on them as we'll as all of our other rifles. They do take the Rem 700 bases. I have two Vortex Vipers and a Crossfire that sits on a Marlin Model 60. The Vipers are great, don't purchase the Crossfire. I've owned three Fulfield II's and have an E1 2x7 on a 336W. I am a fan of them, they are my favorite scope in their price range and someplace usually has them on sale at a very good price. __________________ Assistant Secretary - U.S. Dry Bean Council

September 11, 2013, 08:53 PM	#34
cdbeagle Senior Member Join Date: January 3, 2012 Location: Justin Texas Posts: 313	It is also irritatating to me when you ask a question on a forum and people insist on giving advice on something else, like with your scope choice. Even after you stated that the Simmons was what you were stuck with a few people still HAD to tell you what to do with a scope instead of staying on the subject of rings and bases. __________________ Assistant Secretary - U.S. Dry Bean Council

September 12, 2013, 04:52 AM	#38
cdbeagle Senior Member Join Date: January 3, 2012 Location: Justin Texas Posts: 313	[QUOTE]CDbeagle, people are just trying to help. If you are interested in having a rock solid mounting system, it would be logical to mount something in that mounting system that will perform equally well. I have a couple of 15 year old Simmons scopes that are very good scopes. They were not made in China. The new breed of Simmons is going to cause you anguish. Mounting a Simmons in a set or Warnes, Talley's, or Burris signatures, is kind of like buying a set of custom wheels for your truck and mounting dry rotted tires on them.[\QUOTE] You proved my point. Very few people care to hear unsolicited advice. __________________ Assistant Secretary - U.S. Dry Bean Council

September 14, 2013, 03:08 AM	#44
haliwa04 Member Join Date: January 15, 2013 Location: Townsville, NC Posts: 93	Re: Scope Mounting S&W(Howa)1500 I picked up the sightron s1 today for $50, going to get the s2 next weekend. For now its in weaver rings on basic weaver bases. I have a pair of leupold rifleman rings, but I believe they only fit rifleman scopes as they were way too small for the s1. Its nice and clear, I like it so far, but I can't wait to shoot the gun with it on.

September 10, 2013, 08:30 PM	#27
reynolds357 Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2012 Posts: 6,165	They work like linear bearings and correct all misalignment issues. Basically, you get a set of lapped rings without lapping.

September 10, 2013, 11:24 PM	#28
jrhilde Senior Member Join Date: March 22, 2011 Location: Southern Louisiana Posts: 198	Reynolds is right, they will help correct any misalignment of the rings--also, they hold like crazy, I must have loosened the ring caps half a dozen times while getting the scope aligned vertically and positioned far enough back to get the correct eye relief---I've seen a scope "creep" when tightened down in steel or aluminum rings, but never in these inserts--they hold totally tight and yet leave no marks on the scope at all---I always use the three slot Weaver bases, [ sometimes they have to be special ordered ], so that you have enough mounting options to get the scope back far enough to use properly---another reason for the choice of Prostaff and the Bushnells, they have longer rear bells or eyepieces than many other scopes---- Always seems to come out about right for me when the rear of the scope is directly above the lowest point in the top of the rear section of the stock, the joining area between the pistol grip section and the start of the butt---

September 11, 2013, 01:43 PM	#30
haliwa04 Member Join Date: January 15, 2013 Location: Townsville, NC Posts: 93	I cant find anything on the Burris site about the Posi-Align inserts being made of nylon, they actually look like steel/metal inserts. Is there something i'm missing here?

September 11, 2013, 05:37 PM	#31
jrhilde Senior Member Join Date: March 22, 2011 Location: Southern Louisiana Posts: 198	They are called Burris Signature Zee rings, the nylon inserts are split in an upper and lower half to match the lower ring half unit and the upper ring cap--the inserts are just a tad wider than the rings so that no metal touches the scope--had to have my LGS special order them due to he usually only stocks one pair and had just sold them, also, the Weaver bases are the set with the three notches in one pad and two in the other---allows for considerably more front to rear movement to put the scope where you want it--both the rings and bases are pretty common and your local shop should have no trouble ordering them----

September 11, 2013, 08:19 PM	#32
reynolds357 Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2012 Posts: 6,165	The Signature inserts are made of some non-metal material that is very hard. Nylon? Nyletron? Some kind of hard plastic type material.

September 11, 2013, 09:31 PM	#35
reynolds357 Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2012 Posts: 6,165	CDbeagle, people are just trying to help. If you are interested in having a rock solid mounting system, it would be logical to mount something in that mounting system that will perform equally well. I have a couple of 15 year old Simmons scopes that are very good scopes. They were not made in China. The new breed of Simmons is going to cause you anguish. Mounting a Simmons in a set or Warnes, Talley's, or Burris signatures, is kind of like buying a set of custom wheels for your truck and mounting dry rotted tires on them.

September 12, 2013, 09:56 AM	#39
reynolds357 Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2012 Posts: 6,165	If you do not care to hear unsolicited advice, internet discussion forums are the wrong place for you to be.

September 12, 2013, 10:14 AM	#40
csmsss Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Orange, TX Posts: 3,078	While we're discussing rings, I would not hesitate to recomment Dednutz one piece mounts. As long as you can find one that matches your receiver and scope combination, they completely eliminate all alignment issues. http://www.opticsplanet.com/dednutz-...130912151157:s

September 13, 2013, 08:58 PM	#42
reynolds357 Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2012 Posts: 6,165	I definitely do not get my feelings hurt by someone I could not care less about. For someone to hurt my feelings, I would have to assign some degree of value to that person. Basic psychology. It takes a pretty insecure person to be so easily annoyed by such small degrees of criticism.

September 13, 2013, 09:45 PM	#43
jrhilde Senior Member Join Date: March 22, 2011 Location: Southern Louisiana Posts: 198	Yep, sort of tough to keep these question /answer things on the subject as each of us is coming from a different background, different hunting situations, and often with a different firearm than the guy posting the thread---how many times have I had to grit my teeth and keep quiet while someone tore into the Remingtons again and commented very poorly on my choice of scope, [inexpensive]---I've been totally happy with the results I get with Bushnells, Nikons and a Leopold or two--- Just got to roll with the input from the forum, everyone has an opinion so just use the info you asked for in the first place, usually when these things go on for two to three pages, you will have the answer to the original question----

September 14, 2013, 08:44 AM	#45
pilothunter Junior member Join Date: February 12, 2009 Location: Tn Posts: 400	Your chosen Weaver rings/base set-up should work fine. I have the multi-slotted bases on a M700Ti I own and they allow for a wide range of ring placements which should allow you to set your eye relief perfectly. I'd suggest setting the eye relief at the lowest or near lowest power. Most rifles are carried with the scope set at low power to enable a wider field of view should a deer "pop" up as you are still-hunting or even simply moving to/from your stand location. I normally also leave my scope set at low power when sitting on stand and only increase magnification, which normally also changes eye relief, when needed. When game appears at longer ranges and you "zoom" up, you should have time to adjust your cheek weld on the stock for the slightly different eye relief there; same thing at the range. However, if eye relief is not set at low power and you have a quick chance at a short range opportunity, trying to find the target with the wrong eye relief set can cost you a shot. Good luck with that new rifle & scope!

September 14, 2013, 04:42 PM	#46
jrhilde Senior Member Join Date: March 22, 2011 Location: Southern Louisiana Posts: 198	Pilothunter is right--it's amazing how much easier it is to set up your scope with the correct eye relief when you use the Weaver bases--if I remember correctly the more common bases have two slots in one pad and and maybe two in the other, these work for some but do limit the scope movement somewhat, whereas the pad set with one pad that has three slots and two in the other makes a big difference----sounds like you are getting pretty well set up and as far as I'm concerned the Sightrons are fine scopes, I know two people who have them and are totally satisfied--- I think you'll end up with a great rifle-----enjoy-----

September 17, 2013, 07:07 PM	#48
reynolds357 Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2012 Posts: 6,165	I do not know what power s2 your bought, but if it is under 12 power, parallex will not be significant enough to even be a mild annoyance.

September 17, 2013, 08:21 PM	#50
reynolds357 Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2012 Posts: 6,165	The way to test for optical quality is look through it in extreme bright conditions and extreme low light conditions. Can you see in low light through the optic? Do you get a lot of glare in bright light? Do objects look bent close to the edge of the field of view? Do the testing throughout the power range. To test for mechanical quality, run a box test. At the least, move POI 4" right and 4" up and see if the bullet actually goes where the scope adjustments were supposed to send it. Then, move it back and see if the POI goes back to zero. The S2 is a good scope. I doubt you will have problems with it. The S1 may or many not meet your expectations.