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Old September 24, 2018, 10:52 PM   #1
BlueHawk
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Moving to California

Hi all - I'm moving to California. Am I correct in understanding that no new handgun models have been available there since they passed a law requiring special forensic markings on the ammo? I was thinking about an H&K VP9 or a Gen 5 Glock 19. Is it against California law to go out of state to buy a handgun and bring it back?
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Old September 24, 2018, 11:50 PM   #2
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How are you going to legally buy a handgun in a state in which you are not a resident?
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Old September 25, 2018, 12:22 AM   #3
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You can only take possession of a handgun from a CA FFL.

Federal law prohibits purchasing handguns from an out-of-state FFL. Has to be shipped to an in-state FFL.

Obviously, an in-state FFL won't deliver an illegal gun. You can go to the CA AG's office website to get a list of CA legal handguns.
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Old September 25, 2018, 01:06 AM   #4
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Can someone relocating into California from elsewhere in the U.S. bring in off-roster firearms they already own?
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Old September 25, 2018, 03:20 AM   #5
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I've lived there.....you have my sympathy.
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Old September 25, 2018, 05:37 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueHawk View Post
Hi all - I'm moving to California. Am I correct in understanding that no new handgun models have been available there since they passed a law requiring special forensic markings on the ammo? I was thinking about an H&K VP9 or a Gen 5 Glock 19. Is it against California law to go out of state to buy a handgun and bring it back?
I don't know about CA law, but it is against federal law to do so. Without getting into the nitty-gritty, complete with circles and arrows and legal citations, the short story on federal law governing firearms transfers is:
1. All firearms transfers between residents of different states have to go through an FFL;
2. For long guns, it can be an FFL in either the transferor's or the transferee's state of residence;
3. For handguns, it must be an FFL in the transferee's state of residence.

The question I'd be asking would be: If I buy the handgun before I go, may I take it with me to CA when I move?

ETA: I just noticed that AB had the same thought, only in far fewer words.
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Old September 25, 2018, 03:03 PM   #7
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That was my thought: Buy the gun before moving, and bring it with you to California. Apparently that's legal:

http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/in..._with_firearms

Remember the 10-round magazine capacity limitation. You can bring in any handgun you already own, but you can't bring in magazines larger than 10-round capacity. 10-round magazines are generally available for firearms in current production, but if buying the gun new you'll have to specify that you want one with 10-round magazines. They're out there -- several other states also have 10-round capacity limits.

Last edited by Aguila Blanca; September 25, 2018 at 07:12 PM. Reason: Typo
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Old September 25, 2018, 03:10 PM   #8
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Damn, I didn't realize you had to be a resident of a state to buy a firearm in that state. This whole California thing is turning out to be more burdensome than I thought. I'm moving from Arizona, so it's a dramatic change in legal environments with respect to the right of self-defense, and its corollary, the right to bear arms.
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Old September 25, 2018, 04:00 PM   #9
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I didn't realize you had to be a resident of a state to buy a firearm in that state
That applies to handguns specifically from a Federal point if view. Many states allow their residents to purchase long guns in another state - the purchase and type have to be legal in both states. So, if you, from AZ, went to CO and wanted to buy a rifle, that is OK; the handgun would need to be delivered to your AZ FFL
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Old September 25, 2018, 04:16 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by BlueHawk View Post
Damn, I didn't realize you had to be a resident of a state to buy a firearm in that state. This whole California thing is turning out to be more burdensome than I thought. I'm moving from Arizona, so it's a dramatic change in legal environments with respect to the right of self-defense, and its corollary, the right to bear arms.
As FITASC points out, many states will allow a resident to purchase a long gun out of state. Federal law allows this, provided that the transfer goes through an FFL. Handgun transfers via FFLs have to go through an FFL in the buyer's state of residence, though.

Also, take heed of AB's comments on magazine capacity.
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Old September 25, 2018, 09:55 PM   #11
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However, a California resident will not be able to legally buy a long gun in another State. Federal law requires that the transfer comply with the laws of the transferee’s State of residence. Because California has some unique transfer formalities, a non-California FFL will be unable to comply.
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Old September 26, 2018, 05:13 AM   #12
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^^^^^
I figured you'd know something that hadn't been mentioned. Can he bring an off-roster pistol into CA, though? What about mags?
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Old September 26, 2018, 05:43 AM   #13
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An off roster pistol is fine as long as it doesn’t have a threaded barrel and isn’t an assault weapon (so AR and AK pistols require a more detailed analysis).

Also, in general no magazines holding more than ten rounds.
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Old September 26, 2018, 08:34 AM   #14
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So the bottom line is that BlueHawk should buy his new pistol while he is still resident in Arizona, and be sure to specify that he needs a model with a 10-round magazine. 10-rounders should be available, since many of the northeastern states (New York, Connecticut, Massachusetts, and perhaps New Jersey and Maryland) have 10-round magazine limits.
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Old September 26, 2018, 01:27 PM   #15
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Every time we have a thread where someone is going to a state with restrictions and asks for practical gun related legal advice, folks have to chime in about why are you moving there?

Well, Dear Abby Wannabees, that isn't the question and who cares about your opinion of the move in general. If you can answer the legal question, good. If not - shush.

Such deleted.
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Old September 26, 2018, 06:42 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank Ettin View Post
An off roster pistol is fine as long as it doesn’t have a threaded barrel and isn’t an assault weapon (so AR and AK pistols require a more detailed analysis).

Also, in general no magazines holding more than ten rounds.
Frank, there's a similar thread over at THR: https://www.thehighroad.org/index.ph...fornia.841651/

In that thread, this was cited: https://oag.ca.gov/firearms/ab991 for the proposition that one moving to CA has to either register or sell each of the firearms that the person is bringing into the state. Does that ring any bells for you?
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Old September 26, 2018, 06:49 PM   #17
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That is correct. There’s a form on the DOJ website for doing the registration.
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Old September 26, 2018, 11:12 PM   #18
Aguila Blanca
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spats McGee
Frank, there's a similar thread over at THR: https://www.thehighroad.org/index.ph...fornia.841651/

In that thread, this was cited: https://oag.ca.gov/firearms/ab991 for the proposition that one moving to CA has to either register or sell each of the firearms that the person is bringing into the state. Does that ring any bells for you?
The registration requirement is addressed in the CalGuns link I provided in post #7. You have 60 days from the date you first brought the guns into California to register them or dispose of them.
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Old September 27, 2018, 05:07 AM   #19
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Clearly, I should have followed that link & need to spend more time familiarizing myself with CA law.
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Old September 27, 2018, 08:28 AM   #20
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Damn, I didn't realize you had to be a resident of a state to buy a firearm in that state.
Handguns have been that way since 1968 ( Gun Control Act)
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Old September 28, 2018, 01:12 AM   #21
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To expand on what FITASC wrote, since California is the state mentioned in the OP: California has a roster of approved handguns. If you log onto Bud's Gunshop and order up a handgun that's not on the roster, and if Bud's doesn't decline the sale on their end, the handgun has to be transferred to the buyer through a California FFL. And a California FFL can't transfer a handgun that's not on the roster.

Catch-22.

The same applies if a California resident goes across the border to Arizona looking to buy a handgun. A private party can't sell a handgun to a resident of another state, so the sale has to be made by an FFL in AZ. The AZ FFL has to ship the handgun to an FFL in California to make the final transfer, and the gun has to be on the roster or the CA FFL can't make the transfer.

Last edited by Spats McGee; September 28, 2018 at 04:00 AM. Reason: Thread cleanup
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Old September 28, 2018, 04:02 AM   #22
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I've done some thread cleanup. Let's stick to CA law and avoid discussion of what other State's laws may allow. CA gun law is tricky enough without muddying the waters.
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Old September 28, 2018, 07:03 AM   #23
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So, it sounds like if you are moving to California for some reason, you should buy, then register as many popular, off-roster handguns as you can. Then sell or trade.
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Old September 28, 2018, 07:08 AM   #24
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The same applies if a California resident goes across the border to Arizona looking to buy a handgun. A private party can't sell a handgun to a resident of another state, so the sale has to be made by an FFL in AZ. The AZ FFL has to ship the handgun to an FFL in California to make the final transfer, and the gun has to be on the roster or the CA FFL can't make the transfer.
Are you saying that CA FFLs won't accept a gun for transfer from an out of state NON-FFL? Is that part of the new regs?
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Old September 28, 2018, 10:35 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by FITASC
Are you saying that CA FFLs won't accept a gun for transfer from an out of state NON-FFL? Is that part of the new regs?
I may have misstated. I thought the federal law for handguns was that a cross-border sale had to go through an FFL on both ends. If that's not the case, I apologize for (as Spats said) muddying the waters. If I'm wrong, I have been guilty of extrapolating from my state's rules to the other 49.
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