Battle of the Budget 9mm's

[Brando1992]

So this isn't an official write up or anything, I have a friend who is looking to spend roughly $350 on his first handgun. Being one who firmly believes you get what you pay for I opted to tell him to save his pennies. But I also believe there are those few exceptions to those rules if you search hard enough. So after weeks of discussions with him, now I'm curious to what the best budget handgun is...

As the TNP guys know, gotta start out with philosophy of use. He wants a full size combat gun to use as home defense and fun out at the range, but also likes the idea of concealed carry later. so he wants something big and fun to shoot and is okay with the idea of buying a separate carry piece later. (personally I am all for getting used to carrying a larger gun to start with, and stick with, in 2 years i've been through 4 carry guns and have landed on the glock 19)

The guns me and him have discussed:

Taurus PT111 (found for roughly $200 right now with rebate)
Ruger 9E ($300)
Canik TP9SA ($340)
S&W SD9VE ($300)
(all prices reflect what I have seen locally, Texas - yeehaw)

So obviously I did some pros and cons:

Taurus PT111

Pros:
Price
Decent trigger
Could concealed carry

Cons:
It's a Taurus (the only one I've owned spent more time getting repairs then on my belt, it was sold almost immediately)
It's a subcompact which means less accuracy and lower round count
Would be an ok range gun, not great


Canik tp9sa

Pros:
Full size handgun
Great trigger
Great accuracy
18+1 round count
Great range gun
Comes with a ton of stuff including extra mags and a good holster

Cons:
It has a de-cocker which some people say no defensive single action handgun should have... In reality I don't think that's an issue at all. Other than slightly annoying.
You could conceal carry this one if you wanted to wear a overcoat everywhere you went.. It's not small.


Ruger 9e

Pros:
Full size gun
Great manufacturer
Great warranty
Great line of aftermarket accessories and upgrades to improve accuracy.
Good sights
Extremely accurate
17+1
The big brother to the sr9c(my first carry gun which I loved) but the affordable version of the sr9 all same components that matter with a more matte finish and reduced milling time on the slide perforations (honestly I think it feels better than the sr9)

Cons:
Has a safety (depends on how you look at it, that might be a pro)


S&W SD9VE

Pros:
Almost exact design as a glock 19(my current EDC)
Could conceal carry
Harder to conceal than the pt111 but more accurate
Great company
Good amount of aftermarket parts available

Cons:
Not the worlds greatest trigger but I hear it breaks in nicely. But a bad reset.
(not at deal breaker in the $300 range)


Final thoughts and order of which I would buy:

Ruger 9e I believe this is the best handgun on the market for what it gives you and the price you pay.
Canik is slightly behind the 9e still I am very interested in it.
Taurus pt111 is a gamble but could be a great deal just not a great range gun. (It's a do all gun so it does everything but isn't great at anything - only exception to this rule is the Glock 19... after you upgrade the trigger and sights and have $650 invested in it... guilty)
Sw9ve solid gun I would only buy if I didn't have the glock 19. It's a great gun that does just about everything it's just not super easy to carry but still better than a full sized gun.

Now with this we could go down every rabbit hole ever chasing the used market for guns, so for the sake of discussion the only used guns that should be brought up would be commonly found police trade ins.

Let me also add i would like to pretty much keep this discussion around 9mm or .40 s&w. Also I understand almost every kel tec ever made would make it under the $350 budget but there is a reason they are not on the list. (bad quality control, cheap guns, I dont really care for them and wouldn't trust them as a defensive gun, nor would I suggest them to a friend to use just because they are cheap)

So there is my research so far I hope someone finds it useful! What are you guys thinking? What would you consider to be the best budget guns on the market? What the best bang for your buck and why?

[Limnophile]

I'd consider a Canik C-100: http://www.academy.com/shop/browse/p...ce:&pageSize:&.

It's a compact, so it's carriable, and with its metal frame will be comfortable to shoot at the range. It will do everything well for his budget, and he can get a dedicated range gun later if he still wants one. It's a CZ 75 Compact knockoff, so the ergonomics are almost sure to be good.

[sigarms228]

Interesting topic that comes up quite a bit.

It's hard to figure out what someone else expects from a firearm to make a recommendation, especially a pistol. To me it does not make sense to go to cheap on a pistol if one is going to shoot it much because in the long run ammo costs and range fees will dwarf the cost of the firearm so why not get something that will really work well. On the other hand some will buy a pistol and shoot 100 rounds through it maybe twice a year. Others I see shooting at a 18 inch wide target 5 yards away and are happy just getting the majority anywhere on the target let alone any semblance of a group.

My personal favorite budget pistol by far is the poly frame SIG SP2022. For a long time you could buy one for well under $400 though lately they have gone up some. The SP2022 is a quality SIG through and through that is rock solid reliable, durable, crazy accurate, and nice trigger out of the box.

The Walther PPX could be another fine choice in a budget pistol that I believe is near $300 these days though I have not shot one myself.

Another budget pistol that I have heard a lot of good about is the CZ P07 that goes for around $450 though the first generation CZ P07 can be found under $400.

When someone asks me for help picking out a pistol I discourage them from setting a hard price target reminding them it can be much more expensive NOT getting what would work well for them as their first choice.

[Brando1992]

Limnophile - good call, definitely worth looking into I honestly saw one at Academy earlier this week and didn't even give it a second thought. Have you shot one? If so whats the trigger like? I know cz75's have great triggers, how does it compare?

Sigarms228 - Ive been interested in the sig sp2022 i just know its out of his price range, I also like the 250 DAO, it just has a buttery trigger pull for a DAO. I would tend to agree with you on everything you said. In my buds situation he is a newly wed and his wife doesn't necessarily agree with that train of thought right now. So he isn't setting the budget, she is. But like I said, I feel like you get what you pay for in a firearm, just trying to help him get the best gun he can for the money..

[tahunua001]

I would say probably the Ruger 9E is your best bet. I have the SR9, which is basically the 9E with a fancier finish and an extra mag. it's an excellent gun, one of my daily carries. I have not owned the Canik tp9SA but have owned the TP9 DA/SA and I was not very impressed with it: Heavy trigger, strange site adjustment, poor accuracy.

I am not a fan of S&W's semis but that's a matter of personal preference and dislike for their triggers, therefor I have nothing to tell you about the SD series. as for the taurus, I have watched their revolvers lock up tighter than a vegans sphincter at the sight of a breakfast burrito, I really wouldn't trust their semis anymore.

[AzShooter]

I'd buy the Smith.

I have one and the trigger gets better the more you shoot it. Apex Tactical.Com offers and upgrade for the trigger that will make it break at 4 1/2 to 5 lbs.

Slide is a bit difficult to work when new but it breaks in. You can also get a lighter spring.

Accuracy was very good for a small 9mm.

Good price range.

[leadcounsel]

I own and/or have shot probably 80% of modern handguns and their derivatives/sisters on the market. Ruger, Smith, XD, Glock, Sig, HK, CZ, Taurus, Springfield, etc.

Hands down the EAA SAR B6P, currently on sale for $230. Yep, $230 at CDNN. Or the compact for $240.

Unreal how cheap guns have gotten. Kinda kicking myself for having a stable of $500 Glocks and CZs, and $600 Sigs and HKs.

Excellent reviews on the web. Check out these, same pistol in black:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DoiqJ6Cz6OU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0SZ35l0z7o


The EAA SAR is a near identical clone of the CZ. It's a polymer that takes CZ mags. The trigger, finish, design, nice positive safety, the sights, chrome barrel, steel guide rod, etc. is all just fabulous and should be a $500 gun. The trigger in SA is on par with a 1911 - it's that good.

I've started hoarding them, frankly. I cannot believe how good of a gun this is.

Look no further, hands down, this gun will not disappoint. The only drawback is the single magazine, but MecGar CZ 75 mags are super common and affordable around $25.

[Brando1992]

loving all this input. very interested in the EAA now. Might have to pick one up for those prices...

[shaunpain]

Check out http://summitgunbroker.com/ for great prices on awesome guns. I've bought a few screaming deals from Mark and he's a pleasure to deal with. I'm seeing Gen 3 Glock 22s for $279. Not a 9mm, but something to ponder.

[Limnophile]

Brando,

I have never had the opportunity to touch a Canik. I own CZs, and like leadcounsel, I am impressed by the prices that Turkish knockoffs can be had for. I've read that the fit and finish of Caniks is superior to CZs. Some custom parts can be found at Cajun Gun Works.

I second leadcounsel's recommendation of the SAR B6P for the price he mentions -- how can you go wrong? Like Canik, Sarsilmaz is Turkish.

The EAA Pavona is another option, although it is targeted at women. The black framed Pavonas may be carriable by a man without lowering the testosterone level.

[CajunBass]

Not long ago I wanted a 9mm semi for shooting at the range. I didn't care about the concealed carry aspect since it wasn't going to be used for that. If it was cheap, and worked I'd probably use it as a house gun and leave my nice S&W revolvers in the safe.

As always, I looked in the used section. I found a Ruger P-95DC with a ten round magazine. That's a conventional DA/SA with a decocker. Ten round magazine is plenty good enough for me at the range and for a house gun. Big, heavy gun, but like all Rugers about as solid as a trailer ball.



Man that thing is fun at the range. It eats any ammo I've fired in it, which is always my reloads. Soft recoil. Decent sights (with a dab of orange nail polish), decent trigger. This thing puts a grin on my face every time I shoot it. And it shoots as well as I can shoot any gun. My wife shoots it better than she does her Glock 17. It also dumps the empties in a neat little pile at the range making them easy to sweep up and dump back into my range bag.

I paid $250.00 for it. I'm a revolver guy really who from time to time dabbles with a semi. Usually I keep them for a while, remember what I don't like about semi's and sell them off again. This one I plan to keep.

[A pause for the COZ]

These day as long as you dont expect to get a SIG for $250 you should be fine with just about any of the choices. You can get a lemon from any of them and a great gun from any of them.
I have two of the ones you mention.

PT111 Millennium pro and a Canik TP9.

The PT111 has been flawless through 1000's of rounds and it eats any 9mm ammo I put in it. Very good feed ramp. I tried carrying it but I found it does not fit my hand perfectly. Every time I pull it from the holster and present it.
Its aiming slightly down and I need to reset my grip. Not some thing I want in a CC situation. But as a range gun or tramping around the home stead its been fine.
Right now its job is a stash gun in my bath room. Always worried what I would do if some one broke in while I was taking care of business.

The canik is a good gun. Its not as forgiving with ammo as the PT111 it has a much narrower and sharper feed ramp. So your not going to be able to get creative with your loading. All ball loads have fed fine though.

I like them both for different reasons. But the SAR is what I wanted and I ended up buying the Canik because it was there and I had the money in hand.
Wish I had gotten the SAR have only heard good things about it.

Other options out there are some police trade ins.
I picked up a Beretta 92s ( Italian Police trade in) for a whopping $290.
Thing is awesome!!! and its a real Beretta.

Also got a Spanish Police trade in Star model B. Basically think 1911 in 9mm.
Other than holster wear, It was not shot much the mechanical s are like new.
Got that one for $239

[skizzums]

I own the Tri-Star T100, it's simply amazing for the price, half-dozen thousands of rounds of all different shapes and sizes and never a single malfunction. the finish faked ff after the first year and half due to the alloy frame, I would prefer to buy the satin chrome or a steel frame, the blue just doesn't stick. the Tri-Star is great at everything, except for carrying. it's not too heavy, but even though it's a compact, t's too big for summer carry. holds 15 rounds. I think the EAA SAR is a better carry pistol and cheaper. The SAR's sights are better and straighter. both have great triggers, but scale slides in Canik's favor.

Taurus PT111, also a great gun. I am still amazed at the 199$ price tag. it has taken over carry duty that the shield used to fill. honestly they feel the same in terms of size, the shield has a better trigger, but the PT wins on features. It has adjustable sights, loaded chamber indicator, manual safety, second strike and holds 12 + 1. I don't know of anything in it's size that isn't DAO that shares a capacity that large. mine is very reliable, it has very steep feed ramps to fit the rounds in the small frame, chokes on a couple very wide mouthed HP's. also will jam if using the slide lock as a slide release. the trigger takes bit to get used to, but when you do it grows on you. I still get a pinch between the frame and back of trigger sometimes. the Taurus isn't perfect, but it's reliable and have scores of reviews sharing that same view. for the size, capacity and especially price, hard to beat for a discreet carry gun. I have a couple thousand rounds and no failures excluding a couple incompatible ammo's.

the SD9VE was one of the few guns that didn't shoot well and was not reliable. I know this is contrary to most peoples experience, but mine was not good. lots of failures toward the bottoms of the magazines, several. shot terribly. great capacity and ease of use. bulky, heavy and featureless, trigger is not terrible but pretty poor for a simple striker.

the Canik/Tri-Star is a far better gun, as it the EAA. out of the OP's opening list, I feel the Taurus is the only real carry option though, at least for me and my job.

[drobs]

Heard nothing but good things about the Canik.

Aim Surplus still has gen 2 G19's for $360
http://www.aimsurplus.com/product.as...ement+Trade+In

Summit Gunbroker as previously mentioned has a good deal on G21's right now - $369
http://summitgunbroker.com/glock-21-ns.html

[skizzums]

I just realized that COZ's review and mine are totally opposite. My Canik is what I use when my other guns don't like my handloaded. You wanna shoot cast .358 semi-wads, no problem as well as any other cast loads, from flats to pointy, it just keeps eating. It's the only pistol I have ever had that has truly never had a malfunction, none. The PT on the other hand will not feed flats, but does well with everything but that and some very very wide HPs from Sierra meant for .380's, the Canik love's em though. I will have to compare the ramps side by side, but I believe that the PT is significantly higher angled.

[Radny97]

+1 canik/tristar and eaa

[Brando1992]

COZ and Skizzums i think yall might be talking about two different guns the canik tp9 and tp9sa, ive heard the tp9sa fixed a lot of the flaws of the original tp9

[JDBerg]

My write-in vote goes to the Walther PPS 9mm, $387.00 at Bud's

[skizzums]

I would steer you away from the Taurus for someone "first" handgun. I would steer you away from ANY sub-compact pistol for first handgun. I think the canik/Tri-Star or EAA SAR would be a perfect choice, the SAR has a thinner grip, which is good because the Canik's are bit beefy and hard for some to reach the trigger.(please note: I do not own the variant in the OP, I own the CZ75 compact type, I do not know anything about the TP's).

there are a zillion affordable duty to compact size 9mm's with a great reputation and price tag, literally an endless list in the 400$ range. I would suggest your friend shoots some handguns if possible, and at very least put his hands on a lot of different kinds, even if only at the counter. then make a list of a few that seemed to fit(hands and budget), and come back and ask opinions on those specific models. I went through several before finding some that I liked, I had no clue what I wanted or what each was like, I senta couple years buying and trading before coming to the conclusion that I like mid-sized SA/DA 9mm's the best for target and that I really needed a sub-compact for comfortable carry.

[cc-hangfire]

Following up on this ^^^^^^^,

For a first handgun go with the "top tier" manufacturers , in your list that'd be Ruger or S&W. The others make good guns but look at the total perspective of: aftermarket holsters & magazines, customer service, out-of-the-box quality, and long term parts and maintenance. IMHO, Ruger and S&W win from that viewpoint.

I have built my collection from used guns, & I've found mostly great deals (I don't mind external wear since I only have shooters) and a couple of very old guns have been not-so-good. If you consider used handguns, it opens a whole other world but a new shooter might not be comfortable with that idea. Sometimes you'll need to tinker on a used gun to get it running right, and not everybody likes doing that.

[T. O'Heir]

"...what's the trigger like?..." Factory triggers are irrelevant. ALL new firearms require a trigger job due to frivolous law suits.
The only thing that matters is how well any handgun fits his hand. Go with him while he tries a bunch on for size. Changing grips can usually fix 'too small', but nothing fixes 'too big'.
Tell him to think about the cost of extra mags too. A mag for that giant Walther PPS 9mm runs $40 at Midway. $24.99 for a Glock 17/34.
Also, 'used' is not a cuss word when it comes to firearms. Takes a lot of abuse to damage a modern pistol. Sometimes you can get a used higher end pistol for the same kind of money as BNIB a lower end piece.
Canik's are imported by Century Arms from Turkey. RUN, do not walk, from any firearm Century had anything to do with.

[RCJH]

My thing is this... If you cant afford to buy a $600+ gun or around there, you probably should wait until you can afford to buy it.. Dont settle, when saving a little bit more will give you a much better result. Look at other options such as used guns and things of that nature, that might help him get a better quality gun for something still closer to his budget. Just because they're used, doesnt mean they're not good.

[B.O.F.H.]

Used is the only way to go in the sub $350 arena. I recently saw a Ruger sr9c going for $349. Glocks can commonly be found in this price range. Guns that normally cost $400 - $450 can be found in this arena as well. Springfield xds, m&ps, and 2022s just to name a few.

The Turkish guns are definitely made well, but I wonder for how long and also worry about spare parts. The Stoeger Cougar being the only exception.

[tahunua001]

"...what's the trigger like?..." Factory triggers are irrelevant. ALL new firearms require a trigger job due to frivolous law suits.

what? I'm going to need that explained.

[WVsig]

Honestly tell him to save up to the $450 to $550 range and things will really open up for him. He will be able to pick a pistol that will work for him instead of shoe horning himself into a platform to meet a $$$ figure.