Mossberg 930 combo 18.5" and 28" - good first shotgun? - Page 2

jgcoastie · September 22, 2009, 01:20 AM

Quote:

Hope yours doesn't kick as hard as mine does... even with light bulk pack loads it's pretty brutal.

Really? Mine has been a kitty-cat to shoot... Even with Black Cloud pouring out of the muzzle for hours on end...

colostomyclown · September 22, 2009, 01:30 AM

if you can get it for that price, go for it. Mossberg has awesome customer service should anything ever go wrong with it. If the deal is no longer on the table at the time of decision, I suggest a Mossberg 500a combo with 18.5" barrel and 28" barrel. I own a 590A1 and I STILL want a "cheap" blued 500 as my go to gun, mostly in this case because my 590a1 is a safe queen. The 500's like abuse. They come out of the box feeling cheap and rough and they only get better the more you work them. They end up being smoothe as glass. My shotgun of choice overall is a simple, blued 500a. It's the sweet spot of pump shotguns - rugged, ridiculous dependability, simple easy to maintain design and low price.

LanceOregon · September 22, 2009, 05:25 AM

Quote:

Really? Mine has been a kitty-cat to shoot... Even with Black Cloud pouring out of the muzzle for hours on end...

You have rather peculiar kitty cats.

A light 12 gauge target load has more recoil energy than a rifle in .270 Winchester. And a magnum load of Buckshot? Heck, it easily outclasses the .375 H&H Magnum.

You are talking recoil equal to a powerful magnum class rifle when using any standard or magnum Buckshot loads.

--

hogdogs · September 22, 2009, 05:34 AM

Quote:

A light 12 gauge target load has more recoil energy than a rifle in .270 Winchester. And a magnum load of Buckshot? Heck, it easily outclasses the .375 H&H Magnum.

I am not scientific enuff to dispute this but I will say that in equal weight guns, I would much rather light off 2 3/4 slugs by the dozen from a pump than a .300 win mag once... Might be less "force" but sure has a lot more "sharpness" to the recoil... There is simply no possible way a semi isn't going to soak up a little of this recoil compared to a "solid action" design...
Brent

oneounceload · September 22, 2009, 08:28 AM

Here's a recoil comparison chart I found. According to this, a 270 has approximately 16-17 ft/lbs, while a 12 gauge, 1-1/4 oz load of shot has 32, basically double, and that 300 WM?? almost 26.

Might want to rethink that idea hogdogs.....

http://survivalmonkey.com/forum/showthread.php?p=44085

hogdogs · September 22, 2009, 02:34 PM

OOL, I don't dispute the numbers... It is how it puts it to my shoulder... Basically we can agree that a 34 ton yacht would have more inertia force than a 23 foot boat... that yacht at 6 knots is gonna "thump the dock if out of control but that little boat will whack it at 12 knots... both are doing damage but the slower boat feels like you can grab the bow rail and stop it by hand...

Heck them .30-30 lever revolution have a sharper report and a "crispier" recoil compared to a cheap winchester with equal weight bullet... I am guessing a hotter or faster burn powder is the reason...
Brent

oneounceload · September 22, 2009, 03:38 PM

OR the stock on one of those guns fits you better.....

LanceOregon · September 22, 2009, 05:19 PM

oneounce:

Chuckhawks has some similar recoil tables available on his website too, where one can easily compare different recoil figures for both typical rifle and shotgun ammo. This has been clearly documented many, many times.

Anyone who claims that shotguns don't recoil more has not shot that many different calibers of guns. For the difference is most readily apparent.

And that is the #1 reason why I only shoot gas operated autoloading shotguns. The difference in felt recoil for them compared to over-under or pump shotguns is also easily apparent.

I used to own a Winchester Defender pump action shotgun. But recoil from that gun was so extremely fierce when using either standard or magnum buckshot loads, that it was literally a pain to shoot.

My FN SLP police autoloader that I got to replace it, though, is both a heavier gun with a longer barrel, and it has the great Browning Gas system to help absorb some of the harshness of the recoil.

It is still quite a bit to handle, but it is not as punishing to the shoulder.

--

oneounceload · September 22, 2009, 05:57 PM

Lance - not going to dispute that an auto will shoot softer than a pump - generally the pump is lighter and doesn't have the benefit of spreading the recoil over a period of milliseconds. HOWEVER, that being said.....compared to an O/U, it really depends on the weight of the gun.....If you are shooting a 7# semi, and I'm shooting a 8-1/2 or 9# O/U, then I win the recoil absorption game, especially because my O/U will also shoot 7/8 or 3/4 oz 2-3/4 DE 12 gauge loads, while semis won't cycle them.

Now, if you're talking identical weight guns, identical weight shells, then YES, a semi will seem softer

zippy13 · September 22, 2009, 09:34 PM

Oneounceload, my friend, again the topic turns to comparing rifle and shotgun recoil in ft/lbs of energy while neglecting the time factor. The shotgun distributes its recoil energy roughly two to three times slower than a rifle. Recoil starts with ignition and ends with last of the ejecta. High velocity rifles do it much faster than shotguns, so the felt recoil is transferred over a shorter period (rifles punch and shotguns push).
Numbers don't lie, but they can be ignored. Omitting a critical dimension (time) gives an erroneous view.

jgcoastie · September 26, 2009, 01:52 AM

Quote:

You have rather peculiar kitty cats.

Nope, I do however have a rather peculiar Limbsaver though...

I will add to Brent's statement of "fit". A rifle or shotgun that fits the shooter will have less felt recoil than one that does not particularly fit the shooter... Rather common actually, especially among shotgunners... Some guns don't "kick" as hard as others, even with identical loads. Why? Because some guns fit some shooters better than others, decreasing the amount of felt recoil to one particular spot on the shoulder by distributing the energy to the entire shoulder... Which mitigates the sharp pain incurred when shooting a gun that doesn't fit you well.

September 22, 2009, 01:30 AM	#27
colostomyclown Senior Member Join Date: February 22, 2009 Posts: 613	if you can get it for that price, go for it. Mossberg has awesome customer service should anything ever go wrong with it. If the deal is no longer on the table at the time of decision, I suggest a Mossberg 500a combo with 18.5" barrel and 28" barrel. I own a 590A1 and I STILL want a "cheap" blued 500 as my go to gun, mostly in this case because my 590a1 is a safe queen. The 500's like abuse. They come out of the box feeling cheap and rough and they only get better the more you work them. They end up being smoothe as glass. My shotgun of choice overall is a simple, blued 500a. It's the sweet spot of pump shotguns - rugged, ridiculous dependability, simple easy to maintain design and low price. Last edited by colostomyclown; September 22, 2009 at 01:36 AM.

September 22, 2009, 08:28 AM	#30
oneounceload Junior member Join Date: April 18, 2008 Location: N. Central Florida Posts: 8,518	Here's a recoil comparison chart I found. According to this, a 270 has approximately 16-17 ft/lbs, while a 12 gauge, 1-1/4 oz load of shot has 32, basically double, and that 300 WM?? almost 26. Might want to rethink that idea hogdogs..... http://survivalmonkey.com/forum/showthread.php?p=44085

September 22, 2009, 02:34 PM	#31
hogdogs Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 31, 2007 Location: Western Florida panhandle Posts: 11,069	OOL, I don't dispute the numbers... It is how it puts it to my shoulder... Basically we can agree that a 34 ton yacht would have more inertia force than a 23 foot boat... that yacht at 6 knots is gonna "thump the dock if out of control but that little boat will whack it at 12 knots... both are doing damage but the slower boat feels like you can grab the bow rail and stop it by hand... Heck them .30-30 lever revolution have a sharper report and a "crispier" recoil compared to a cheap winchester with equal weight bullet... I am guessing a hotter or faster burn powder is the reason... Brent

September 22, 2009, 03:38 PM	#32
oneounceload Junior member Join Date: April 18, 2008 Location: N. Central Florida Posts: 8,518	OR the stock on one of those guns fits you better.....

September 22, 2009, 05:19 PM	#33
LanceOregon Junior member Join Date: May 10, 2008 Location: Oregon Posts: 2,774	oneounce: Chuckhawks has some similar recoil tables available on his website too, where one can easily compare different recoil figures for both typical rifle and shotgun ammo. This has been clearly documented many, many times. Anyone who claims that shotguns don't recoil more has not shot that many different calibers of guns. For the difference is most readily apparent. And that is the #1 reason why I only shoot gas operated autoloading shotguns. The difference in felt recoil for them compared to over-under or pump shotguns is also easily apparent. I used to own a Winchester Defender pump action shotgun. But recoil from that gun was so extremely fierce when using either standard or magnum buckshot loads, that it was literally a pain to shoot. My FN SLP police autoloader that I got to replace it, though, is both a heavier gun with a longer barrel, and it has the great Browning Gas system to help absorb some of the harshness of the recoil. It is still quite a bit to handle, but it is not as punishing to the shoulder. --

September 22, 2009, 05:57 PM	#34
oneounceload Junior member Join Date: April 18, 2008 Location: N. Central Florida Posts: 8,518	Lance - not going to dispute that an auto will shoot softer than a pump - generally the pump is lighter and doesn't have the benefit of spreading the recoil over a period of milliseconds. HOWEVER, that being said.....compared to an O/U, it really depends on the weight of the gun.....If you are shooting a 7# semi, and I'm shooting a 8-1/2 or 9# O/U, then I win the recoil absorption game, especially because my O/U will also shoot 7/8 or 3/4 oz 2-3/4 DE 12 gauge loads, while semis won't cycle them. Now, if you're talking identical weight guns, identical weight shells, then YES, a semi will seem softer

September 22, 2009, 09:34 PM	#35
zippy13 Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2008 Location: SoCal Posts: 6,442	Oneounceload, my friend, again the topic turns to comparing rifle and shotgun recoil in ft/lbs of energy while neglecting the time factor. The shotgun distributes its recoil energy roughly two to three times slower than a rifle. Recoil starts with ignition and ends with last of the ejecta. High velocity rifles do it much faster than shotguns, so the felt recoil is transferred over a shorter period (rifles punch and shotguns push). Numbers don't lie, but they can be ignored. Omitting a critical dimension (time) gives an erroneous view.