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Old December 18, 2024, 11:41 PM   #26
TunnelRat
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Originally Posted by Screwball View Post
Percentage of people on gun forums that fired their gun in self defense…

Personally, my life is definitely worth more than $1,500 to me. My previously mentioned P7M8 was $2,400… again, if I need to use it to defend myself or anyone else… zero hesitation. Granted, I’m in L/E, so it may be a little different mindset… but if my $2,400 pistol allows me to do what I need to (stop the threat), I’m happy with it.

Guns are tools. If it’s a collector piece or sentimental item… I get it. I have guns like that. But again, not sentimental to me if I’m dead.

I’m mostly in this same camp, though less from a lack of sentimentality and more from the potential reality of a self defense shooting.

To back up a bit, I have pistols that cost 4x other pistols I own. I will be honest and say that I do not believe my chances to defend myself are 4x greater with those more expensive pistols. I do think the more expensive pistols are often more enjoyable to shoot. There is an argument that the added accuracy and precision may translate to an increased probability of survival, but again my own results on a timer and on paper do not suggest 4x the improvement. To that end I do not think a person needs a more expensive pistol per se. But not everything in life is about need. I have fired 100,00+ rd through pistols, and not once at another person. To an earlier point, I don’t think self defense has to be a part of this discussion. A person can just enjoy shooting.

Now all of that said, in an actual self defense shooting a person may face a criminal trial, a civil trial, damage to their property, and the physical injury and mental anguish of both themselves and their family members (I grant that individual state laws will impact potential legal proceedings). Relative to all of that do I think the $1500 I spent on the pistol will be my primary concern? No. If I did believe my chances to survive a defensive encounter were improved by carrying the more expensive pistol then I would, and without much concern. Frankly I do carry those more expensive pistols I mentioned above and I do not have any more concern than when I carry the less expensive ones.
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Old December 19, 2024, 12:23 AM   #27
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@Screwball, I mentioned the cheapest gun that will “reliably get the job done”. I’m not saying to use a piece of garbage that won’t shoot straight or a jam-o-matic. I also added a LOL in there to denote humor. However, I’m not putting my CZ TSO in my nightstand safe even though it is a fantastic shooting gun.

I believe in carrying a decent gun that is reliable and that will shoot well. The most important part of a gunfight is having a gun (or not being there in the first place). That means whatever I choose must be fairly easy to carry (and conceal in Florida”, while being corrosion resistant. For home defense, a pistol is just to get me to a long gun.
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Old December 19, 2024, 12:42 AM   #28
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I’ve been impressed by a few different guns through the years but most recently I have to say that my S&W Shield Plus ( 9mm) has surprisingly impressed me quite a bit.

Back around 2021ish I decided that I may want a small auto loader to be used for occasional carry if for some reason I felt that I needed more capacity than my LCR could afford me (plus it was another excuse to buy a new gun). After renting about every micro/sub compact auto loader at the three ranges I frequent I found that I shot the Glock 43X the best out of all of them. However there was one huge issue that I consistently encountered when shooting this model (regardless of which range I rented it from), it hurt my trigger finger…bad. I had to take a break after five or six shots in most cases. I own Glocks! What's up with that?

Anyways I ended up getting the Shield Plus since it seemed to be the closest thing to a second place winner in my rather unscientific shooting trials.

As I have gotten to know this little fella better it has really grown on me or shall I say I have adapted so greatly to the Shield Plus that it feels almost natural to use anymore and I am about as accurate with it as anything else at shorter in-house distances. In other words, I have confidence in this gun.

Having acquired a second Shield Plus (30SC this time) I opted to turn the 9mm into a dedicated home defense pistol. I’ve decked it out with a set of Truglo TFX Pro sights on top and a Streamlight TLR6 HL on the bottom. That way we’re ready for all lighting conditions which we might encounter around the casa.
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Old December 19, 2024, 03:08 AM   #29
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I wonder why anyone thinks the current cost of the gun matters in defending your life. Sure, it matters in what you're going to consider purchasing, but that's it, from what I can see..

For the past four decades plus, my defense guns have been ones I paid 3-400 dollars for, and they are good, high quality guns that have proven to function reliably and accurately.

Today those guns go for 7-900 or a bit more, the only thing that has changed (besides me) is how much cash you'll have to shell out to get one.

I'm not paying $1500, let alone $2500 for an ordinary service class pistol, and while my life is worth a lot to me, those guns are not.
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Old December 19, 2024, 09:10 AM   #30
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I'm not sure what raw dollar figures have to do with whether one is serious about self-defense or not. As 44 AMP points out there are many excellent, reliable options on the market for under $500.

One of my primary go-to self defense guns cost me $210... a Smith & Wesson 049 Airweight Centennial .38.

Of course, I bought it 30 years ago, but I didn't see a time delimiter in the raw dollar amount discussion.

Anyhoo... don't get caught up in the "it if costs more it's more better!" trap.

A couple of the worst guns I've ever seen were expensive as hell and despite their raw dollar cost there's no way I would have ever considered using one for self defense.
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Old December 19, 2024, 09:51 AM   #31
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Let's focus on home defense guns with a price tag of <$1500 if possible.

I took my HK P30 and P2000SK to the range yesterday. The P30 was dead accurate. I used to think I was a terrible shooter .

However, what impressed me the most was the P2000SK. That tiny thing enabled me to shoot as accurately as my P30. I did use a 15-round magazine, so that half-inch extension to the grip perhaps helped. I suspect the main reason it was so accurate was due to the weight of the slide. That handgun surely feel top heavy.
Sig X-Five Competition. German model. I would love have made it a safe-queen, but I shoot too darn good with it to do that. It is by far my favorite gun to shoot.

Life's too short not to take one of your safe queens and make it your primary shooter.
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Old December 19, 2024, 10:25 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 44 AMP View Post
I wonder why anyone thinks the current cost of the gun matters in defending your life. Sure, it matters in what you're going to consider purchasing, but that's it, from what I can see…



…I'm not paying $1500, let alone $2500 for an ordinary service class pistol, and while my life is worth a lot to me, those guns are not.

Quote:
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I'm not sure what raw dollar figures have to do with whether one is serious about self-defense or not. As 44 AMP points out there are many excellent, reliable options on the market for under $500.
While I’m not arguing with either of you on those points, I think people are misunderstanding my posts and what I’m saying.

My point is if I like my $2,400 gun and shoot it the best… the cost isn’t the reason I’m going to not carry it, in fear of it getting taken in the aftermath of a shooting. I don’t live life like that. And if I lose $2,400 after saving myself and/or others… I’ll reach out to Brett at P7Pro and order another one to replace it. Zero hesitation with that.

I am not saying that a $2,400 pistol is automatically better than a $500 pistol. Me, personally, if I do buy a $2,400 pistol… I’m going to make sure it is worth the money to me. My original reason for getting the P7M8 was strictly due to ties with NJSP… but after shooting it, I was impressed in how well it shoots (accuracy, recoil, ease of use). Another good example, I didn’t buy a Flux Legion… but built my own Raider from a FCU (which I Formed 1). While some people get their jollies off with the Legion line… I feel it is a little too wannabe warrior for me. None of that line really checks off all the boxes that I’d want.

Now, the topic is about handguns that impressed us. While some people might have different opinions, to me, the P7M8 is a prime example of that. And I felt strongly enough on it that I started to write the post prior to the addition of the price and role limit… but included it was above the cost requirement as I noticed it changed by the time I got around to finishing my post. Not my fault that Glocks, SIGs or even my HK P2000 (copy of my old duty gun) don’t really impress me. So if OP only wants to hear that from me… sorry, but not sorry.
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Old December 19, 2024, 10:42 AM   #33
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There is literally only one handgun maker, DiamondBack, that makes a non function will break gun.

Knowing that...this is arguing to argue.
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Old December 19, 2024, 01:43 PM   #34
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old model 19 S&W.
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Old December 19, 2024, 04:02 PM   #35
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old model 19 S&W.

Agreed.
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Old December 19, 2024, 04:13 PM   #36
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My Ruger SR9 ($249.99 at Sportsman’s Warehouse in late 2019).
Best value & quality of their striker fired semiautos. Highly underrated.
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Old December 19, 2024, 05:13 PM   #37
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"old model 19 S&W."

I've had many, many things to say about the S&W Model 19 over the years.

Personally, I think it's the single greatest combination of power, portability, ergonomics, and functionality ever put into any single revolver.

I have 3 of them -- 2.5", 4", 6" -- and under no circumstances would I ever consider getting rid of any of them.
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Old December 19, 2024, 05:16 PM   #38
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I know this was likely originally intended to be a semi-autos thread, but it's branching into a discussion about both revolvers and semi-autos, so I'm going to move it to general handguns.

Good conversation, so far, everyone.
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Old December 19, 2024, 05:20 PM   #39
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My current nighstand gun is my Smith & Wesson 411 in .40 S&W.

I bought it lightly used about a decade ago. Its weight very nicely tames the .40 Winchester Ranger rounds I run through it, it's more than accurate enough, it's good good sights, it fits my hand well.

I paid right around $300 for it, lightly used, at one of my local gun shops.

To be honest I've never had the same affection for S&W semi-autos that I've had for their revolvers (with the exception of the 3913 and the 645/4506. They're fantastic. I've got a 4506, but not a 3913).

But, I've come to quite like the 411,
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Old December 19, 2024, 07:34 PM   #40
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7-1/2” RedHawk 44mag, my brother in law’s.
What a beast, that was about 40 years ago and the size of the cartridge, size of the gun and the serious nut you got when it went BOOM!
It left a lasting impression.
As far as guns I have bought, I have a Beretta 96 INOX that still does it for me especially with some lighter weight, full power loads.

No tilting barrels here!
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Old December 20, 2024, 11:11 AM   #41
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I’m going to say two pistols depending on my circumstances. My concealed carry on my person is the Springfield Hellcat, easy to carry and conceal, added the Mcarbo trigger kit and its very nice, plenty accurate out to ten yards, and for me excellent sights. The second one may surprise a lot of people, it’s my old well used 4” Security Six stainless that rides in my lunch kit and goes with me whenever I have work to do at my shop. The Security Six has a polished trigger set, springs and shims from Triggershims.com and has as good a DA/SA trigger as any of my S&W’s and if it winds up languishing in an evidence locker some day no big loss money wise.
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Old December 20, 2024, 06:15 PM   #42
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@jetinteriorguy, did you get the titanium striker as well? It allows for a lighter striker shooting without light strikes. Also, the Hellcat Pro shoots much better than the regular Hellcat. That extra 3/4” of grip and the compensator make the gun so much easier to control under rapid fire. Also an optic allows for much greater precision with these small guns.
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Old December 20, 2024, 06:20 PM   #43
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One gun that impresses me is the CANIK TTI Combat. It has the best trigger for a striker fired gun that I’ve felt. It has a short, light take-up with a light clean trigger pull. Mine breaks at under 3 lbs. and it has a short, but positive reset. It is easy to find them for around $900, which is an absolute steal considering it comes with a nice case, a holster, and 2 mags.
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Old December 20, 2024, 07:03 PM   #44
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impressive

I had the opportunity to fire the FBI Q course quite a while ago. I chose to
compete with my Browning Hi Power Practical 9mm.

To this day I not know why I took the Hi Power as I have many competition guns.

To my own surprise, fired a perfect score.

An oldie but a goodie!
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Old December 21, 2024, 06:53 AM   #45
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I see the $1500 or less stipulation is now added. Kind of akin to asking which car impressed you most, but limiting horsepower to 200.
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Old December 21, 2024, 07:59 AM   #46
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@jetinteriorguy, did you get the titanium striker as well? It allows for a lighter striker shooting without light strikes. Also, the Hellcat Pro shoots much better than the regular Hellcat. That extra 3/4” of grip and the compensator make the gun so much easier to control under rapid fire. Also an optic allows for much greater precision with these small guns.
Hmm, good question. It’s been a while so I’d have to check my parts that I removed, should be in my parts bin. But I don’t believe I got the titanium striker. It’s not the Pro version, I bought mine when they first came out and I don’t believe they had the Pro version yet. One of my friends used to be a firearms instructor for the FBI and he was pretty impressed with how I shot the Hellcat. Then I brought out my CZ and he was really impressed.
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Old December 23, 2024, 06:52 AM   #47
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Well, my blue 2024 Python impresses me. With 38 wadcutters it makes me look like I know what I'm doing, but I don't use it for self-defense, home-defense, or pass defense. I just shoot it.

The gun that I actually use for everything is about as far from that as it can get I suppose. A simple Smith and Wesson 380 EZ. It's fairly small and light, important to an old man with a bad back. The slide is easy to rack, the mags are easy to load, it's easy and fun to shoot, and I shoot it pretty well. It's the gun I stick in a holster when I leave home, and the gun I take out of the holster and put on my nightstand at night, so I guess it's my "home defense" gun.

Sorry, no pictures. It's so ubiquitous I think everyone knows what they look like. Think "little black gun." I believe I paid about $325 for it.
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Old December 23, 2024, 02:35 PM   #48
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There are certainly more expensive pistols to be found, but the one that surprised me and impressed me the most in my younger years was the S&W M3913. Then, the late production M3913TSW reinforced that impression.

If they'd have continued to make the 3rd gen metal guns, and had ever offered the compact single stack in an all-stainless version (a 3916TSW, since the '6' would've denoted a stainless frame, like in the 3906?), I'd have stopped searching and just collected a couple more. As it is, I own that first 3913 (late 90's revision), a CS9 from the early 2000's and a late production 3913TSW I bought as a former issued duty weapon.

I wasn't interested in collecting (or carrying) full-size pistols in the latter part of my career, or I might've taken a 5906PC I was offered from a close friend's estate when he passed. I was the reason he'd originally ordered that 5906PC, since I'd told him S&W was making a run of them, and he called and had one shipped to his FFL. It was a fun 9mm to handle and shoot, but I wasn't personally interested in collecting and carrying boat anchors. A bit of a tack-driver, though.
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Old December 24, 2024, 08:04 PM   #49
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Canik's striker fired trigger is impressive as heck.

Colt Python, I know people rave about them, but I never really understood it until I shot one. I shot one of the old manufacture ones, not a new production version.
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Old December 24, 2024, 09:41 PM   #50
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My Rock Island 1911 has impressed me the most. With a mag change it has fed everything I put in it including empty cases with zero failures and I've had it since 2011. Now it gets a steady diet of home cast 230 grain SWC with a box of Tula steel cased FMJ now and then. It's accurate too. I can't shoot better offhand groups with a more expensive 1911.
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