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Old April 9, 2017, 10:59 AM   #26
Don Fischer
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It would surprise me if most of us could take any factory rifle and shoot .5" with it, especially with factory ammo. It may be that it's possible but how many people can really hold well enough and control the trigger well enough and control their breathing well enough for a .5" group?
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Old April 9, 2017, 02:42 PM   #27
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This prolly won't do any one any good, but I paid $24.95 for my most accurate rifle and it will shoot 10 shots into 1/2" at 100 yds and with hand loads it will do better. I am saying my most accurate rifle in hunting rifle classification.

It is a Springfield 1903 purchased in 1962 at Monkey Wards. It has a Leupold scope on it and it will shoot the lights out with no problemo.

I would agree wholeheartedly with the others: you cannot base accuracy on price. That old battleax just might be waiting for you to pick her up and give it a try.

There are lots of sleepers available, just inspect it and choose wisely. Most of the time you won't lose anything 'cause you can always sell it for what you paid for it unless you go crazy and lose good judgement.

The most terrible looking bore that I have is a Marlin M1893 in 38-55 and the last time I had it out I shot 7 shots (I ran out of ammo) into 1 1/2" at 100 with open sights and home made cast bullets. I can't explain that, so don't ask.
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Old April 25, 2017, 08:06 PM   #28
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Weatherby Vanguard Series 2 (I challenge someone to find better!)

Weatherby Vanguard Series 2. Sub-MOA accuracy is guaranteed and it's $450-$550 depending on caliber.

I love mine!
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Old April 25, 2017, 09:20 PM   #29
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I have a Weatherby S2 in 6.5 CM. It has a 12X SWFA scope and a 20 moa rail. With Hornady 140 match ammo it will shoot a 5 shot 5 inch group at 800 yards, which is the total length of our range. Total package was less than a grand. Hard to beat with a plain out of the box rifle.

My buddy just bought the same rifle at WallyWorld for less than $400.
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Old April 26, 2017, 11:58 AM   #30
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Savage 10/110 series is hands down the best bargain shooter on the market. I'd love to see someone do an extensive test. Ruger American belongs in the conversation.
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Old April 27, 2017, 08:36 PM   #31
Don Fischer
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Something I suspect about rifle's guaranteed to shoot sub min of angle is that they are tested at the factory before they are put into a stock. Some come with a target to prove their claim, no one tell's you it's without the stock. Remove's all bedding problems that might exist and human error that might exist also!
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Old April 28, 2017, 08:28 AM   #32
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Quote:
It would surprise me if most of us could take any factory rifle and shoot .5" with it, especially with factory ammo. It may be that it's possible but how many people can really hold well enough and control the trigger well enough and control their breathing well enough for a .5" group?
I was going to jump all over that quote until I reread it for what it really says . I agree , the majority of shooters may not but many can .

Right out of the box Savage model 10 in 308 shooting Fed GMM ( 3 shots )





Ruger American also in 308 using same ammo . Not quite 1/2 moa but defiantly sub moa



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Old April 28, 2017, 02:26 PM   #33
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I bought a T/C Venture 30-06 a couple years back and put a Burris 3x9 scope on it. I bought some Hornady American Whitetail 150gr ammo to sight it in and the very first group I shot was exactly 1/2". It regularly shoots sub 1 inch groups with no problem. It has a 5R 24" barrel and a fantastic trigger. I think I paid right at $400 with tax and I already had the scope. Well worth what I have in it. I shot some 155gr SMK Palma's out of it recently and the best I could get them to group was right around an inch. I guess it doesnt like those bullets for some reason. They shoot better out of my 1903 Springfield which is what I worked up that load for. Ive just been shooting the Hornady's out of it but I have some 165gr SGK's Im going to work up a load for and see how it likes them.
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Old April 30, 2017, 10:04 AM   #34
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Another vote for the Ruger American Predator in 6.5 CM

Got a RPR in 6.5 CM, was impressed with the round, decided to try a light weight 6.5 CM for hunting.

The RAP came in at 6.6 lbs before glass. I got it for just under $400, and found it shoots just as good as my RPR at about 1/3 the cost.

I did find out for deer/antelope size animals you need lighter bullets, the 140 gr weight should be saved for elk. Shot a deer last fall with the 140s at about 365 yards and it left a hole you could drive a truck through.

Just for kicks I tried to see if I could save time by loading a better metering ball powder so I didn't have to weigh each case. I loaded 41.7 grs, metered, not weighed in a once fired Hornady case, WW LR primers and 142 Accrubond bullets, as well as some other loads, This is the 3 shot group with the Winchester 760 Ball powder. It wasn't much different then the standard recommended 41.5 gr of H4350 for this bullet.



Fine for hunting but I still weigh each powder charge for distant shooting at steel.
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Old May 1, 2017, 06:35 PM   #35
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I get 1/2 moa from my Howa hb with the right load, it doesn't like gmm. It was under $500.00.
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Old May 1, 2017, 07:03 PM   #36
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With modern manufacturing I think 1 MOA is almost a given these days, or close to it. 1/2 seems small with factory ammo. Though maybe if you try lots of brands.


What I think lacks are the details. Lots of guns have cheap magazines. Bolts may be rough. Those are things you can live without.

The triggers these days are alot better too.

Lots of rifles are not blue, but some kind of coating, I suspect that lowers costs.
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Old May 2, 2017, 06:37 AM   #37
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I've seen many cheap and accurate rifles. Unfortunately, some of them were only accurate with bullets that were unsuitable for the purpose the owner demanded.
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Old May 10, 2017, 10:18 PM   #38
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Remington 783 ...Savage Axis ll , Ruger American

The Remington 783 in 270 Win , with the lesser priced scope was extremely accurate ..
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Old May 11, 2017, 10:21 AM   #39
Don Fischer
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My patriot has that black stuff on the barrel and I can live with it. It look's fine to me! The guy's shooting 1/2" group's right out of the box are the exception to the rule. Good as factory ammo is these, I doubt it's that good. And, the weak link might be the shooter. Get someone that just doesn't quite cut if shooting and see what he/she can do with it. I had a friend years ago that loved shooting but he couldn't shoot much better than 2" at a hundred yards. I kept the same rifle and same loads a bit under an inch. Trigger puller makes a lot of difference.

Those were impressive group's but I can show you more like it, just not the normal!
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Old May 11, 2017, 06:37 PM   #40
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Take a look at Savage they are very accurate out of the box
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Old May 12, 2017, 12:58 PM   #41
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If you have a Cabela's nearby, check out their Savage 10T. In 308 Win, it is very accurate and frequently on sale or offered with mail in rebate available.
I got mine for $429 after rebate and it has proven to be very accurate with 168 gr Federal Gold Medal Match or equivalent handloads. Unfortunately my photos of groups were too large a file to attach.
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Old May 31, 2017, 07:37 AM   #42
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Ruger American Predator 6.5 Creedmoor

Picked mine up for $350.00 out the door a few months ago. Decided to make a decent long range project out of it.
Got a great deal on a Timney trigger and good glass and rings.
Shoots great and tends to like the 120 grain Hornady match (not finished testing shelf ammo and grains yet).
Not a big fan of the factory stock and had to trim a bit from the fore end to get the free float.
Ordered the new Boyd's At One stock, that should be in about a week from now. It's made for the Ruger American short action and is cool looking as heck. Picked the two interchangeable fore ends and grips (target and hunting). First got a look at this new stock at Wannamakers in Tulsa and fell in love with the design. It's suppose to be a complete drop in and I may make a change such as bedding but don't know yet.
The gun is a great shooter. Being new to the 6.5 I was floored at the quality of this factory barrel and action at this price. The factory stock is free floated but crap because that's how then kept the price down.
The boyd's ran about $185.00.
I also added a Odin Atlas 6.5 comp.
Here's a picture of my gun as it is now and a pic (from the Boyd site) of the At One I ordered to replace the stock.
FYI: I have pics of the Odin comp install as well as the Timeny trigger install is there is any interest in me posting them.
I will also post either a vid or pics of the stock install if there is any interest here.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Atlas 8 at range ready to test.JPG (137.5 KB, 34 views)
File Type: jpg Boyds At one.jpg (6.5 KB, 36 views)
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Old May 31, 2017, 03:47 PM   #43
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My 788 in 222.
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Old May 31, 2017, 07:31 PM   #44
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Another vote for the howa
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Old May 31, 2017, 11:58 PM   #45
Don Fischer
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Dear Don,
I'll be sure to mention that the NEXT time a pack of 11 coyotes comes in on me again.
____________________________________________________________

11? No problem. Shoot'em one at a time! :-)
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Old June 1, 2017, 12:05 AM   #46
Don Fischer
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This Mossberg Patriot I recently got is surprising me. Bought one box on inexpensive Federal ammo and first three group out of the box were 1 1/8", 1" and 7/8". Had a hard time with the weather and a couple brain fart's but once it got a bit warmer, the wind and rain quit, it's doing great with handloads. 70gr SMK's are shooting 1/2" and under. If some one told me a factory rifle out of the box would do that, I wouldn't have believed it. Haven't done one thing to the rifle other than work up handloads with the 70gr SMK's. I'm in shock. Makes me want another just to see if it would work again! Might add, I've had a bunch of different rifle's brand new and most I was about to get down to just under a inch and that was fine with me. With a lot of tinkering all have become very accurate. The only factory rifle's I haven't had to re-bed Was this Mossberg and my mod 70 in 6.5x55. To get the most from all the other's it required bedding.

I paid $299 brand new with a plastic stock and soon as I got home called Mossberg and ordered the wood stock. Those first group's with Fed factory ammo were fired with the plastic stock on it. All the SMK loads came from the wood stock. Might add that I found no bedding problem's with the plastic stock so I suspect it would shoot like the wooden stock also. When I got the wood stock it was a drop in, didn't do anything but bolt it in. Right now if I was going to get another new rifle it would be another Patriot, no doubt in my mind. It also has the best out of the box trigger I have ever found. 2 3/4# right out of the box. It's adjustable but I'm not messing with it. Some time making it better is the thing you shouldn't do. My next best was my mod 70. 5# out of the box and broke like glass, it now breaks at three pounds. That one I adjusted down to 3#. I have three mod 700's and new they were all very heavy but fairly crisp. I've reduce every one to 3# and they are very very nice. But, I had to re-adjust them. They all needed bedding. My 700ADL in 243 in a plastic stock taking a lot of work. I had to slam the barrel on the back of the couch just to get the action out of the stock! Worst bedding I've ever seen in any rifle. I love the 700's and it appear's that the mod 70 is special too, but none came to me out of the box as well as the Mossberg Patriot did.

Last edited by Don Fischer; June 1, 2017 at 12:29 AM.
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Old June 1, 2017, 05:51 PM   #47
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Guess I'm a bit surprised about most of the above responses...
As though TRUE half-minute accuracy is easily achieved with a Ruger American and FACTORY ammo.

Even FGMM and Black Hills are unlikely to deliver that level of consistency from a custom rifle...

1/2 minute accuracy consistently with factory ammunition is a pipe dream...
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Old June 4, 2017, 01:31 AM   #48
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I picked up one of those heavy-barreled Savage 12 FV Cabelas's specials last week, as I was wanting a .22-250 with a 1:12-twist barrel to stabilize the 53 and/or 60 gr. V-Max bullet (the $369 sale price didn't hurt, either!) I handload but happen to have some (discontinued) 55 gr. Nosler Ballistic tip Federal Premium ammo from a spell 8 or so years ago when I didn't have time to. Looks like that combo could easily do a 5-shot 1/2 inch group, even in a breeze and including post-cleaning fouling shots; tried another lot number and it took off where the last one left off. I'll try to post some pics, but having too much fun right now. This is the first ammo I tried, btw.
I also have a C-Z 527 Varmint Kevlar in .204R that'll easily do honest 9/16" groups with FP 39 Sierra BK of the same vintage (3 round groups because box ammo - even that long ago - isn't cheap.)
200 yard groups may be another thing altogether, but haven't shot a group there yet; no accuracy problem so far at longer ranges when groundhog hunting with the .204, however.
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Old June 6, 2017, 10:28 AM   #49
Don Fischer
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A true 1/2 min rifle require's a true 1/2 min shooter to run it. They are not in great supply!
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