Krav Maga: Opinions?

melglock · January 24, 2002, 12:26 PM

While surfing around and looking for another martial art to get into, (I've previously done a little judo, karate, Tae Kwon Do, boxing, Aikido - I'm no black belt in any of the above.) I've found after studying these arts that most martial arts are more art than martial. That's not necessarily a bad thing - they're good exercise, and they're beautiful and spectacular to watch, but they don't do much good in a real fight.

I decided I wanted to get into an art that is designed for self-defense. I don't care so much about the sport or art aspects, I just want a system that teaches effective defense. I'm thinking I may have found that Krav Maga is such a system. Fortunately, there's a school located here in Fort Collins. I went to the school and watched a session, and looked on kravmaga.com & verified that it is an officially sanctioned school (as opposed to some schmuck teaching mutated Tae Kwon Do & calling it Krav Maga.) The system is very aggressive - teaching a variety of punching (much like boxing), grappling and kicking techniques (kicks look practical - no higher than the midsection). It also uses high-stress techniques such as having students punch & kick a target until they're tired, then having another student come at them from behind with a knife(simulated).

So far I like this system (technically they say its not a martial art - because it has no art, it's just martial.) What do you have to say about Krav Maga?

Joe Demko · January 24, 2002, 12:35 PM

This is not a slam at Krav Maga, or any other combative or martial art, but for the "art of self-defense" I think most men would be best served by going to a boxing gym and learning to box. I have been involved in martial arts for years, and the longer I stay with it, the more respect I gain for boxing. I've seen more people beaten senseless by somebody who knows how to box than by application of all other arts/styles combined. I've also seen, not once but several times, black belts beaten to the ground by boxers. On one memorable occasion, my cousin's husband (a golden gloves boxer) beat the holy living bejeezus out of the instructor from one of the local schools, shotokan I think was his style. The karateka's offense, btw, was making a pass at my cousin who worked at the school as a secretary/book keeper. In any case, boxing and the training for it are excellent exercise and it is undoubtedly effective in practice.

melglock · January 24, 2002, 12:54 PM

Good point, Golgo-13. When I took a self-defense class at CSU (that's Colorado State University), I was taught a little bit of boxing. After having taken a little karate, I was amazed at how much more power I could develop in my punches using boxing techniques. Krav Maga got cool points from me because its punching techniques are very similar, probably derived from boxing.

Coronach · January 25, 2002, 12:24 AM

I had a brief (hour long) session with a Krav Maga instructor. Obviously he wasn't able to demonstrate or teach too much, but the stuff he did show was simple, no-nonsense and effective. I think (IIRC) that it is based upon the body's natural, instinctive reaction to a stimulus (ie, if someone grabs your throat you instictively reach up and grasp thier arms) and built from there. As such it is easy to teach and easy to learn.

But like I said, it was just a single one-hour session. YMMV (a lot

)

Mike

ATeaM · January 25, 2002, 05:13 AM

It's better than the traditional asian arts.

mikeyd501 · January 27, 2002, 02:35 PM

Melglock;

Look into San Soo Kung Fu. There is someone in Ft. Collins teaching and he's really good. He's active duty Special Forces named Lee Shadow Bear

http://homepage.aol.com/lshadowbear/...nsooindex.html

Invest an hour of your time and go watch San Soo in action and report back on what you see.

If you can get with him, it will be the best training you ever had.

Good luck,

Mike D

melglock · January 27, 2002, 05:27 PM

Good idea, but your link doesn't work.

mikeyd501 · January 27, 2002, 10:54 PM

Help is on its way. Give me time to contact Lee and I'll get back to ya.

Thanks,

Mike D

P.S. Do you know about San Soo?

melglock · January 28, 2002, 12:17 PM

Quote:

P.S. Do you know about San Soo?

Nope. Is it a street oriented self defense system like Krav Maga, Jeet Kune Do, et. al.?

jameseavesjohnson · January 30, 2002, 12:25 PM

Running is easier to learn and more effective if you want to avoid injury. Fighting may save your pride or property, but running will save your health and your life.

If the other guy has a gun, he can still get you, but grappling punching or kicking is no solution to that situation anyway.

I haven't been in a fight since High School, but even though I had a black belt in Tae Kwon Do, my strategy was aleways to run away. On the rare circumstance where running was not an immediate option, I would strike once then run.

reprobate · February 2, 2002, 04:21 AM

There is a cheaper and faster way to learn real fighting skills. Get a t-shirt that says Honda(or the name of any other metric, night-breeding, riceburning P.O.S. motorcycle), and start hanging out in biker bars. You will learn more effective fighting techniques in one night than you would learn in six months in some dojo.

Joe Demko · February 4, 2002, 06:30 AM

Reprobate,
Your reply would have some vallidity if most "bikers' these days were not simply overweight, middle-aged, white professionals who bought Harleys and who don't feel right riding them unless they have the whole "costume" on too. The average biker is about 55 years old, 40 lbs. overweight, and hasn't been in a fight since high school. Yeah, he'll learn a lot there, boy howdy.
In any case, turning this thread into a "Harleys suck/Jap Bikes suck" pi$$ing contest will be a quick way to get it locked.

IZZY · February 4, 2002, 12:37 PM

OY VAY LANU! Krav Mega (Lit. touching combat) It's better than some traditional arts and a lot worse than others. Boxing, Jeet Koun Do (sp?) and San Shoo are probly good options as well.

If you do search you will find big arguments and diffrent opinions on this subject. (including more of mine

)

whizz · February 7, 2002, 10:50 AM

Hmm.... guys...
Whatever your training method/style/art, when it is about life or death, nothing and I mean NOTHING, can ever substitute from real participation in fights where your health is at stake i.e. actual hand to hand combat. That is the only way of getting real experience. And experience usually makes you able to get out of trouble without fighting.

January 24, 2002, 12:26 PM	#1
melglock Member Join Date: November 17, 2001 Posts: 98	Krav Maga: Opinions? While surfing around and looking for another martial art to get into, (I've previously done a little judo, karate, Tae Kwon Do, boxing, Aikido - I'm no black belt in any of the above.) I've found after studying these arts that most martial arts are more art than martial. That's not necessarily a bad thing - they're good exercise, and they're beautiful and spectacular to watch, but they don't do much good in a real fight. I decided I wanted to get into an art that is designed for self-defense. I don't care so much about the sport or art aspects, I just want a system that teaches effective defense. I'm thinking I may have found that Krav Maga is such a system. Fortunately, there's a school located here in Fort Collins. I went to the school and watched a session, and looked on kravmaga.com & verified that it is an officially sanctioned school (as opposed to some schmuck teaching mutated Tae Kwon Do & calling it Krav Maga.) The system is very aggressive - teaching a variety of punching (much like boxing), grappling and kicking techniques (kicks look practical - no higher than the midsection). It also uses high-stress techniques such as having students punch & kick a target until they're tired, then having another student come at them from behind with a knife(simulated). So far I like this system (technically they say its not a martial art - because it has no art, it's just martial.) What do you have to say about Krav Maga?

January 25, 2002, 12:24 AM	#4
Coronach Senior Member Join Date: March 25, 1999 Posts: 3,147	I had a brief (hour long) session with a Krav Maga instructor. Obviously he wasn't able to demonstrate or teach too much, but the stuff he did show was simple, no-nonsense and effective. I think (IIRC) that it is based upon the body's natural, instinctive reaction to a stimulus (ie, if someone grabs your throat you instictively reach up and grasp thier arms) and built from there. As such it is easy to teach and easy to learn. But like I said, it was just a single one-hour session. YMMV (a lot ) Mike __________________ The axe bites into the door, ripping a hole in one panel. The maniac puts his face into the hole, cackling gleefully, "Here's Johnny...erk." "And here's Smith and Wesson," murmurs Coronach, Mozambiquing six rounds of .357 into the critter at a range of three feet. -Lawdog "True pacifism is the finest form of manliness. But if a man comes up to you and cuts your hand off, you don't just offer him the other one. Not if you want to go on playing the piano, you don't." -Sam Peckinpah "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." -Robert Heinlein

January 30, 2002, 12:25 PM	#10
jameseavesjohnson Junior Member Join Date: January 30, 2002 Posts: 2	Learn to Run Running is easier to learn and more effective if you want to avoid injury. Fighting may save your pride or property, but running will save your health and your life. If the other guy has a gun, he can still get you, but grappling punching or kicking is no solution to that situation anyway. I haven't been in a fight since High School, but even though I had a black belt in Tae Kwon Do, my strategy was aleways to run away. On the rare circumstance where running was not an immediate option, I would strike once then run.

February 4, 2002, 06:30 AM	#12
Joe Demko Senior Member Join Date: September 14, 2000 Posts: 1,143	Reprobate, Your reply would have some vallidity if most "bikers' these days were not simply overweight, middle-aged, white professionals who bought Harleys and who don't feel right riding them unless they have the whole "costume" on too. The average biker is about 55 years old, 40 lbs. overweight, and hasn't been in a fight since high school. Yeah, he'll learn a lot there, boy howdy. In any case, turning this thread into a "Harleys suck/Jap Bikes suck" pi$$ing contest will be a quick way to get it locked. __________________ "No honest man needs a handgun smaller than a canned ham." Bill Ruger

January 24, 2002, 12:35 PM	#2
Joe Demko Senior Member Join Date: September 14, 2000 Posts: 1,143	This is not a slam at Krav Maga, or any other combative or martial art, but for the "art of self-defense" I think most men would be best served by going to a boxing gym and learning to box. I have been involved in martial arts for years, and the longer I stay with it, the more respect I gain for boxing. I've seen more people beaten senseless by somebody who knows how to box than by application of all other arts/styles combined. I've also seen, not once but several times, black belts beaten to the ground by boxers. On one memorable occasion, my cousin's husband (a golden gloves boxer) beat the holy living bejeezus out of the instructor from one of the local schools, shotokan I think was his style. The karateka's offense, btw, was making a pass at my cousin who worked at the school as a secretary/book keeper. In any case, boxing and the training for it are excellent exercise and it is undoubtedly effective in practice.

January 24, 2002, 12:54 PM	#3
melglock Member Join Date: November 17, 2001 Posts: 98	Good point, Golgo-13. When I took a self-defense class at CSU (that's Colorado State University), I was taught a little bit of boxing. After having taken a little karate, I was amazed at how much more power I could develop in my punches using boxing techniques. Krav Maga got cool points from me because its punching techniques are very similar, probably derived from boxing.

January 25, 2002, 05:13 AM	#5
ATeaM Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2001 Posts: 601	It's better than the traditional asian arts.

January 27, 2002, 02:35 PM	#6
mikeyd501 Junior Member Join Date: January 27, 2002 Posts: 2	Melglock; Look into San Soo Kung Fu. There is someone in Ft. Collins teaching and he's really good. He's active duty Special Forces named Lee Shadow Bear http://homepage.aol.com/lshadowbear/...nsooindex.html Invest an hour of your time and go watch San Soo in action and report back on what you see. If you can get with him, it will be the best training you ever had. Good luck, Mike D

January 27, 2002, 05:27 PM	#7
melglock Member Join Date: November 17, 2001 Posts: 98	Good idea, but your link doesn't work.

January 27, 2002, 10:54 PM	#8
mikeyd501 Junior Member Join Date: January 27, 2002 Posts: 2	Help is on its way. Give me time to contact Lee and I'll get back to ya. Thanks, Mike D P.S. Do you know about San Soo?

February 2, 2002, 04:21 AM	#11
reprobate Member Join Date: December 25, 2001 Posts: 80	There is a cheaper and faster way to learn real fighting skills. Get a t-shirt that says Honda(or the name of any other metric, night-breeding, riceburning P.O.S. motorcycle), and start hanging out in biker bars. You will learn more effective fighting techniques in one night than you would learn in six months in some dojo.

February 4, 2002, 12:37 PM	#13
IZZY Senior Member Join Date: February 2, 2000 Location: Florida Posts: 938	OY VAY LANU! Krav Mega (Lit. touching combat) It's better than some traditional arts and a lot worse than others. Boxing, Jeet Koun Do (sp?) and San Shoo are probly good options as well. If you do search you will find big arguments and diffrent opinions on this subject. (including more of mine )

February 7, 2002, 10:50 AM	#14
whizz Member Join Date: January 25, 2002 Location: sweden Posts: 93	Hmm.... guys... Whatever your training method/style/art, when it is about life or death, nothing and I mean NOTHING, can ever substitute from real participation in fights where your health is at stake i.e. actual hand to hand combat. That is the only way of getting real experience. And experience usually makes you able to get out of trouble without fighting.