fixed sights vs adjustable sights

revolverrandy · February 26, 2010, 12:37 PM

All my handguns to this point have adjustable sights,which I do favor.
I did just yesterday,order a FM High power semi auto which has fixed sights.
Someone was telling me he has a lower quality brand semi auto which consistantly shoots to the left and there is nothing he can do.This brings me to 2 questions:
1.How frequent is is that handguns with fixed sights do not have accurate sights?
&
2.Is there anything that can be done if you have a handgun with fixed sights and the aim is off other than compensate for it with your aim?

kraigwy · February 26, 2010, 01:00 PM

Most fixed sights I've had were pretty good, assuming you used the bullet wight the gun was designed for. I.E. Smith revolvers (38/357s) are designed for 158 grn bullets. I've only had to adjust two in 40 years, both were Model 13s.

I fixed this with a milling machine, one was shooting low and I just milled a tad of the top of the front sight. One was shooting off on windage (cant remember which way now). I milled the side of the from sight a few thousand and openned up the rear sight notch a few thousands.

If your careful with your measurements you can get pretty dern close.

For the most part, if you stick with the bullet weight the gun was designed for you can cure the problem.

On windage, people tend to blame the gun for shooting left or right with its accually the shooter (trigger finger). If you have windage problems, try pushing your trigger finger the direction you want the gun to shoot. I.E. if you are shooting right, push your trigger finger deeper into the trigger guard, if shooting left, slide the trigger finger out a bit.

gwnorth · February 26, 2010, 01:01 PM

Many semi-auto fixed sights are still drift adjustable. You just need a pusher tool to adjust them, or take them to a gunsmith and have them tweak the windage.

A revolver with true fixed, top strap cutout sights is a different matter.

Ken - Oh · February 26, 2010, 01:04 PM

For a self defense handgun, I prefer fixed sights.

Many fixed sights can be drifted side to side if the gun is off in one direction or the other. Some guns (mostly revolvers, I think) have them machined into the frame itself and cannot be adjusted.

The Hi Power sights should be drift adjustable. Brownells or Midway probably sell fixtures for drifting sights.

I have never had to adjust a gun with fixed sights and I've had several.

Ken

spacecoast · February 26, 2010, 01:25 PM

On a short-barreled gun (4" or less), I don't believe that adjustable sights are much help at all, they just seem to get in the way and are relatively easy to break or get out of adjustment. I much prefer the streamlined look of a S&W Model 10 revolver (fixed) to a Model 15 (adjustable).

stevieboy · February 26, 2010, 02:29 PM

I have several adjustable sight handguns and two fixed sight guns (S & W Model 36 and a S & W 1911). For me the fixed sight guns shoot as accurately as the adjustable sight guns. I love the Novak white dots on my 1911, truly a "sight for sore eyes."

N.H. Yankee · February 26, 2010, 02:35 PM

Hunting revolver , adjustable all the way, Carry weapon, fixed only. My handguns are a mix, I do have a couple guns that are for carry with adjustable sights but they are well protected by a semi hood. I now carry a XD sub with fixed and a FNP with fixed, my Shorty Forty has adjustable as well as a couple 3rd gen S&W's.

jglsprings · February 26, 2010, 03:12 PM

Don't worry about a problem that hasn't arrived yet.

Not sure which HP knockoff you have ordered, it is most likely drift adjustable to the left or right. You can do it yourself or a gunsmith can do it in just a minute. If for some reason it can't be drifted at all - then you have to "adjust" the sights. I've NEVER had to do this. I'm sure a gunsmith would be the best option at that point.

As far as the "right" bullet weight that mostly helps with the up and down.

P.S.

I agree with kraigwy, it's more often the shooter fighting the trigger than the sights.

Malamute · February 26, 2010, 09:14 PM

I tend towards adjustable. I've had several fixed sight guns that shot to the side, or needed elevation adjustments. Even a little off makes it harder to hit when you stretch the distances any.

Interestingly, before Ruger made Vaqueros, I used to think about making a Ruger Blackhawk or Super Blackhawk into a fixed sight gun, welding up the sight holes, contouring the frame, making a Colt SAA type front sight,....Now that I've had a few Vaqueros, and most needed some sight tweeking, I look at my Vaquero and think "I have that Smith & Wesson K frame sight that could be fitted to this thing, and a Colt Flat Top Target type front made up,......"

In many years of carrying, mostly in rather unkind conditions to the gun, I've only damaged one adjustable sight. The rear leaf was cracked, but it was still functional. It was a Smith 29 that fell out of the front of my belt as I was climbing over the tailgate of the truck, it bounced off the rear bumper of the truck, right on the sight.

I so far, havent seen the "fragile" aspect of adjustable sights. Maybe I'm too dainty with mine, tho many of my guns have been dropped at various times, and on various surfaces, including rock, gravel, concrete, and the ground. Only bouncing it of the truck bumper right on the sight has has any effect so far. I do however, like to know that the load I choose for my gun will shoot exactly where I want it to.

treg · February 27, 2010, 10:16 AM

I've been using adjustable sights on handguns for 20+ years now and have not yet had a fragility incident.

sthomper · November 29, 2014, 02:22 AM

i recently got a taurus 65. the first rounds i fired were 110gr/1295 fps 357. they were just a bit low when lining up the front and rear fixed sight...i tilt the front sight up just a bit to make a triangle and this allowed for very good accuracy... nailing empty spray paint cans at 15 yards.

then tried to shoot some 158gr/1200fps and these were even lower...had to tilt barrel so font sight was prominet above rear sight and accuray was improved somewhat.

then fired some low power 158gr/800 fps cowboy 357s and hit everything i shot at with even sight picture...medication bottles at 15 yards.

im not sure of the formula for the best rounds concerning a best weight/velocity combination on a fixed sight 357 but i didnt find the 158gr 1200fps to be good at all.

Hawg · November 29, 2014, 07:43 AM

Heavier bullets always hit higher than lighter ones.

saleen322 · November 29, 2014, 11:26 AM

All of my handguns had adj sights until I bought a XD-9 that I used for teaching classes. That XD shot about 6" or more high @ 25 yards. I just lived with it and held low when shooting at distance. Some years later I bought a set of night sights on sale that I installed. They were the correct height and the problem went away. My guess is Springfield put the wrong height sight on at the factory. A lot of rounds have a different point of impact and adjustable sights are useful to compensate. Here are two groups from my Sig @ 25 yards were the 185 grain hits higher than the 200. Both bullets group well they just hit different. YMMV.

Bob Wright · November 29, 2014, 11:44 AM

Quote:

kraigwy said:
On windage, people tend to blame the gun for shooting left or right with its accually the shooter (trigger finger). If you have windage problems, try pushing your trigger finger the direction you want the gun to shoot. I.E. if you are shooting right, push your trigger finger deeper into the trigger guard, if shooting left, slide the trigger finger out a bit.

This is only true if all of a person's guns shoot "off." If, on the other hand, only one gun fails to shoot to point of aim, it's not likely the shooter's fault. the trigger finger should land in the same place every time, every gun.

Bob Wright

UncleEd · November 29, 2014, 11:46 AM

At combat handgun ranges, 25 yards and well under, the trajectories of the typical 9 mm, .40 S&W, .38 Special, .357 Magnum and .45 ACP are minimal.

So any decent fixed sight is good enough and adjustable sights are not really so important on a handgun unless you're really into true bullseye shooting or precise shooting in hunting.

Beyond 25 yards, trajectories can really start varying though in one chart I looked at the 9 mm and .40 S&W, being traditional flat shooters, showed not even 2 inches at 100 yards. The .45 ACP at its usual more leisurely pace
has the proverbial "rainbow" trajectory.

Snyper · November 29, 2014, 07:57 PM

Quote:

I've been using adjustable sights on handguns for 20+ years now and have not yet had a fragility incident.

Same here, but it's been over 40 years.

The old line about sights getting damaged is just something many repeat because someone else said it.

AK103K · November 30, 2014, 06:35 PM

Quote:

The old line about sights getting damaged is just something many repeat because someone else said it.

Back when Glocks came in with adjustable sights, I knocked the rear portion off my 17's adjustable sight clean off, when it caught a door jamb while in its holster, as I was passing through.

Things can and do happen.

Personally, I prefer fixed three dot night sights on my autos. A sight pusher or hammer and punch normally fixes any windage issues. A proper front sight the elevation.

Most of my S&W and Ruger revolvers have adjustable sights, although I dont mind the ones that dont. It would be nice if they could all be three dot night sights as well, but you cant always have everything.

February 26, 2010, 12:37 PM	#1
revolverrandy Senior Member Join Date: February 14, 2010 Posts: 197	fixed sights vs adjustable sights All my handguns to this point have adjustable sights,which I do favor. I did just yesterday,order a FM High power semi auto which has fixed sights. Someone was telling me he has a lower quality brand semi auto which consistantly shoots to the left and there is nothing he can do.This brings me to 2 questions: 1.How frequent is is that handguns with fixed sights do not have accurate sights? & 2.Is there anything that can be done if you have a handgun with fixed sights and the aim is off other than compensate for it with your aim?

February 26, 2010, 01:00 PM	#2
kraigwy Senior Member Join Date: June 16, 2008 Location: Wyoming Posts: 11,061	Most fixed sights I've had were pretty good, assuming you used the bullet wight the gun was designed for. I.E. Smith revolvers (38/357s) are designed for 158 grn bullets. I've only had to adjust two in 40 years, both were Model 13s. I fixed this with a milling machine, one was shooting low and I just milled a tad of the top of the front sight. One was shooting off on windage (cant remember which way now). I milled the side of the from sight a few thousand and openned up the rear sight notch a few thousands. If your careful with your measurements you can get pretty dern close. For the most part, if you stick with the bullet weight the gun was designed for you can cure the problem. On windage, people tend to blame the gun for shooting left or right with its accually the shooter (trigger finger). If you have windage problems, try pushing your trigger finger the direction you want the gun to shoot. I.E. if you are shooting right, push your trigger finger deeper into the trigger guard, if shooting left, slide the trigger finger out a bit. __________________ Kraig Stuart CPT USAR Ret USAMU Sniper School Distinguished Rifle Badge 1071

February 26, 2010, 01:04 PM	#4
Ken - Oh Senior Member Join Date: August 2, 2006 Posts: 280	For a self defense handgun, I prefer fixed sights. Many fixed sights can be drifted side to side if the gun is off in one direction or the other. Some guns (mostly revolvers, I think) have them machined into the frame itself and cannot be adjusted. The Hi Power sights should be drift adjustable. Brownells or Midway probably sell fixtures for drifting sights. I have never had to adjust a gun with fixed sights and I've had several. Ken __________________ "The more law-abiding people that have guns, the better off we are," Hamilton County [Cincinnati] Prosecutor Joe Deters said. "Because the bad guys always have guns, You look at these school shootings or church shootings, the ones that have been stopped, it was because someone there had a gun."

February 26, 2010, 02:35 PM	#7
N.H. Yankee Senior Member Join Date: October 17, 2004 Location: Rural N.H. Posts: 1,586	Hunting revolver , adjustable all the way, Carry weapon, fixed only. My handguns are a mix, I do have a couple guns that are for carry with adjustable sights but they are well protected by a semi hood. I now carry a XD sub with fixed and a FNP with fixed, my Shorty Forty has adjustable as well as a couple 3rd gen S&W's. __________________ The real danger to America is not abroad but within.. Having an open mind is a good thing, but not so open that your brains fall out! Save America, abort liberalism.

February 26, 2010, 03:12 PM	#8
jglsprings Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2009 Posts: 1,827	First off.... Don't worry about a problem that hasn't arrived yet. Not sure which HP knockoff you have ordered, it is most likely drift adjustable to the left or right. You can do it yourself or a gunsmith can do it in just a minute. If for some reason it can't be drifted at all - then you have to "adjust" the sights. I've NEVER had to do this. I'm sure a gunsmith would be the best option at that point. As far as the "right" bullet weight that mostly helps with the up and down. P.S. I agree with kraigwy, it's more often the shooter fighting the trigger than the sights. __________________ Let's eat Grandma. Let's eat, Grandma. Commas save lives... Last edited by jglsprings; February 26, 2010 at 07:19 PM. Reason: grammar

February 26, 2010, 01:01 PM	#3
gwnorth Senior Member Join Date: September 3, 2008 Location: North Carolina Posts: 692	Many semi-auto fixed sights are still drift adjustable. You just need a pusher tool to adjust them, or take them to a gunsmith and have them tweak the windage. A revolver with true fixed, top strap cutout sights is a different matter.

February 26, 2010, 01:25 PM	#5
spacecoast Senior Member Join Date: October 14, 2009 Location: Sunshine and Keystone States Posts: 4,461	On a short-barreled gun (4" or less), I don't believe that adjustable sights are much help at all, they just seem to get in the way and are relatively easy to break or get out of adjustment. I much prefer the streamlined look of a S&W Model 10 revolver (fixed) to a Model 15 (adjustable).

February 26, 2010, 02:29 PM	#6
stevieboy Senior Member Join Date: March 14, 2008 Posts: 1,695	I have several adjustable sight handguns and two fixed sight guns (S & W Model 36 and a S & W 1911). For me the fixed sight guns shoot as accurately as the adjustable sight guns. I love the Novak white dots on my 1911, truly a "sight for sore eyes."

February 26, 2010, 09:14 PM	#9
Malamute Senior Member Join Date: June 6, 2004 Location: Rocky Mts Posts: 859	I tend towards adjustable. I've had several fixed sight guns that shot to the side, or needed elevation adjustments. Even a little off makes it harder to hit when you stretch the distances any. Interestingly, before Ruger made Vaqueros, I used to think about making a Ruger Blackhawk or Super Blackhawk into a fixed sight gun, welding up the sight holes, contouring the frame, making a Colt SAA type front sight,....Now that I've had a few Vaqueros, and most needed some sight tweeking, I look at my Vaquero and think "I have that Smith & Wesson K frame sight that could be fitted to this thing, and a Colt Flat Top Target type front made up,......" In many years of carrying, mostly in rather unkind conditions to the gun, I've only damaged one adjustable sight. The rear leaf was cracked, but it was still functional. It was a Smith 29 that fell out of the front of my belt as I was climbing over the tailgate of the truck, it bounced off the rear bumper of the truck, right on the sight. I so far, havent seen the "fragile" aspect of adjustable sights. Maybe I'm too dainty with mine, tho many of my guns have been dropped at various times, and on various surfaces, including rock, gravel, concrete, and the ground. Only bouncing it of the truck bumper right on the sight has has any effect so far. I do however, like to know that the load I choose for my gun will shoot exactly where I want it to. __________________ "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs even though checkered by failure, than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy nor suffer much because they live in the gray twilight that knows neither victory nor defeat." -Theodore Roosevelt-

February 27, 2010, 10:16 AM	#10
treg Senior Member Join Date: November 26, 2006 Posts: 1,102	I've been using adjustable sights on handguns for 20+ years now and have not yet had a fragility incident. __________________ .44 Special: For those who get it, no explanation is necessary. For those who don't, no explanation is possible.

November 29, 2014, 02:22 AM	#11
sthomper Senior Member Join Date: June 17, 2010 Posts: 164	i recently got a taurus 65. the first rounds i fired were 110gr/1295 fps 357. they were just a bit low when lining up the front and rear fixed sight...i tilt the front sight up just a bit to make a triangle and this allowed for very good accuracy... nailing empty spray paint cans at 15 yards. then tried to shoot some 158gr/1200fps and these were even lower...had to tilt barrel so font sight was prominet above rear sight and accuray was improved somewhat. then fired some low power 158gr/800 fps cowboy 357s and hit everything i shot at with even sight picture...medication bottles at 15 yards. im not sure of the formula for the best rounds concerning a best weight/velocity combination on a fixed sight 357 but i didnt find the 158gr 1200fps to be good at all.

November 29, 2014, 07:43 AM	#12
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,188	Heavier bullets always hit higher than lighter ones.

November 29, 2014, 11:26 AM	#13
saleen322 Senior Member Join Date: March 8, 2010 Posts: 778	All of my handguns had adj sights until I bought a XD-9 that I used for teaching classes. That XD shot about 6" or more high @ 25 yards. I just lived with it and held low when shooting at distance. Some years later I bought a set of night sights on sale that I installed. They were the correct height and the problem went away. My guess is Springfield put the wrong height sight on at the factory. A lot of rounds have a different point of impact and adjustable sights are useful to compensate. Here are two groups from my Sig @ 25 yards were the 185 grain hits higher than the 200. Both bullets group well they just hit different. YMMV.

November 29, 2014, 11:46 AM	#15
UncleEd Senior Member Join Date: April 13, 2013 Location: N. Georgia Posts: 1,150	At combat handgun ranges, 25 yards and well under, the trajectories of the typical 9 mm, .40 S&W, .38 Special, .357 Magnum and .45 ACP are minimal. So any decent fixed sight is good enough and adjustable sights are not really so important on a handgun unless you're really into true bullseye shooting or precise shooting in hunting. Beyond 25 yards, trajectories can really start varying though in one chart I looked at the 9 mm and .40 S&W, being traditional flat shooters, showed not even 2 inches at 100 yards. The .45 ACP at its usual more leisurely pace has the proverbial "rainbow" trajectory.