Need help on used values S&W 686

[SonOfScubaDiver]

So, I found two used 686s at a LGS today. One is the 4" version -3, and he wants $475 for it. The other one is the 6" version -6, and he wants $635 for it. I know next to nothing on used gun values, so I need help from those of you in the know on used S&W revolvers.

The -3 is clearly older, but it is in good shape. It has the older style firing pin attached to the hammer. I checked what I could on it--the trigger felt nice and smooth in both DA and SA, the cylinder locked up nicely, the ejector rod didn't feel gritty or loose, and the cylinder didn't feel as if it had play in it. It has an adjustable rear sight. Everything seems to be in good functioning order.

The -6 has the newer style transfer bar for the firing pin, and everything else is in the same good condition as the -3.

So, are either or both these guns priced right, too high, or a steal? I'm not against buying a used gun, but I don't want to spend more than one would be worth. Thank you for your replies.

[Reloadron]

In my area of the Cleveland, Ohio burbs a clean 686-3 typically starts at about $500 and they go up from there. I would have no problem going $500 for a really clean tight gun. As I mentioned in your other thread I don't have a 686 but really enjoy shooting my 586. The latter 686-6 seems a little high but any gun on any given day is worth what someone is willing to pay for it, no more and no less. I don't quite get the gap in the asking prices between the -3 and the -6 versions. Then too, I am not holding either gun.

Ron

[reddog81]

One is priced at the high end of the market and the other is one the low end of used prices. I wouldn't be to concerned about hammer mounted firing pin vs framed mounted firing pin. Assuming both are in similar condition I'd jump on the one priced at $475.

Pricing used guns is more of an art than a science. Some people want to sell ASAP while others want to get top dollar.

[Carmady]

I'd also go for the -3. It's $160 cheaper AND a pre-lock. The pre-lock is a big selling point. Check it out with a scrutinizing eye, that price seems too low to me.

[SonOfScubaDiver]

It does seem a little low to me for the 4" version, but I was thinking maybe it's because it's older. Then again, I don't really know. Maybe there's something up with it that I didn't see while I was checking it out. Also, I checked with Buds on a new 6" version, and including my FFL fee, it would be only $100 more. I'm thinking that would be better than going with a used one, if I decide on the 6" version.

[Sevens]

Ummm, occasionally these are a no-brainer. This is one of those times.

Even if the prices were swapped, I believe the 686-3 is the better buy for sure. That it's significantly lower in price?! That would have come home with me and this wouldn't be a "which" thread, it would be a "look what I got!" thread.

Go get it!

[Sevens]

Sorry, I just now saw your last post before mine.

In my opinion, I would pay MORE, easily more, for a 686-3 in decent condition (need not be mint!) than I ever would, EVER, for a new S&W revolver, especially any S&W product made in the last 2-3 years. QC nearly ceases to exist in Springfield these days.

A new 686? No. No way, no how, never.

[Sevens]

Just to be clear -- yes, today's S&W very nearly disgusts me because I just do NOT see the effort from the factory to ensure they are shipping their best product.

But when I say that I'd pay more for a used, average condition 686-3 over a brand new S&W, it is partly because I don't want to work "quality assurance" for S&W unless they pay me, but mostly -- it is because the 686-0 through 686-4 is a phenomenal revolver and they made a zillion, they are easy to find and they are that better than what they ship today.

[SonOfScubaDiver]

Sevens, can you elaborate? I bought my first revolver a few months ago, so I have a long way to go in catching up with the latest issues with manufacturers. I can't say that I've seen much complaining about S&W, other than the lock mechanism that comes on their guns. I'm pretty neutral on that issue, but if there are serious problems with S&W's revolvers, I'd like to know about them.

[Elkins45]

I wouldn't have left the store without the 4" gun in my hand, unless it was really dogged out.

[Sevens]

S&W can still make good products and their warranty service is probably better than ever because more problem guns come in by the minute.

Their quality control and final inspection is ABYSMAL, they are sending every gun out as fast as they can possibly throw them together. As manufacturing has gotten better, the folks assembling guns simply don't need to be highly skilled craftsmen and the net result is showing in an obvious way.

[dahermit]

The -6 has the newer style transfer bar for the firing pin...

Do you mean "frame mounted firing pin"? I don't think S&W double actions use "transfer bars"...they still use, however, "hammer blocks" with the frame mounted firing pins.

[lamarw]

You do not mention the stocks (grips for non-S&W folks). A nice set of factory wood grips are worth at least seventy-five to a hundred dollars. Four inch barrels are typically more desirable than a 6".

I would seriously consider the -3 revolver if it is in good to very good condition if I were you. I paid almost that for my -1 with a 4" barrel back in 2011. They are desirable revolvers.

[joed]

I think there was a problem with the earlier 686's and the firing pin. I remember there was a recall on them but can't remember much else. Wish I could remember what - numbers this was for. May be only -1 but do not remember.

This may be the reason for the lower price. Anyone know of this problem?

[JT-AR-MG42]

I'm with sevens on this.
It's not the lock per say, but rather over-all QC.
That (lack of) QC is why you see the older 27-2, 28-2, and even the early 586s and 686s go for more money used than a new one.
Folks are not paying those high prices for bragging rights, they're paying more for QUALITY.

Guns that had flaws in assembly or workmanship were caught and taken care of BEFORE they left the factory.

Believe it or not, there was a time when the repair Dept. at S&W just worked on re-building and re-finishing older guns.
Now that work goes to the custom shop. The repair Dept. is working full time on warranty work.

475 for a straight 4" 686-3 is a no brainer IMO.

JT

[SonOfScubaDiver]

Dahermit, is that what S&W calls it? It sure looked similar to the transfer bar on my Ruger.

Lamarw, both guns have rubber grips. I couldn't tell you if they are Hogue, Pachmayr, or some other brand. They looked the same as the ones I've seen in pictures and videos of the new 686s.

It seems that the consensus so far is that the -3 4" is the better gun and better deal. Maybe I need to hightail it over there and get it before someone else does.

I get what y'all are saying about QC, but it seems that the same thing is happening with all the manufacturers, not just S&W. I'm just guessing, but maybe they figured out it's cheaper for them to repair manufacturing errors when the guns come back than to do it before they leave the factory.

[springer99]

Some folks have a "thing" about the newer design Smiths with the lock but I've never left that make my decision for me; I have a number of both and like them all. As far as pricing goes, in my area I'd say the 4" is priced right and the 6" is about $50-75 high, if they're both in great condition. Personally, I'd go for the 4" 686 but only because I like shorter barreled Smiths and they also seem to hold their price better over time.

[lamarw]

The recall was for the Model 686 and 686-1. It dealt with a specific type primer causing a flow back issue. Most of these used revolvers will have an "M" stamp for modified on the inside of the yoke. Some owners prefer not to have it done thinking it will make their gun more valuable. It was corrected for all revolvers after the 686-1.

[dahermit]

Dahermit, is that what S&W calls it? It sure looked similar to the transfer bar on my Ruger.

S&W has always referred to it as a hammer block...because that is what it is. It blocks the hammer from striking the cartridges in the cylinder until the trigger is pulled, which also pulls the hammer block out of the way. The Rugers on the other hand, use a transfer bar, which must be contacted by the hammer to transfer the energy from the hammer to the firing pin. You are correct in that they look similar, but they function completely differently.

[buck460XVR]

Originally Posted by SonOfScubaDiver

I can't say that I've seen much complaining about S&W, other than the lock mechanism that comes on their guns. I'm pretty neutral on that issue, but if there are serious problems with S&W's revolvers, I'd like to know about them.

The reason you see little serious complaining about S&W revolvers is because there is little, in the amount of serious problems. Much of what you do see when you do see complaints are similar to this thread, the same person making multiple posts, saying the same thing over and over.

I own 686s from the -3, -4, -5 and the -6 eras. Altho the brushed satin finish on the -5 and -6s is not as nice as the earlier models, they are the most accurate of the bunch. Funny how now the "new" Smith and Wesson is so disgusting, and folks love the old P&R models, but back in '65 when Bangor Punta took over S&W, the models then were considered "junk", again, because of the supposed lack of quality control. Once again, the more things change, the more the remain the same. If warranty work was going to run them out of business and the guns were such junk, do you think they'd give a lifetime warranty with them? This warranty came out long before the love of internet forums to obtain all of ones "unbiased" opinions. This "lifetime warranty" to the original owner and the proximity to the OTD price of a new 686, is why I think the 6'' model is overpriced. While S&W may repair it or the -3 under warranty(I don't think the -3 is lifetime, but not sure), at some point, they may restrict it to their original intent of the original owner. The $475 price on the -3 is very good,
and would be a very good price on any 686 model if not abused and in good or above condition. I too would not have walked out the door without it, even tho I really don't need another 686.

[BigJimP]

In my area....any early gun in a 4" or 6" model 686 ( up thru the dash 4's ) ...is about a $ 700 - $ 800 gun, if its clean and timing is good - even without box and papers.../ but the 4" guns are in higher demand, and tougher to find and will demand prices at the upper end -- the 6" guns will typically be at the lower end. If you find an early 2 1/2" barrel in a 686 ( they introduced them in 1990 in the dash 3's and it will usually demand another $100 in my area --- they're very hard to find too ). The 8 3/8" barrels are not very popular in my area...and are selling for about $ 100 less than the 6" versions in the same shape.

Don't be afraid of the overstamped "M" on the 686 or 686-1's if you find one...it just means the gun was recalled by the factory, repaired, and put back in circulation with the "M" stamp on it...( I have a 6" 686-1 that has the M and its a very nice gun).

The 6" 686's in my area are less popular ...and they're selling in the $ 600 - $700 price range - again if they're clean and timing is good.

The 686 dash 5's is when the MIM parts and the internal frame lock start showing up ...and they are typically $ 100 under the pre lock and older dash models in the same barrel length.

My favorite 686 is a dash 2, in a 4"...(although I have a dash 3 in 2 1/2", I prefer the N frame in the shorter barrels --- 627 in a 2 5/8" ).. / I like the 686-1 in a 6" as a woods gun, or a nightstand gun but I find it a little clumsy in and out of a holster at the range - compared to either the 686 in a 4" or the older model 27's or 28's in a 4". The 627 perf center gun in a 5" is a nice compromise..heavy, longer sight plane, easy to shoot, 8 shot...

( the newer model 627's ..N frames, 6 or 8 shot / the standard versions are still in the $1,000 - $ 1,100 price range / the Performance Center models are about $100 - $ 150 more ...depending on what stocks are on them / and all of the model 627's are Round Butt frames ....vs the older model 27's ( blued or Nickel were all 6 shot, Square Butt frames ).

[T. O'Heir]

What are you using 'em for? The difference between a 4" and a 6" is the balance and how it feels in your hand.
Prices, of course, vary from place to place, but I wouldn't pay an extra $160 just for a longer barrel.

[SonOfScubaDiver]

Man! Y'unsz iz gonna git me into trouble! I'm startin to think I was stupid for not taking that 4" home with me! I'm gonna call that LGS in the morning and find out if that gun is still there and go ahead and get it. I guess it's OK to be broke as long as ya got plenty of guns to keep ya company! Heheeeeeeee! Hopefully it hasn't sold yet.

[SonOfScubaDiver]

What a difference a couple of days can make. Yes, the gun was still available when I called the gun shop, but I decided to wait until I tried the Pachmayr grips I ordered for my SP101. Trying them out today worked out so well that I've decided to wait before buying a larger framed 357. After all the comments I've been reading lately about the used S&Ws being much better quality than the new ones, I've decided to wait until I find a really really nice used one, maybe one that hasn't been fired a lot or obviously in like new condition. The 4" -3 I was looking at is nice, but it isn't in what I'd call like new condition. So, I can get my 357 "fix" with the SP101 for now, and get the must have pristine older version 686 when I find one. I really appreciate all the help I'm getting from y'all on getting a 686.

[ms6852]

I own a pre-dash and pre-lock 686 and in my neck of the woods the 686 models start at $600.