25-06 load help

ac700wildcat · November 5, 2008, 06:30 AM

I've been trying to get a load to shoot decent in my new rem 700sps stainless in 25-06. Federal blue box 117gr round shoot about an inch at 100yds in this rifle. The load I have been working with consists of Winchester brass, cci br2 primers, 115gr nosler partitions, and imr 4350 powder. I have shot from 47 grains of powder all the way up to 52 grains in 1/2gr increments. I started loading .01" off the lands and was getting 4-5" groups no matter how much powder I put in the case.

I changed to seating the bullet right to the lands and my loads that were around 2900fps really started to group well, so I moved up to 51gr and 51.5gr loads and was getting groups of about 2-2 1/2". Then I worked up some loads at 51.2, 51.4, 51.6, and 51.8 grains. Out of those the 51.6 and 51.8 grouped better than the others, with the 51.8 grouping about 1.5". I'd like to get some better accuracy out of this combination, but am not sure what I should change next. Any suggestions would be great.

Thanks

jeo556 · November 5, 2008, 10:16 AM

I'm a noob reloader here so take this at it's worth. While reading around it seems that certain guns like certain bullet/powder combinations. Your particular rifle may not like nosler partitions or the bullet/powder combo that you are using. I think you may want to try another powder with the partitions and see what happens. If that doesn't work you may want to abandon the partitions altogether. Again, I'm new to reloading and just thinking out load. Good luck.

musher · November 5, 2008, 10:37 AM

You know, I've never been able to get those noslers to shoot very well in my Ruger either.

ac700wildcat · November 5, 2008, 03:26 PM

I've actually tried hornady bullets with similar loads as well with pretty much the same results. I guess I was just hoping for some tips to maybe get a bit more accuracy. I think I might try changing primers before I change powders. I had a friend suggest the imr4350 and he has used it in quite a few 25-06's. According to him they have all shot great with it and partitions. I guess thats not to say my rifle just doesn't like the powder tho.

Inspector3711 · November 5, 2008, 03:31 PM

With my .223 I actually found magic when I backed the bullet out to .040 off of the lands. I did this after reading a book about accuracy. The author had a rifle he was frustrated with (much like myself) and accidentally forgot to reset his die for that particular rifle. He discovered his mistake after the bullets were seated and then decided to leave it that way since he was only interested in fireforming brass. It turned out to be just what the doctor ordered for that rifle. My .223 has been a 3/4" group rifle on a good day but during my last range day I shot two sub half inch groups and it turns out they were the ten rounds I set at .040". Unfortunately it has taken me 6 months to figure out what works!

My .25-06 likes 87 grain Sierra Varminters to be set .080 off of the lands and in fact I can't get much closer because the throat is long in that rifle. I haven't developed big game loads for it yet but 100 grain bullets and above will reach the lands (checked it with a OAL gauge). It will be interesting to see how it all pans out.

ac700wildcat · November 5, 2008, 04:08 PM

I've also thought about seating them deeper as you suggested. Right now with them against the lands they are at the saami max oal. I was really hoping to have a load worked up for deer season that I could use, but beings season starts Friday here and we have a winter storm coming through for a few days I won't have anymore time for testing for a while. 1.5" groups are just fine for deer hunting if I limit my shots to 200yds. If I want to shoot farther I'll just have to use the trusty old 30-06 that I have shooting 150gr ssts into 3/4" three shots groups.

I should probably change directions now and start working up a load for coyotes. I'm thinking 85gr nosler ballistic tips will do well. Just not sure what my choice of powder will be yet.

10 Spot Terminator · November 5, 2008, 04:28 PM

Go back to the most accurate load you had on your list with the bullets touching the lands and work up some 3 round packages moving the bullets back off of the lands in .005 inch incriments . This may surprise you . Note as well when doing your work up for hunting rounds It is that first bullet that usually counts. To get the best chance of that first round being the best it can be consider this when testing your loads . Was the barrel just cleaned before you fired that first shot ? Quite often especially in a new rifle the point of impact will be slightly different on a freshly cleaned bore and if you use a chronograph it will surprise you as well to be the SLOWEST of the next few rounds fired ! For my testing I will take along some fouling rounds and fire 2 rounds after having thoroughly cleanened the bore to remove all residual solvents and gun oil etc. . Then you must be sure to let the barrel cool for a good 15 or so minutes ( take along a .22 , it helps pass the time ) as a cold barrel vs. a warm barrel will change the point of impact as well . When you start shooting wait between shots for the barrel to cool completely . This can take 5 to 10 minutes on the average depending on the weather or how hot the loads are . Use this to get you in the ball park and then load up a box and wring them out always being sure to fire those fouling rounds first. After you have found the "Majic Bean" ,,, clean you gun, run a lightly oiled patch through the bore and store it away. If you can fire the gun 2 times and run a few dry patches through it and even a dry NYLON bore brush a day or so before you head out to hunt . You will feel better knowing you have done all you can to make that first shot count . Happy Shootin, 10 SPOT

tkofoid · November 5, 2008, 04:54 PM

My tikka 25-06 simply doesn't like anything over 100 grains. I sorta went through the same thing as you,,,then I tryed 100 grainers and they worked.
I am not saying your gun will not shoot anything over 100,, Guns are sorta like women at times,,,'finiky'. and they'll never come right out and tell you what they like,,,you gotta guess!

crowbeaner · November 5, 2008, 04:58 PM

Try some RL22 and Sierra 117 grain BTSPs. Use a factory Federal cartridge to set your seating die and load to the same OAL.

2506 · November 5, 2008, 06:25 PM

I find RL19, RL22, H1000,& H4831. work better with 100 grain or more bullets in 25-06. I seat mine out to 0.05 thou from the lands but you will have to play around with seating out your bullet until you find out what your rifle likes.

__________________________________________________________________________________________

If it ain't broke don't fix it

mrawesome22 · November 5, 2008, 08:15 PM

Yep. Change the powder and bullet.

ac700wildcat · November 5, 2008, 08:32 PM

I think I'll take some of the advise given and try seating the bullets a bit deeper and see what happens. I'd rather not change the bullet and powder yet, if at all possible. Plus I have no use for the powder other than for the 25-06 and may as well use it up and see if I can get this combination to work.

rg1 · November 5, 2008, 11:29 PM

My Rem Sendero 25-06 seems to prefer 87gr SP and 100gr Hornady Spire Points 40 thousandths off the rifling. I've tested them from 10-50 thou and groups tighten at 40 thousandths.
I seat Hornady 117 BTSP's to Hornady's recommended oal at 3.165" and they shoot slightly less than an inch with no other load development. I use IMR 4831, RP cases, RP 9 1/2 primers with all loads.
My rifle seems to shoot all bullet weights well and one of the most accurate rounds I've shot with factory ammo has been with 120gr Rem HP's.
Nosler #4 Manual lists IMR4350 starting at 45 grains and maximum at 49 grains using Win brass and Win LR primers using the 115gr Nosler Partition bullet in 25-06.

Lilswede1 · November 5, 2008, 11:48 PM

Just couldnt get the 117 gr. to group well at all.
Buddy gave me some 100 gr. to try cause he had same problem.
5 round groupings dropped from 1 1/2" to 1/2" or touching at 100yds.
Using 54 gr. IMR 4831 am getting 3100 fps.
Gonna stick with this load.

ac700wildcat · November 6, 2008, 05:29 AM

rg1, my nosler 6 manual lists the same max as your number 4. I have check a bunch of different manuals and websites of powder companies and have seen max load from the 49 all the way up to 52gr. I started low and worked my way up to the 52gr max that I have shot. I haven't seen a single pressure sign, so they should be ok, although I do always inspect my brass after each shot when I'm testing and before they get loaded. It definately looks like I should try seating the bullets deeper. Thanks, for the help.

25fan · November 6, 2008, 10:28 AM

My Sako and the two Rem 700's I have had, never shot the partitions well. The Rems favored 100 gr. ballistic tips, while the Sako shot lights out with 117 gr. Hornaday boat-tails. I used IMR 4350 on all. With the Sako load, I used 49.0 grs. jomo

flyboy14 · November 6, 2008, 10:42 AM

My ruger didn't like the partitions, tried similar load with imr 4350 with same results. Switched to hornady 117 interlocks, with magnum primer, and imr 4831 (had some) and shoots .5-.75 groups. Funny thing, the first loads with 4831 were 1", just switching to the magnum primer seemed to make the difference.

FM12 · November 7, 2008, 08:14 PM

I load the Sierra 1640 bullet using IMR 4350 powder...VERY accurate.

November 5, 2008, 06:30 AM	#1
ac700wildcat Senior Member Join Date: September 11, 2008 Location: ND Posts: 239	25-06 load help I've been trying to get a load to shoot decent in my new rem 700sps stainless in 25-06. Federal blue box 117gr round shoot about an inch at 100yds in this rifle. The load I have been working with consists of Winchester brass, cci br2 primers, 115gr nosler partitions, and imr 4350 powder. I have shot from 47 grains of powder all the way up to 52 grains in 1/2gr increments. I started loading .01" off the lands and was getting 4-5" groups no matter how much powder I put in the case. I changed to seating the bullet right to the lands and my loads that were around 2900fps really started to group well, so I moved up to 51gr and 51.5gr loads and was getting groups of about 2-2 1/2". Then I worked up some loads at 51.2, 51.4, 51.6, and 51.8 grains. Out of those the 51.6 and 51.8 grouped better than the others, with the 51.8 grouping about 1.5". I'd like to get some better accuracy out of this combination, but am not sure what I should change next. Any suggestions would be great. Thanks

November 5, 2008, 10:16 AM	#2
jeo556 Senior Member Join Date: February 18, 2007 Location: Southwestern, PA Posts: 268	I'm a noob reloader here so take this at it's worth. While reading around it seems that certain guns like certain bullet/powder combinations. Your particular rifle may not like nosler partitions or the bullet/powder combo that you are using. I think you may want to try another powder with the partitions and see what happens. If that doesn't work you may want to abandon the partitions altogether. Again, I'm new to reloading and just thinking out load. Good luck. __________________ Jeo556

November 5, 2008, 03:31 PM	#5
Inspector3711 Senior Member Join Date: February 9, 2008 Location: Puget Sound Washington Posts: 1,553	With my .223 I actually found magic when I backed the bullet out to .040 off of the lands. I did this after reading a book about accuracy. The author had a rifle he was frustrated with (much like myself) and accidentally forgot to reset his die for that particular rifle. He discovered his mistake after the bullets were seated and then decided to leave it that way since he was only interested in fireforming brass. It turned out to be just what the doctor ordered for that rifle. My .223 has been a 3/4" group rifle on a good day but during my last range day I shot two sub half inch groups and it turns out they were the ten rounds I set at .040". Unfortunately it has taken me 6 months to figure out what works! My .25-06 likes 87 grain Sierra Varminters to be set .080 off of the lands and in fact I can't get much closer because the throat is long in that rifle. I haven't developed big game loads for it yet but 100 grain bullets and above will reach the lands (checked it with a OAL gauge). It will be interesting to see how it all pans out. __________________ "If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun." The Dalai Llama (5/15/01, The Seattle Times) "That rifle on the wall of the labourer's cottage or working class flat is the symbol of democracy. It is our job to see that it stays there." George Orwell

November 5, 2008, 04:28 PM	#7
10 Spot Terminator Senior Member Join Date: January 3, 2008 Location: Central Oregon Posts: 348	Go back to the most accurate load you had on your list with the bullets touching the lands and work up some 3 round packages moving the bullets back off of the lands in .005 inch incriments . This may surprise you . Note as well when doing your work up for hunting rounds It is that first bullet that usually counts. To get the best chance of that first round being the best it can be consider this when testing your loads . Was the barrel just cleaned before you fired that first shot ? Quite often especially in a new rifle the point of impact will be slightly different on a freshly cleaned bore and if you use a chronograph it will surprise you as well to be the SLOWEST of the next few rounds fired ! For my testing I will take along some fouling rounds and fire 2 rounds after having thoroughly cleanened the bore to remove all residual solvents and gun oil etc. . Then you must be sure to let the barrel cool for a good 15 or so minutes ( take along a .22 , it helps pass the time ) as a cold barrel vs. a warm barrel will change the point of impact as well . When you start shooting wait between shots for the barrel to cool completely . This can take 5 to 10 minutes on the average depending on the weather or how hot the loads are . Use this to get you in the ball park and then load up a box and wring them out always being sure to fire those fouling rounds first. After you have found the "Majic Bean" ,,, clean you gun, run a lightly oiled patch through the bore and store it away. If you can fire the gun 2 times and run a few dry patches through it and even a dry NYLON bore brush a day or so before you head out to hunt . You will feel better knowing you have done all you can to make that first shot count . Happy Shootin, 10 SPOT Last edited by 10 Spot Terminator; November 5, 2008 at 04:55 PM.

November 5, 2008, 04:58 PM	#9
crowbeaner Senior Member Join Date: June 4, 2007 Location: Upstate SC Posts: 1,943	Try some RL22 and Sierra 117 grain BTSPs. Use a factory Federal cartridge to set your seating die and load to the same OAL. __________________ If you want your children to follow in your footsteps, be careful where you walk. Beware the man that only owns one gun; he probably knows how to use it. I just hope my ship comes in before my dock rots.

November 5, 2008, 10:37 AM	#3
musher Senior Member Join Date: April 23, 2005 Posts: 462	You know, I've never been able to get those noslers to shoot very well in my Ruger either.

November 5, 2008, 03:26 PM	#4
ac700wildcat Senior Member Join Date: September 11, 2008 Location: ND Posts: 239	I've actually tried hornady bullets with similar loads as well with pretty much the same results. I guess I was just hoping for some tips to maybe get a bit more accuracy. I think I might try changing primers before I change powders. I had a friend suggest the imr4350 and he has used it in quite a few 25-06's. According to him they have all shot great with it and partitions. I guess thats not to say my rifle just doesn't like the powder tho.

November 5, 2008, 04:08 PM	#6
ac700wildcat Senior Member Join Date: September 11, 2008 Location: ND Posts: 239	I've also thought about seating them deeper as you suggested. Right now with them against the lands they are at the saami max oal. I was really hoping to have a load worked up for deer season that I could use, but beings season starts Friday here and we have a winter storm coming through for a few days I won't have anymore time for testing for a while. 1.5" groups are just fine for deer hunting if I limit my shots to 200yds. If I want to shoot farther I'll just have to use the trusty old 30-06 that I have shooting 150gr ssts into 3/4" three shots groups. I should probably change directions now and start working up a load for coyotes. I'm thinking 85gr nosler ballistic tips will do well. Just not sure what my choice of powder will be yet.

November 5, 2008, 04:54 PM	#8
tkofoid Senior Member Join Date: October 10, 2008 Location: N. D. Posts: 149	My tikka 25-06 simply doesn't like anything over 100 grains. I sorta went through the same thing as you,,,then I tryed 100 grainers and they worked. I am not saying your gun will not shoot anything over 100,, Guns are sorta like women at times,,,'finiky'. and they'll never come right out and tell you what they like,,,you gotta guess!

November 5, 2008, 06:25 PM	#10
2506 Junior Member Join Date: November 5, 2008 Location: England Posts: 2	I find RL19, RL22, H1000,& H4831. work better with 100 grain or more bullets in 25-06. I seat mine out to 0.05 thou from the lands but you will have to play around with seating out your bullet until you find out what your rifle likes. __________________________________________________________________________________________ If it ain't broke don't fix it Last edited by 2506; November 5, 2008 at 06:31 PM.

November 5, 2008, 08:15 PM	#11
mrawesome22 Senior Member Join Date: November 9, 2005 Location: Ohio, Appalachia's foothills. Posts: 3,779	Yep. Change the powder and bullet.

November 5, 2008, 08:32 PM	#12
ac700wildcat Senior Member Join Date: September 11, 2008 Location: ND Posts: 239	I think I'll take some of the advise given and try seating the bullets a bit deeper and see what happens. I'd rather not change the bullet and powder yet, if at all possible. Plus I have no use for the powder other than for the 25-06 and may as well use it up and see if I can get this combination to work.

November 5, 2008, 11:29 PM	#13
rg1 Senior Member Join Date: November 6, 2001 Posts: 1,125	My Rem Sendero 25-06 seems to prefer 87gr SP and 100gr Hornady Spire Points 40 thousandths off the rifling. I've tested them from 10-50 thou and groups tighten at 40 thousandths. I seat Hornady 117 BTSP's to Hornady's recommended oal at 3.165" and they shoot slightly less than an inch with no other load development. I use IMR 4831, RP cases, RP 9 1/2 primers with all loads. My rifle seems to shoot all bullet weights well and one of the most accurate rounds I've shot with factory ammo has been with 120gr Rem HP's. Nosler #4 Manual lists IMR4350 starting at 45 grains and maximum at 49 grains using Win brass and Win LR primers using the 115gr Nosler Partition bullet in 25-06. Last edited by rg1; November 5, 2008 at 11:37 PM.

November 5, 2008, 11:48 PM	#14
Lilswede1 Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2008 Location: NW Wash State Posts: 216	Had same problem w/my 700. Just couldnt get the 117 gr. to group well at all. Buddy gave me some 100 gr. to try cause he had same problem. 5 round groupings dropped from 1 1/2" to 1/2" or touching at 100yds. Using 54 gr. IMR 4831 am getting 3100 fps. Gonna stick with this load.

November 6, 2008, 05:29 AM	#15
ac700wildcat Senior Member Join Date: September 11, 2008 Location: ND Posts: 239	rg1, my nosler 6 manual lists the same max as your number 4. I have check a bunch of different manuals and websites of powder companies and have seen max load from the 49 all the way up to 52gr. I started low and worked my way up to the 52gr max that I have shot. I haven't seen a single pressure sign, so they should be ok, although I do always inspect my brass after each shot when I'm testing and before they get loaded. It definately looks like I should try seating the bullets deeper. Thanks, for the help.

November 6, 2008, 10:28 AM	#16
25fan Member Join Date: November 4, 2008 Location: Gulfport, MS Posts: 21	My Sako and the two Rem 700's I have had, never shot the partitions well. The Rems favored 100 gr. ballistic tips, while the Sako shot lights out with 117 gr. Hornaday boat-tails. I used IMR 4350 on all. With the Sako load, I used 49.0 grs. jomo __________________ " A government big enough to give you all you want, is a government big enough to take all you have." Thomas Jefferson

November 6, 2008, 10:42 AM	#17
flyboy14 Senior Member Join Date: February 24, 2008 Location: south dakota Posts: 175	My ruger didn't like the partitions, tried similar load with imr 4350 with same results. Switched to hornady 117 interlocks, with magnum primer, and imr 4831 (had some) and shoots .5-.75 groups. Funny thing, the first loads with 4831 were 1", just switching to the magnum primer seemed to make the difference.

November 7, 2008, 08:14 PM	#18
FM12 Senior Member Join Date: February 5, 2007 Location: Monroeville, Alabama Posts: 1,683	I load the Sierra 1640 bullet using IMR 4350 powder...VERY accurate.