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Old June 30, 2011, 06:45 AM   #1
BfloBill
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Double for home defense?

Does anybody out there use a double for home defense?
My wife is small and not a firearms enthusiast, but would be more than willing to do what is needed to protect home and family. I was thinking that a short barreled double would be lighter and easier to operate than a fully loaded pump/auto for her.
With the layout of my house (relatively small w/narrow hallway) a determined attacker would probably be on top of you before you could get off more than 2 shots anyway (assuming worst case scenario of somehow missing twice with a shotgun in a narrow hallway!)

Comments?

Ideas?
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Old June 30, 2011, 07:18 AM   #2
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After the second shot -- then what????
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Old June 30, 2011, 07:20 AM   #3
Bill DeShivs
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A double should work very well. You don't need a 8 shot 12 ga. to defend against burglars.
After 2 shots? Reload if necessary.
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Old June 30, 2011, 07:23 AM   #4
Manos de Piedra
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I have a coach gun for just such a purpose (also for rabbit hunting). For HD, there are a lot of options, and gun guys (like me) have and always will think this this issue to death plus 15 minutes. My coach gun is my go to, until, after a few months the "more available rounds" thing creeps into my head and the mossberg 590 comes out. That of course is for a few months when "quick follow up" thing begins to creep into my head.

The double is fine, as long as your comfortable with it.
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Old June 30, 2011, 08:11 AM   #5
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Just remember, a lighter gun will have more actual recoil and typically more felt recoil, so train with target loads as she is learning how to operate it.

Also, you and her need to read Thecorneredcat.com, written by a woman for men and women
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Old June 30, 2011, 08:29 AM   #6
microman
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Something like the Stoeger Double Defense
coach shotgun??

http://www.stoegerindustries.com/fir...le_defense.php
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Old June 30, 2011, 08:46 AM   #7
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Quote:
After the second shot -- then what????
Mr Groin meet Mr Buttstock
Quote:
(assuming worst case scenario of somehow missing twice with a shotgun in a narrow hallway!)
Don't get lulled into the "It's a shotgun you don't even need to aim" mentality. At HD range the pattern is only going to be a few incches wide. Some practice is prudent. A 20g with 3 buck is nothing to sneezze at either.
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Old June 30, 2011, 09:29 AM   #8
Mike Irwin
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"Mr Groin meet Mr Buttstock"



The biggest problem in using a double for home defense?

Not being able to rack the action, which causes every burglar in a 500 meter radius to lose his bowels and flee in abject terror.

Or so I've been told.
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Old June 30, 2011, 09:36 AM   #9
rdf.hack
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Well if its a SxS, you can always go Army of Darkness on them : Hold it above your head and say "This is mah Boomstick!" and then they will flee in terror.
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Old June 30, 2011, 10:03 AM   #10
Mike Irwin
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"Well if its a SxS, you can always go Army of Darkness on them : Hold it above your head and say "This is mah Boomstick!" and then they will flee in terror."


OOOOOOOhhhhhhh!

New home defense tactic to be adopted!

Now where's my chainsaw?
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Old June 30, 2011, 10:56 AM   #11
mete
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You can get short barreled light weight auto shotguns such as some of the Benellis.Make sure the gun fits her especially LOP.

A psychopath high on drugs may not hear the racking sound or if he does he may not care !
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Old June 30, 2011, 11:15 AM   #12
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Considering that double barrel shotguns have been used for home (and outside the home) defense since they were invented, I don't see any issues with using one.

Remember that unlike TV and movies, civilians should NOT be in the habit of providing their own cover fire. Generally speaking, in a home defense situation, one does not shoot "to keep their heads down". One shoots only in "gravest extreme". Get a butt cuff if you think you need extra ammo onboard the gun.

I have a chinese made coach gun that serves as my home defense long arm, and do not feel undergunned. Just make sure your lady understands the gun, and gets a little practice.

My mother was a small woman (4'11, 108lbs, size 3.5 ring) but she could shoot her daddy's Ithaca 12ga SxS. It wasn't her preferred gun, she liked her .22 Ruger Bearcat better, but she was comfortable and confident with that double barrel. Her shooting "style" for it was from the hip. As she put it, "just hold on tight and let it swing". The gun was just too big for her to shoulder and use it the regular way, but she could manage it that way. And she was accurate enough at short range, which was all that was intended, anyway.

Another thing about a double barrel, if you do wind up in court, a jury is more likely to consider it a defensive weapon than a pistol grip/folding stock short barrel pump gun, with ammo carrier and barrel heat shield bolted on it. A gun like that makes it look like you were seeking combat, to those who are under educated about firearms (which is going to be every one on a jury, if the prosecutor can manage it). A small woman defending her babies with a squirrel gun or duck gun is a lot less likely to be thought a "Rambo" type who just wanted to shoot someone!

Just make sure she understands that shotguns are not magic "can't miss" firearms. The old saying "can't miss with a shotgun" has probably gotten more people hurt or killed than anything else except "don't worry, it's not loaded!"


Quote:
Also, you and her need to read Thecorneredcat.com, written by a woman for men and women
And I fully agree!
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Old June 30, 2011, 12:14 PM   #13
Glenn E. Meyer
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If you do get one, make sure the users gets a fair amout of practice.

If you do reload, folks forget (like me) about the safety coming back on with some guns.

I agree with reading Pax's site and the shotgun will be just fine for most uses but it should be a considered choice as compared to the superweapon view of a shotgun.
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Old June 30, 2011, 02:12 PM   #14
Dave McC
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Col Jeff Cooper knew something about the principles of personal defence and weaponry.

A double barreled shotgun of the sort known as a Lupara formed part of his homeowner's insurance plan.

In trained hands, a double is a formidable weapon. As with all weapons, the key is training, training,training....
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Old June 30, 2011, 02:18 PM   #15
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Very true but I think a pump action is a better idea. The pump usually holds at least 3 more shells and just pump it, it will never fail unless something goes seriously wrong.
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Old June 30, 2011, 02:20 PM   #16
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+1 for the Stoeger double barrel

I got a Stoeger Condor youth for my wife. She loves it. She is real small so we got her one chambered in .410. With all the ammo being made for the Judge there are some real good HD loads for it. I got a cuff for the stock that was intended for rifle ammo and it holds the .410s perfect. I would definitely suggest getting a setup like this. I think she is not as intimidated by it since it is not a semi auto or the action to cycle.
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Old June 30, 2011, 04:30 PM   #17
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My biggest concern would be the kick. Doubles kick like a mule.
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Old June 30, 2011, 06:58 PM   #18
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I generally recommend 20 guages for women. SxS's are probably quite addequate for almost all scenarios, simple, short, cool and effective. Even if they weren't they'd still be better than nothing.

A 20 ga. pump w/a short stock may be more useful for the Mrs. too. The problems are bigger-framed, heftier, longer, guns have front-heavy LEVERAGE and her shorter-than-the-average-man's arms reaching way out to control the gun and the little hands on big furniture doesn't help. Test 'em out, and then, as stated, make sure she shoots with you enough to make operating it second nature. Try lite sport loads, work up to full ones, and then buy two boxes of #4 Buck -- one to test and the other for the house.

Last edited by Gehrhard; June 30, 2011 at 07:04 PM.
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Old June 30, 2011, 07:31 PM   #19
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Quote:
My biggest concern would be the kick. Doubles kick like a mule.
Not if they FIT or weigh what a BB gun weighs, and you leave the 3 or 3-1/2 uber loads home
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Old June 30, 2011, 07:57 PM   #20
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Quote:
BfloBill
Double for home defense?
I would not recommend it. Two shots is little insurance.

I also personally don't like shotguns for HD unless the person is barricaded in a room with their back against the wall.

Also, I just noticed that you said your house has narrow hallways... Not an ideal situation for a shotgun. Now before everyone starts getting all huffy, let me say that a shotgun does have its place in HD, just not usually inside a house with corners and narrow hallways in the hands of a novice.
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Old June 30, 2011, 08:02 PM   #21
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I shot, today, with a guy that had a different ou. It was a Maverick with short barrels, a synthetic stock, a front rifle type sight and a picattiny type rail on the receiver that had a wedge in it for a rear sight. He added a stick on flexible comb pad. I didin't watch how he was doing and he admitted he didn't know where he was shooting with it. He also had a single shot Harrison and Richardson 12 gauge and I believe a BR-99. Anyway that ou is marketed for home defense.
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Old June 30, 2011, 08:08 PM   #22
Dave McC
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Tyler, my HD shotguns are well used 870s. But like the 1911( another familiar platform to me) I recognise that expertise with a pump requires a bit or bunch more training because of the more complicated MOA.

Compare a GM to a Model 13 S&W, For someone who knows the 1911, that may be the better choice. For Jane or Joe Average, the simple DA revolver is way easier to learn without having to run a few thousand rounds through it.

Doubles are easier to learn, the downside, just two shots.

However, often two is enough.

HD shotguns are not one size or style fits all. An arthritic senior may be better served with a simple to operate break action 410 than a customized Saiga 12 with belt feed and lazer.
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Old June 30, 2011, 08:12 PM   #23
Nnobby45
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Quote:
A double should work very well. You don't need a 8 shot 12 ga. to defend against burglars.
After 2 shots? Reload if necessary.
Sorry to disagree, William, but neither you nor I nor a home owner knows how many shots will be necessary in a violent home invasion robbery.

If you have to reload, it means you didn't get the job done with the two shots you'd be limited to. Trying to reload while standing there in your shorts (if that) when things are happening fast could be problematic.

Even with a side saddle on the double. I'd rather carry my spare rounds in the magazine. And yes, a double would be much better than nothing an would handle some situations just fine.

Last edited by Nnobby45; June 30, 2011 at 08:31 PM.
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Old June 30, 2011, 08:51 PM   #24
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Thanks for all your input.
44AMP- I definitely intended to get a butt cuff and train on reloading.
Gerhard- I did not rule out getting a 20 ga., I know most like a 12 for home defense, but what gave me this idea was trying out my Ruger Red Label with #3 Buck for coyotes. (Don't worry I'm not going to butcher my O/U!)

There is a gun show coming to my area in Aug. that should give me enough time to mull over the options and squirrel away some cash.

Keep the ideas coming.
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Old June 30, 2011, 10:32 PM   #25
Doc TH
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A double should be fine for your purposes.
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