Strategies for defense in a car - Page 2

**OldMarksman** · May 10, 2017, 02:42 PM

Quote:

I read your posts Danoobie.... Advocating committing a felony here is generally frowned upon.

While the sentence structure was a little confusing, I took the comment as a recommendation to leave without resorting to the gun.

PlatinumCore16 · May 10, 2017, 02:47 PM

Quote:

While the sentence structure was a little confusing, I took the comment as a recommendation to leave without resorting to the gun.

Also how I read it.
"Well, if you are shooting through the glass,
as FireForged said, why not just drive away[INSTEAD OF SHOOTING IN THE FIRST PLACE]?" It seems that you are already in your car, so just leave.

K_Mac · May 10, 2017, 02:47 PM

Yes, I reread the post and decided the same thing... and then found I had prematurely hit post. My apologies.

FireForged · May 10, 2017, 06:49 PM

Quote:

I read your posts Danoobie, and can't help wondering if you just trolling to see how much you can get away with. Maybe you're trying to be funny. It's not working if that is the case. Advocating committing a felony here is generally frowned upon.

Perhaps you simply misunderstand.

Comments in this thread are presumably made within the context of lawful self defense and tactics for carrying out "lawful self defense". Sometimes, that involves a firearm. Nobody is advocating criminal behavior and I certainly did not take his comment to be anything like that.

He seemed to be saying.. rather than use a firearm, just get out of there or perhaps use some other method that does not involve a gun.

His comment certainly does not rise to or hint of a "troll post".. geeeesh

Mainah · May 10, 2017, 08:30 PM

Based on my experience one good training approach is to pay careful attention to traffic situations that leave you boxed in. For example a stoplight at a busy intersection when you've got cars on either side, and in front and back of you.

Obviously safely driving away from a situation is the best outcome. But every day on a commute to work you have the opportunity to evaluate options when that isn't possible.

2123 · May 10, 2017, 08:33 PM

Quote:
Many will use that pretense to approach others and size them up, or see if they are cooperative.

Doesn't matter if you are in a car or are on foot. Half the battle for the criminal is to make contact, catch you off-guard, and go about their business.

It takes a lot more than that to justify reaching for a weapon.

You misconstrued my point or comment. I said NOTHING about reaching for a weapon. I simply stated how some low-life's approach others, and use various excuses to put them off-guard, just prior to them committing a crime.

Just for the record. If someone approaches you and implies or threatens you with bodily harm, you can indeed, reach for your weapon.

I was in LE for 30 yrs. I've been around the dangerous blocks a few thousand times.

**OldMarksman** · May 10, 2017, 09:56 PM

Quote:

You misconstrued my point or comment. I said NOTHING about reaching for a weapon.

You were responding to a question about threatening the use of deadly force,

Quote:

Just for the record. If someone approaches you and implies or threatens you with bodily harm, you can indeed, reach for your weapon.

Nope! Not at all! A person who is nota worn officer performing lear enfov=cement duties may not do so except under certain circumstances.

In most jurisdictions, you may do so if and only if you have reason to believe that the person has the ability and the opportunity to kill or cause serious bodily harm and is likely do so, and you have no other alternative.

In a handful of jurisdictions, the threshold for justification is somewhat lower.

Quote:

I was in LE for 30 yrs.

Something apparently did not stick.

Here's something on the subject:

https://thefiringline.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=536596

JERRYS. · May 10, 2017, 11:11 PM

doors locked, windows up, drive the heck outta there at all costs.

Adizzle19 · May 11, 2017, 04:34 PM

I only had a couple takeaways from this experience. First, obviously, drive away if possible. In this situation that was hard because I was parallel parked, but ideally get out of there. Second, I plan on moving my pistol from owb around 4:00 to around 1:00 iwb. I've carried like that occasionally, but now I think I see a lot more value in it now.

I can't really think of much more besides getting out of there and carrying in a more accessible place while seated.

James K · May 11, 2017, 06:53 PM

Some years ago, a friend had a radio mike hanging on his instrument panel in plain sight. Not a radio, just a mike with a wire to nowhere. Over a period of several years, a number of people walked up to his car, caught a glimpse of that mike and decided they had urgent business elsewhere. What with all the commo gear available today, that idea might be outdated, but at the time that mike screamed "cop car" and wannabe bad guys took off.

Jim

chaim · May 12, 2017, 03:15 PM

Ever since Central MD became a hotbed of carjacking activity (like many major metro areas) I've thought about what to do for self defense in my car. I'm a bit constrained by the fact that MD has very limited CCW laws (near impossible for regular people). The fact that I used to live in Baltimore City and often drove to work through some questionable parts of the city really made me think.

Number one is situational awareness. If anything about the intersection makes me even the slightest bit nervous, I do all I can not be be totally boxed in. If at all possible I pick a lane with no one in front of me. When possible I move as far to the right as I can in an empty lane (right turn on red tends to be easier and safer than running straight through a red light, though you do what you have to do in the situation). If someone wants to talk to me in a parking lot, I do it through a closed window or I may lower it 1/2" or less, my car is in gear and I'm ready to hit the gas if I feel the need to get out of there (no worries about being rude). I'm more likely to talk to them if they are with a family than if it is a single guy, and the one or two times someone pulled a vehicle in front of me and signaled they wanted to talk, I backed out of there and got out of Dodge quickly. Even if they don't try to box me in, if they are in a car and want to talk, I'm on guard quite a bit more than if they are on foot.

Next is something for defense. I have a folding knife in my center console that fits MD's definition of a legal "pen knife" and given that I use it far more for opening boxes and other related jobs, saying it is a tool and not a self defense weapon is pretty accurate (here, you can carry "pen knives": folding knives 4" or shorter, if and only if they are used as tools and not as a weapon). Of course it is a tool that can be used as an improvised weapon if I am attacked while in my car. Despite being totally legal, I do get a little nervous what a cop would think if they saw it (this is MD) so it is sometimes buried under something or concealed (legally) on my person while driving and thus not quite as accessible as I'd like. I also have some gel pepper spray that does a good job of sending out a concentrated stream so I can use it from the driver's seat without getting me as much as my attacker as I would with a pepper spray that unleashes a cloud of the stuff.

As for CCW defense, I've thought about an ankle holster as a good option for the car. I don't like ankle carry and don't do it, but I suspect (should MD ever go shall issue) I will probably keep a snub revolver or comparable auto in an ankle holster in a safe in the car for use when driving (or when I use a smaller CCW have an ankle holster for it in the car to move the gun to when driving). While sitting in the driver's seat, I can easily reach my ankle but not so easily reach something in my belt line. Though, I haven't tested out the idea to see how comfortable and realistic it is in real life when I'm carrying in a state where I legally can (like I said, I don't much like ankle carry). While I like the idea of an ankle carry in the car option, when in states where I can carry I simply find myself moving my holster forward a bit to where it is easier to reach when sitting instead.

chaim · May 12, 2017, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Some years ago, a friend had a radio mike hanging on his instrument panel in plain sight. Not a radio, just a mike with a wire to nowhere. Over a period of several years, a number of people walked up to his car, caught a glimpse of that mike and decided they had urgent business elsewhere.

I like it.

Some years ago (late 80's through about 1990 or 91) just before we started getting cell phones, a few of my buddies and I got CBs. When we were driving somewhere in a group it was nice to be able to talk, and a few of us were in pizza delivery at the time and it was really nice to be able to easily talk to each other while out on delivery. I wonder if the old radio unit is still at my parent's place somewhere in storage.

ShootistPRS · May 13, 2017, 11:03 AM

I have a target stand with removable feet that I use at the range. I always keep a target on it with a nice small group of shots on the backboard (usually the last target I shoot at the range). I have watched people start to get close to the car, see the target and abruptly turn and move away. It's not so much that they were thinking of stealing the car - it's a classic and draws a little attention - but when they see the target they just move away.

May 10, 2017, 02:47 PM	#28
K_Mac Senior Member Join Date: September 15, 2010 Posts: 1,850	Yes, I reread the post and decided the same thing... and then found I had prematurely hit post. My apologies. __________________ "Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do." Benjamin Franklin

May 10, 2017, 08:33 PM	#31
2123 Senior Member Join Date: March 30, 2014 Location: It changes.....a lot. Posts: 356	Quote: Many will use that pretense to approach others and size them up, or see if they are cooperative. Doesn't matter if you are in a car or are on foot. Half the battle for the criminal is to make contact, catch you off-guard, and go about their business. It takes a lot more than that to justify reaching for a weapon. You misconstrued my point or comment. I said NOTHING about reaching for a weapon. I simply stated how some low-life's approach others, and use various excuses to put them off-guard, just prior to them committing a crime. Just for the record. If someone approaches you and implies or threatens you with bodily harm, you can indeed, reach for your weapon. I was in LE for 30 yrs. I've been around the dangerous blocks a few thousand times. __________________ Airborne Rangers Lead The Way.

May 11, 2017, 04:34 PM	#34
Adizzle19 Member Join Date: September 6, 2014 Posts: 75	I only had a couple takeaways from this experience. First, obviously, drive away if possible. In this situation that was hard because I was parallel parked, but ideally get out of there. Second, I plan on moving my pistol from owb around 4:00 to around 1:00 iwb. I've carried like that occasionally, but now I think I see a lot more value in it now. I can't really think of much more besides getting out of there and carrying in a more accessible place while seated. Last edited by Adizzle19; May 11, 2017 at 05:27 PM.

May 12, 2017, 03:15 PM	#36
chaim Senior Member Join Date: December 11, 2001 Location: Maryland Posts: 2,095	Ever since Central MD became a hotbed of carjacking activity (like many major metro areas) I've thought about what to do for self defense in my car. I'm a bit constrained by the fact that MD has very limited CCW laws (near impossible for regular people). The fact that I used to live in Baltimore City and often drove to work through some questionable parts of the city really made me think. Number one is situational awareness. If anything about the intersection makes me even the slightest bit nervous, I do all I can not be be totally boxed in. If at all possible I pick a lane with no one in front of me. When possible I move as far to the right as I can in an empty lane (right turn on red tends to be easier and safer than running straight through a red light, though you do what you have to do in the situation). If someone wants to talk to me in a parking lot, I do it through a closed window or I may lower it 1/2" or less, my car is in gear and I'm ready to hit the gas if I feel the need to get out of there (no worries about being rude). I'm more likely to talk to them if they are with a family than if it is a single guy, and the one or two times someone pulled a vehicle in front of me and signaled they wanted to talk, I backed out of there and got out of Dodge quickly. Even if they don't try to box me in, if they are in a car and want to talk, I'm on guard quite a bit more than if they are on foot. Next is something for defense. I have a folding knife in my center console that fits MD's definition of a legal "pen knife" and given that I use it far more for opening boxes and other related jobs, saying it is a tool and not a self defense weapon is pretty accurate (here, you can carry "pen knives": folding knives 4" or shorter, if and only if they are used as tools and not as a weapon). Of course it is a tool that can be used as an improvised weapon if I am attacked while in my car. Despite being totally legal, I do get a little nervous what a cop would think if they saw it (this is MD) so it is sometimes buried under something or concealed (legally) on my person while driving and thus not quite as accessible as I'd like. I also have some gel pepper spray that does a good job of sending out a concentrated stream so I can use it from the driver's seat without getting me as much as my attacker as I would with a pepper spray that unleashes a cloud of the stuff. As for CCW defense, I've thought about an ankle holster as a good option for the car. I don't like ankle carry and don't do it, but I suspect (should MD ever go shall issue) I will probably keep a snub revolver or comparable auto in an ankle holster in a safe in the car for use when driving (or when I use a smaller CCW have an ankle holster for it in the car to move the gun to when driving). While sitting in the driver's seat, I can easily reach my ankle but not so easily reach something in my belt line. Though, I haven't tested out the idea to see how comfortable and realistic it is in real life when I'm carrying in a state where I legally can (like I said, I don't much like ankle carry). While I like the idea of an ankle carry in the car option, when in states where I can carry I simply find myself moving my holster forward a bit to where it is easier to reach when sitting instead. Last edited by chaim; May 12, 2017 at 03:23 PM.

May 10, 2017, 08:30 PM	#30
Mainah Senior Member Join Date: July 9, 2007 Posts: 1,119	Based on my experience one good training approach is to pay careful attention to traffic situations that leave you boxed in. For example a stoplight at a busy intersection when you've got cars on either side, and in front and back of you. Obviously safely driving away from a situation is the best outcome. But every day on a commute to work you have the opportunity to evaluate options when that isn't possible.

May 10, 2017, 11:11 PM	#33
JERRYS. Senior Member Join Date: September 23, 2013 Location: Alabama Posts: 2,969	doors locked, windows up, drive the heck outta there at all costs.

May 11, 2017, 06:53 PM	#35
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	Some years ago, a friend had a radio mike hanging on his instrument panel in plain sight. Not a radio, just a mike with a wire to nowhere. Over a period of several years, a number of people walked up to his car, caught a glimpse of that mike and decided they had urgent business elsewhere. What with all the commo gear available today, that idea might be outdated, but at the time that mike screamed "cop car" and wannabe bad guys took off. Jim

May 13, 2017, 11:03 AM	#38
ShootistPRS Senior Member Join Date: January 3, 2017 Posts: 1,583	I have a target stand with removable feet that I use at the range. I always keep a target on it with a nice small group of shots on the backboard (usually the last target I shoot at the range). I have watched people start to get close to the car, see the target and abruptly turn and move away. It's not so much that they were thinking of stealing the car - it's a classic and draws a little attention - but when they see the target they just move away.