Where to get a Garand?

cobra81 · June 22, 2006, 10:22 PM

I've pretty much decided to purchase a Garand. Is CMP the best outlet? I've been their website and checked out the different grades....seems they are out of quite a few. Are there any other good sources for Garands? Are most of the rifles available ones that were loaned to Greece or other countries, and are those rifles ones to avoid? Thanks in advance.

maggys drawers · June 23, 2006, 12:05 AM

I got a Greek H&R service grade from CMP about a year ago. Had a MW of 1 and a TE of 2, nice wood with cartouches and a good park job...think it was around $425. I see rifles like that at gun shows going for 1200-1300 bucks. I took a muzzle wear gauge with me to a gun show once...the Garands going for 600-700 bucks swallowed the gauge...probably worn out rack grades or worse going for a helluva lot of money. I'd say CMP is your best bet, unless you could find the proverbial estate sale gun or a private sale. It seems to me like it's caveat emptor for every place but CMP...at least you know what your getting there, and may get a nice surprise like I did...and if it's broke, CMP will make it right.

Tim R · June 23, 2006, 09:11 AM

100% agree, CMP IS the best deal going. They will take sticky notes on the paper work as well. If you are interested in shooting John C. Garand matches with your M-1, let them know. Works once.

nbkky71 · June 23, 2006, 12:14 PM

If you have the chance, take a drive to either the north store (Port Clinton, OH) or the south store (Anniston, AL). You get to browse the racks and hand-pick the rifle that you want. You never know what kind of a diamond you'll find in the rough. I was in Anniston two weeks ago and managed to find a 5-digit rack grade with lockbar sights and a VAR barrel. Another person recently found a rack grade Winchester M1 with a correct winchester barrel.

Even if you attach a note to your mail-in order form (as Tim R mentioned), the CMP may not be able to fulfill your request. They really do try to accomodate requests though. Bottom line is that mail order M1's are luck-of-the-draw.

If you don't mind a refinishing project, buy a rack grade or a less-wood rifle. I think it adds a little more character to your rifle with all the refinishing effort. Here's a couple pics of my refinished rack grade:

Logs · June 23, 2006, 01:35 PM

CMP is the way to go. I live in KY and drove to Camp Perry and picked out several nice M-1's and a few cases of the Greek ammo. I ended up with some great guns with low ME numbers.

The north store is open on Saturdays, ROAD TRIP.

www.odcmp.com

cas · June 23, 2006, 08:10 PM

You can buy a Garand from the CMP for $400 or $500. Or you can buy one from a gun store for $600-$800 and get the same quality/condition rifle.

riverrat66 · June 23, 2006, 08:30 PM

If you go to the north store and hand pick a rifle do you still need to go through all the CMP requirements? I did all the required paperwork, went through the affiliated gun club, etc. about 10 years ago but never purchased the rifle. I'm wondering if I'd have to do that all over again or if I can just go there and buy a rifle. Anyone have any thoughts about that?

riverrat66...out

Logs · June 24, 2006, 07:40 AM

Yes, if you go to the North Store, requirements are the same. You can join a club there if that is all you are missing. They also changed the rules not to long ago and will allow you to buy 12 Garands a year. Not sure what you would do with 12? But hey if you had the $$$$ pretty good investment.

I recommend trying to find a Garand Clinic in your area and shoot the match. I did my match qualifing at Fort Knox and had a BLAST

.... Met a bunch of nice guys who love to shoot.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From the CMP......

ELIGIBILITY REQUIREMENTS
By law, the CMP can sell surplus military firearms, ammunition, parts and other items only to members of CMP affiliated clubs who are also U.S. citizens, over 18 years of age and who are legally eligible to purchase a firearm.

U.S. Citizenship:
You must provide a copy of a U.S. birth certificate, passport, proof of naturalization, or any official government document that shows birth in the U.S. or states citizenship as U.S.

Age
You must provide proof of age. Usually proof of citizenship also provides proof of age. In those cases where it may not, a driver’s license is sufficient.

Membership in CMP Affiliated Organization
You must provide a copy of your current membership card or other proof of membership. This requirement cannot be waived. The CMP currently has over 2,000 affiliated organizations located in many parts of the country.

Membership in many of these organizations costs $25.00 or less and can be accomplished online. A listing of affiliated organizations can be found by clicking on our Club Search web page at http://clubs.odcmp.com/cgi-bin/clubSearch.cgi. If you have any difficulty in locating a club, please contact the CMP at 256-835-8455 or by emailing [email protected]. We will find one for you. In addition to shooting clubs, the CMP also has several special affiliates. Membership in these organizations satisfies our requirement for purchase. These special affiliates include: Congressionally chartered veterans' organizations such as the VFW, AL, DAV, MCL, etc. U.S. Military services (active or reserves), National Guard, to include retirees. Professional 501(c)3 law enforcement organizations and associations such as the FOP, NAPO, NSA, etc.

Note: Club membership IS required for purchase of rifles, parts, and ammunition.

Club membership is NOT required for instructional publications or videos or CMP memorabilia.

Marksmanship or other Firearms Related Activity
You must provide proof of participation in a marksmanship related activity or otherwise show familiarity with the safe handling of firearms and range procedures. Your marksmanship related activity does not have to be with highpower rifles; it can be with smallbore rifles, pistols, air guns or shotguns. Proof of marksmanship participation can be provided by documenting any of the following:

Current or past military service.
Current or past law enforcement service
Participation in a rifle, pistol, air gun or shotgun competition (provide copy of results bulletin).
Completion of a marksmanship clinic that included live fire training (provide a copy of the certificate of completion or a statement from the instructor).
Distinguished, Instructor, or Coach status.
Concealed Carry License.
Firearms Owner Identification Cards that included live fire training.
FFL or C&R license.
Completion of a Hunter Safety Course that included live fire training.
Certification from range or club official or law enforcement officer witnessing shooting activity. A form for use in completing and certifying your range firing can be downloaded from the CMP web site at http://www.odcmp.com/forms/marksmanship.pdf
No proof of marksmanship required if over age 60. proof of club membership and citizenship required for all ages.
NOTE: Proof of marksmanship activity is not required for purchase of ammunition, parts, publications or memorabilia.

Be Legally Eligible to Purchase a Firearm
The information you supply on your application will be submitted by the CMP to the FBI National Instant Criminal Check System (NICS) to verify you are not prohibited by Federal, State or Local law from acquiring or possessing a rifle. Your signature on the Purchaser Certification portion of the purchase application authorizes the CMP to initiate the NICS check and authorizes the FBI to inform CMP of the result. IMPORTANT: If your State or locality requires you to first obtain a license, permit, or Firearms Owner ID card in order to possess or receive a rifle, you must enclose a photocopy of your license, permit, or card with the application for purchase.

TO GET CLUB INFO on Kentucky Rifle and Pistol Association
KSR&PA
P.O. 19543
Louisville, KY 40259-0543

riverrat66 · June 24, 2006, 11:28 AM

I did find a Garand Clinic and shot the qualifying match plus met all the eligibility requirements but I did not buy the firearm at that time. I was just wondering if you had to purchase the rifle within a certain time frame of completing all the requirements?
Unfortunately I did all this way back in June 1997 and have the paperwork sitting here in front of me. I just never finished filling it out or mailed it. BTW, the Garands were $310 then! Now I'm kicking myself in the backside. I'm guessing I'd have to start all over from scratch but it's worth a try.

riverrat66...out

auberg · June 24, 2006, 11:37 AM

Logs, thanks for the info. I never realized that you didn't have to actually participate in competition to buy from CMP. Other than the club membership, I could get one of the Garands now. May I ask, do you know which clubs in the Louisville area would be good to join.

Sorry for the hijack of the thread.

Frank

riverrat66 · June 24, 2006, 11:42 AM

Quote:

A listing of affiliated organizations can be found by clicking on our Club Search web page at http://clubs.odcmp.com/cgi-bin/clubSearch.cgi. If you have any difficulty in locating a club, please contact the CMP at 256-835-8455 or by emailing [email protected].

This was provided by Logs

Good luck.

riverrat66...out

riverrat66 · June 24, 2006, 12:00 PM

Quote:

No proof of marksmanship required if over age 60. proof of club membership and citizenship required for all ages.

Well, I really have nothing worry about. I'll be 60 in a couple of months so all I have to do is join an affiliated gun club, pay the fee and supply the same information I did back in 97' and I'm good to go.
I guess that was simple enough. Now my birthday can't come soon enough. I didn't think I'd be so anxious to be 60 years old!

That will complete my collection, an M-1 Garand, M1A (M14 look-a-like) and a preban Colt AR15 (M16 look-a-like). That's as close as I'll ever get to owning the real thing especially in New York State!

riverrat66...out

**Unclenick** · June 24, 2006, 07:28 PM

I believe participation records must be less than three years old to be in the new computer system at the CMP. That does not mean you can't provide records older than that, but I don't know if there is a time limit on clinic and match participation as evidence? I should. There is none on proof of past military service or the other listed items. I will find out and post it.

The CMP's interest is proof that you can handle weapons safely. This is part of the triad of things that exceed FFL type requirements. The other two to keep in mind are, unlike an FFL transfer, CMP will not let you get a rifle without proof of citizenship (passport preferred, but birth certificate or other govt. documents O.K.), nor without actually passing the "instant" NICS background check, not even if "instant" takes 6 months. They will not ship or let you pick a gun up after 3 days of "no answer" from the FBI, the way an FFL holder can. These three things are part of an intentional strategy of keeping the CMP's sales qualification standards above that of FFL holders. It is a prophylaxis against politically motivated opposition to the program.

When I attended the CMP GSM Master Instructor Clinic last month, they told us the known surplus rifle supply will last another five years at the current rate of sales. Others not in the pipeline may be discovered, if we are lucky, but the bird in hand is a five year supply. The quality of what remains isn't likely to keep improving as the selection dwindles, so you are well-advised not to delay if you intend to get one?

Nick

**Unclenick** · June 28, 2006, 07:24 PM

I checked with the CMP and there is no time limit on how long ago you took the clinic. It is just that they won't have a record of it in their new computer system if it is much older than three years. So you will need to provide proof of your participation in the clinic if it is longer ago than that.

Nick

hksigwalther · June 28, 2006, 08:41 PM

The surest method is to contact the CMP if they still have you on file.

A couple of Saturdays ago, I went up to the North Store to get a Kimber 82. A few days before that, I e-mail the CMP to see if I was still on file. The Garand I purchased through them was done in '02. If you still have your customer number or can give details of yourself when last you had contact with the CMP, they should be able to pull the info from Dynamics Research and enter it into their computer system. This is what happened to me and Ms. Lynn Williams, Customer Relations Manager/CMP South, got my info in their system. Since the last time I ordered was 4 years ago, my club membership had expired and I had to show proof of a current membership. (Plus, I moved since then and y e-mail address changed.) I e-mail a scanned copy of my current CMP affiliated club membership. I thought this would be placed in my file so I left the card home when I went to the North Store. They didn't have the copy on file (I think their system doesn't allow attachments of images) but they sold me the rifle anyways. (As soon as I got home, I e-mail Mr. Mike Conrad, Manager/North Store, my scanned membership card and they put a phycial copy in the file of my recent purchase.)

In short, call them up first to see if you are still on file. When you go to the store, bring all of the info that they are missing.

June 22, 2006, 10:22 PM	#1
cobra81 Senior Member Join Date: February 18, 2005 Location: Land of Lincoln Posts: 336	Where to get a Garand? I've pretty much decided to purchase a Garand. Is CMP the best outlet? I've been their website and checked out the different grades....seems they are out of quite a few. Are there any other good sources for Garands? Are most of the rifles available ones that were loaned to Greece or other countries, and are those rifles ones to avoid? Thanks in advance.

June 23, 2006, 09:11 AM	#3
Tim R Senior Member Join Date: November 30, 2004 Location: God's side of Washington State Posts: 1,601	100% agree, CMP IS the best deal going. They will take sticky notes on the paper work as well. If you are interested in shooting John C. Garand matches with your M-1, let them know. Works once. __________________ God Bless our Troops especially our Snipers.

June 23, 2006, 08:10 PM	#6
cas Senior Member Join Date: July 22, 2004 Posts: 123	You can buy a Garand from the CMP for $400 or $500. Or you can buy one from a gun store for $600-$800 and get the same quality/condition rifle. __________________ "He who has it, would do well to have it, as if he did not have it." Savage24.com Cylindersmith.com

June 23, 2006, 08:30 PM	#7
riverrat66 Senior Member Join Date: December 23, 2004 Location: Western New York Posts: 394	If you go to the north store and hand pick a rifle do you still need to go through all the CMP requirements? I did all the required paperwork, went through the affiliated gun club, etc. about 10 years ago but never purchased the rifle. I'm wondering if I'd have to do that all over again or if I can just go there and buy a rifle. Anyone have any thoughts about that? riverrat66...out __________________ Life Member Vietnam Veterans of America Life Member DAV Life Member NRA Life Member Harley Owners Group

June 24, 2006, 07:40 AM	#8
Logs Senior Member Join Date: November 26, 1999 Location: BLUEGRASS STATE KY USA Posts: 1,780	Yes, if you go to the North Store, requirements are the same. You can join a club there if that is all you are missing. They also changed the rules not to long ago and will allow you to buy 12 Garands a year. Not sure what you would do with 12? But hey if you had the $$$$ pretty good investment. I recommend trying to find a Garand Clinic in your area and shoot the match. I did my match qualifing at Fort Knox and had a BLAST .... Met a bunch of nice guys who love to shoot. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From the CMP...... ELIGIBILITY REQUIREMENTS By law, the CMP can sell surplus military firearms, ammunition, parts and other items only to members of CMP affiliated clubs who are also U.S. citizens, over 18 years of age and who are legally eligible to purchase a firearm. U.S. Citizenship: You must provide a copy of a U.S. birth certificate, passport, proof of naturalization, or any official government document that shows birth in the U.S. or states citizenship as U.S. Age You must provide proof of age. Usually proof of citizenship also provides proof of age. In those cases where it may not, a driver’s license is sufficient. Membership in CMP Affiliated Organization You must provide a copy of your current membership card or other proof of membership. This requirement cannot be waived. The CMP currently has over 2,000 affiliated organizations located in many parts of the country. Membership in many of these organizations costs $25.00 or less and can be accomplished online. A listing of affiliated organizations can be found by clicking on our Club Search web page at http://clubs.odcmp.com/cgi-bin/clubSearch.cgi. If you have any difficulty in locating a club, please contact the CMP at 256-835-8455 or by emailing [email protected]. We will find one for you. In addition to shooting clubs, the CMP also has several special affiliates. Membership in these organizations satisfies our requirement for purchase. These special affiliates include: Congressionally chartered veterans' organizations such as the VFW, AL, DAV, MCL, etc. U.S. Military services (active or reserves), National Guard, to include retirees. Professional 501(c)3 law enforcement organizations and associations such as the FOP, NAPO, NSA, etc. Note: Club membership IS required for purchase of rifles, parts, and ammunition. Club membership is NOT required for instructional publications or videos or CMP memorabilia. Marksmanship or other Firearms Related Activity You must provide proof of participation in a marksmanship related activity or otherwise show familiarity with the safe handling of firearms and range procedures. Your marksmanship related activity does not have to be with highpower rifles; it can be with smallbore rifles, pistols, air guns or shotguns. Proof of marksmanship participation can be provided by documenting any of the following: Current or past military service. Current or past law enforcement service Participation in a rifle, pistol, air gun or shotgun competition (provide copy of results bulletin). Completion of a marksmanship clinic that included live fire training (provide a copy of the certificate of completion or a statement from the instructor). Distinguished, Instructor, or Coach status. Concealed Carry License. Firearms Owner Identification Cards that included live fire training. FFL or C&R license. Completion of a Hunter Safety Course that included live fire training. Certification from range or club official or law enforcement officer witnessing shooting activity. A form for use in completing and certifying your range firing can be downloaded from the CMP web site at http://www.odcmp.com/forms/marksmanship.pdf No proof of marksmanship required if over age 60. proof of club membership and citizenship required for all ages. NOTE: Proof of marksmanship activity is not required for purchase of ammunition, parts, publications or memorabilia. Be Legally Eligible to Purchase a Firearm The information you supply on your application will be submitted by the CMP to the FBI National Instant Criminal Check System (NICS) to verify you are not prohibited by Federal, State or Local law from acquiring or possessing a rifle. Your signature on the Purchaser Certification portion of the purchase application authorizes the CMP to initiate the NICS check and authorizes the FBI to inform CMP of the result. IMPORTANT: If your State or locality requires you to first obtain a license, permit, or Firearms Owner ID card in order to possess or receive a rifle, you must enclose a photocopy of your license, permit, or card with the application for purchase. TO GET CLUB INFO on Kentucky Rifle and Pistol Association KSR&PA P.O. 19543 Louisville, KY 40259-0543 Last edited by Logs; June 25, 2006 at 06:01 PM.

June 23, 2006, 12:05 AM	#2
maggys drawers Senior Member Join Date: March 4, 2006 Posts: 178	I got a Greek H&R service grade from CMP about a year ago. Had a MW of 1 and a TE of 2, nice wood with cartouches and a good park job...think it was around $425. I see rifles like that at gun shows going for 1200-1300 bucks. I took a muzzle wear gauge with me to a gun show once...the Garands going for 600-700 bucks swallowed the gauge...probably worn out rack grades or worse going for a helluva lot of money. I'd say CMP is your best bet, unless you could find the proverbial estate sale gun or a private sale. It seems to me like it's caveat emptor for every place but CMP...at least you know what your getting there, and may get a nice surprise like I did...and if it's broke, CMP will make it right.

June 23, 2006, 12:14 PM	#4
nbkky71 Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2005 Location: Davidson, NC Posts: 417	If you have the chance, take a drive to either the north store (Port Clinton, OH) or the south store (Anniston, AL). You get to browse the racks and hand-pick the rifle that you want. You never know what kind of a diamond you'll find in the rough. I was in Anniston two weeks ago and managed to find a 5-digit rack grade with lockbar sights and a VAR barrel. Another person recently found a rack grade Winchester M1 with a correct winchester barrel. Even if you attach a note to your mail-in order form (as Tim R mentioned), the CMP may not be able to fulfill your request. They really do try to accomodate requests though. Bottom line is that mail order M1's are luck-of-the-draw. If you don't mind a refinishing project, buy a rack grade or a less-wood rifle. I think it adds a little more character to your rifle with all the refinishing effort. Here's a couple pics of my refinished rack grade:

June 23, 2006, 01:35 PM	#5
Logs Senior Member Join Date: November 26, 1999 Location: BLUEGRASS STATE KY USA Posts: 1,780	CMP is the way to go. I live in KY and drove to Camp Perry and picked out several nice M-1's and a few cases of the Greek ammo. I ended up with some great guns with low ME numbers. The north store is open on Saturdays, ROAD TRIP. www.odcmp.com

June 24, 2006, 11:28 AM	#9
riverrat66 Senior Member Join Date: December 23, 2004 Location: Western New York Posts: 394	I did find a Garand Clinic and shot the qualifying match plus met all the eligibility requirements but I did not buy the firearm at that time. I was just wondering if you had to purchase the rifle within a certain time frame of completing all the requirements? Unfortunately I did all this way back in June 1997 and have the paperwork sitting here in front of me. I just never finished filling it out or mailed it. BTW, the Garands were $310 then! Now I'm kicking myself in the backside. I'm guessing I'd have to start all over from scratch but it's worth a try. riverrat66...out __________________ Life Member Vietnam Veterans of America Life Member DAV Life Member NRA Life Member Harley Owners Group

June 24, 2006, 11:37 AM	#10
auberg Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2005 Location: Louisville, Kentucky Posts: 243	Logs, thanks for the info. I never realized that you didn't have to actually participate in competition to buy from CMP. Other than the club membership, I could get one of the Garands now. May I ask, do you know which clubs in the Louisville area would be good to join. Sorry for the hijack of the thread. Frank __________________ "I don't have to like it, I just have to do it."

June 24, 2006, 07:28 PM	#13
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,063	I believe participation records must be less than three years old to be in the new computer system at the CMP. That does not mean you can't provide records older than that, but I don't know if there is a time limit on clinic and match participation as evidence? I should. There is none on proof of past military service or the other listed items. I will find out and post it. The CMP's interest is proof that you can handle weapons safely. This is part of the triad of things that exceed FFL type requirements. The other two to keep in mind are, unlike an FFL transfer, CMP will not let you get a rifle without proof of citizenship (passport preferred, but birth certificate or other govt. documents O.K.), nor without actually passing the "instant" NICS background check, not even if "instant" takes 6 months. They will not ship or let you pick a gun up after 3 days of "no answer" from the FBI, the way an FFL holder can. These three things are part of an intentional strategy of keeping the CMP's sales qualification standards above that of FFL holders. It is a prophylaxis against politically motivated opposition to the program. When I attended the CMP GSM Master Instructor Clinic last month, they told us the known surplus rifle supply will last another five years at the current rate of sales. Others not in the pipeline may be discovered, if we are lucky, but the bird in hand is a five year supply. The quality of what remains isn't likely to keep improving as the selection dwindles, so you are well-advised not to delay if you intend to get one? Nick __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

June 28, 2006, 07:24 PM	#14
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,063	No Time Limit I checked with the CMP and there is no time limit on how long ago you took the clinic. It is just that they won't have a record of it in their new computer system if it is much older than three years. So you will need to provide proof of your participation in the clinic if it is longer ago than that. Nick __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

June 28, 2006, 08:41 PM	#15
hksigwalther Senior Member Join Date: November 18, 1998 Location: NE OH, USA Posts: 3,198	The surest method is to contact the CMP if they still have you on file. A couple of Saturdays ago, I went up to the North Store to get a Kimber 82. A few days before that, I e-mail the CMP to see if I was still on file. The Garand I purchased through them was done in '02. If you still have your customer number or can give details of yourself when last you had contact with the CMP, they should be able to pull the info from Dynamics Research and enter it into their computer system. This is what happened to me and Ms. Lynn Williams, Customer Relations Manager/CMP South, got my info in their system. Since the last time I ordered was 4 years ago, my club membership had expired and I had to show proof of a current membership. (Plus, I moved since then and y e-mail address changed.) I e-mail a scanned copy of my current CMP affiliated club membership. I thought this would be placed in my file so I left the card home when I went to the North Store. They didn't have the copy on file (I think their system doesn't allow attachments of images) but they sold me the rifle anyways. (As soon as I got home, I e-mail Mr. Mike Conrad, Manager/North Store, my scanned membership card and they put a phycial copy in the file of my recent purchase.) In short, call them up first to see if you are still on file. When you go to the store, bring all of the info that they are missing. __________________ - Ron V.