Factory .380 102 gr. GS C.O.L.

Slip Shooter · September 5, 2009, 04:26 PM

Is there anyone out there that can measure, for me, the Cartridge Overall Length of the .380 Remington 102 grain Golden Saber factory cartridge.

I have received 1000 GS bullets for reloading from Midway today.

A Remington ballistic chart I found claims 940 fps in a 4 inch barrel with this cartridge. I want to duplicate that velocity using Power Pistol in my 4 inch Taurus 58HC Plus.

I would also appreciate anyone else’s reloading experience with this bullet.

I have already found ot that my 3 .380's will hand cycle these bullets from a cartridge O.A.L of .950 to .980. I may settle on .970 in lieu of a factory cartridge length reading. First experience with this bullet.

Thanks up front,

Slip

zxcvbob · September 5, 2009, 04:41 PM

I bought 100 of 'em from Pat's Reloading a few months ago. Haven't used them yet because I didn't have any brass (I just remedied that.) Don't the bullets have a cannelure? Load to that length.

With a 4" barrel, you can easily exceed 1000 fps with Power Pistol, Unique, or Herco, and Bullseye is pretty close. The PP is going to have a lot more unburned powder than the others, so unless you have the PP already, I'd go with Unique or Bullseye.

My P3at only has a 2.6" barrel, so Unique is about my only option to give satisfactory performance.

Slip Shooter · September 5, 2009, 05:41 PM

Zcvbob,

These bullets don’t have a cannelure per say. From the base forward, about .200 inch, they measure .356 dia. From there forward to the ogive they measure about 3.48 dia. This seems to allow a short bearing surface at the rear leaving the front to ride atop the lands generating less pressure.

I have all the powders you mentioned. This is my first shot at reloading the .380 cartridge. I am sure I will experience a learning curve.

Using Unique, in other handgun calibers, I have always had the experience of high extreme spreads of velocity and would like to prevent that if possible in this small compact cartridge. I realize using faster powders such as Bullseye will eliminate or greatly reduce the E/S problem. Fast powders seem to give up velocity within safe parameters. I desire to stay within the maximum pressure range generated for the .380.

The 102 gr. GS is heavy for the caliber, hence the slower powder.

zxcvbob · September 5, 2009, 07:02 PM

I don't know where I put my little bag of bullets to verify the length

QuickLoad says it's .472" (12mm) long.

If that's correct and if you load to .970", 4.6 grains of Power Pistol should be a good load, but a compressed charge of Herco, 4.2 grains, is better (a little higher velocity, lower pressure, more complete burn.)

I haven't tried any of this yet. I've been mostly shooting factory ammo so far, and some reloads using 95 grain cast hard lead and 4.2 grains of Unique for a hot load, or 3.0 grains of International Clays for something milder. The KelTec only weighs 8 ounces and it's kind of unpleasant to practice.

bignz · September 5, 2009, 07:14 PM

I keep track of all factory OALs and all problems firing/ejecting in a spreadsheet. I feel it helps me when I reload to know the OALs that operate best in my gun and those that don't. I don't have the GS but I have some others in 380 I've measured which I will list here for reference:

Federal HS 90g JHP .942
Blazer - cheap aluminum- 95g FMJ RN .964
MagTech 95g FMJ RN .975
Federal PD 90g JHP .926
Sellier & Bellot 93f FMJ RN .971

Might want to move this post over to reloading. You will probably get more answers.

Slip Shooter · September 5, 2009, 07:38 PM

Moderator please move this thread to HANDLOADING and RELOADING.

Thanks,

Slip

RidgwayCO · September 5, 2009, 08:33 PM

I tested some of these bullets last summer. These are the numbers I got:

Remington 102gr Golden Saber Hollow Point bullets, Starline .380 Auto brass measuring 0.675", COL at 0.965", CCI 500 primers, light crimp with LFC die (just enough to remove the flare), Shooting Chrony at 10 feet, target at 25 yards, Bersa 95 (3.5" barrel) rested on sand bags.

Powder....... Amount.........fps.......es.......sd

AA #2...........3.4gr..........960.......31.......10

VV N320........3.4gr..........947.......56.......18

VV N330........3.9gr..........944.......71.......23

VV N340........4.1gr..........952.......53.......16

Unique..........3.9gr..........955.......47.......17

All were sufficiently accurate at 25 yards, and shot clean.

Streetking · October 19, 2009, 01:53 AM

how about 9mm die to reload 380?

Craig M. Arnold · October 20, 2009, 01:20 PM

I measured a box of factory Remington Golden Sabers in the past. They were all right around 0.950 OAL. So that is what I have been loading the GSs at. I use Bullseye powder and all of my reloads work fine in my KelTec P3ATs, SIG P238 and a Makarov with a 380 Barrel.

Streetking - No, you need 380acp dies. 9mm is tapered, 380acp is straight walled.

Best regards.

September 5, 2009, 04:26 PM	#1
Slip Shooter Member Join Date: February 4, 2005 Location: NW Louisiana Posts: 85	Factory .380 102 gr. GS C.O.L. Is there anyone out there that can measure, for me, the Cartridge Overall Length of the .380 Remington 102 grain Golden Saber factory cartridge. I have received 1000 GS bullets for reloading from Midway today. A Remington ballistic chart I found claims 940 fps in a 4 inch barrel with this cartridge. I want to duplicate that velocity using Power Pistol in my 4 inch Taurus 58HC Plus. I would also appreciate anyone else’s reloading experience with this bullet. I have already found ot that my 3 .380's will hand cycle these bullets from a cartridge O.A.L of .950 to .980. I may settle on .970 in lieu of a factory cartridge length reading. First experience with this bullet. Thanks up front, Slip __________________ My wooden nickel's worth. Laissez les bon temps rouler. NRA Benefactor Member. Last edited by Slip Shooter; September 5, 2009 at 04:37 PM.

September 5, 2009, 05:41 PM	#3
Slip Shooter Member Join Date: February 4, 2005 Location: NW Louisiana Posts: 85	Zcvbob, These bullets don’t have a cannelure per say. From the base forward, about .200 inch, they measure .356 dia. From there forward to the ogive they measure about 3.48 dia. This seems to allow a short bearing surface at the rear leaving the front to ride atop the lands generating less pressure. I have all the powders you mentioned. This is my first shot at reloading the .380 cartridge. I am sure I will experience a learning curve. Using Unique, in other handgun calibers, I have always had the experience of high extreme spreads of velocity and would like to prevent that if possible in this small compact cartridge. I realize using faster powders such as Bullseye will eliminate or greatly reduce the E/S problem. Fast powders seem to give up velocity within safe parameters. I desire to stay within the maximum pressure range generated for the .380. The 102 gr. GS is heavy for the caliber, hence the slower powder. __________________ My wooden nickel's worth. Laissez les bon temps rouler. NRA Benefactor Member. Last edited by Slip Shooter; September 5, 2009 at 05:46 PM.

September 5, 2009, 07:02 PM	#4
zxcvbob Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2007 Location: S.E. Minnesota Posts: 4,720	I don't know where I put my little bag of bullets to verify the length QuickLoad says it's .472" (12mm) long. If that's correct and if you load to .970", 4.6 grains of Power Pistol should be a good load, but a compressed charge of Herco, 4.2 grains, is better (a little higher velocity, lower pressure, more complete burn.) I haven't tried any of this yet. I've been mostly shooting factory ammo so far, and some reloads using 95 grain cast hard lead and 4.2 grains of Unique for a hot load, or 3.0 grains of International Clays for something milder. The KelTec only weighs 8 ounces and it's kind of unpleasant to practice. __________________ "Everything they do is so dramatic and flamboyant. It just makes me want to set myself on fire!" —Lucille Bluth

September 5, 2009, 07:38 PM	#6
Slip Shooter Member Join Date: February 4, 2005 Location: NW Louisiana Posts: 85	Moderator please move this thread to HANDLOADING and RELOADING. Thanks, Slip __________________ My wooden nickel's worth. Laissez les bon temps rouler. NRA Benefactor Member.

September 5, 2009, 08:33 PM	#7
RidgwayCO Senior Member Join Date: March 22, 2008 Location: Western Colorado Posts: 244	I tested some of these bullets last summer. These are the numbers I got: Remington 102gr Golden Saber Hollow Point bullets, Starline .380 Auto brass measuring 0.675", COL at 0.965", CCI 500 primers, light crimp with LFC die (just enough to remove the flare), Shooting Chrony at 10 feet, target at 25 yards, Bersa 95 (3.5" barrel) rested on sand bags. Powder....... Amount.........fps.......es.......sd AA #2...........3.4gr..........960.......31.......10 VV N320........3.4gr..........947.......56.......18 VV N330........3.9gr..........944.......71.......23 VV N340........4.1gr..........952.......53.......16 Unique..........3.9gr..........955.......47.......17 All were sufficiently accurate at 25 yards, and shot clean. __________________ "A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed." Nope, not a single word about hunting...

September 5, 2009, 04:41 PM	#2
zxcvbob Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2007 Location: S.E. Minnesota Posts: 4,720	I bought 100 of 'em from Pat's Reloading a few months ago. Haven't used them yet because I didn't have any brass (I just remedied that.) Don't the bullets have a cannelure? Load to that length. With a 4" barrel, you can easily exceed 1000 fps with Power Pistol, Unique, or Herco, and Bullseye is pretty close. The PP is going to have a lot more unburned powder than the others, so unless you have the PP already, I'd go with Unique or Bullseye. My P3at only has a 2.6" barrel, so Unique is about my only option to give satisfactory performance. __________________ "Everything they do is so dramatic and flamboyant. It just makes me want to set myself on fire!" —Lucille Bluth

September 5, 2009, 07:14 PM	#5
bignz Senior Member Join Date: February 17, 2009 Location: North Texas Posts: 196	I keep track of all factory OALs and all problems firing/ejecting in a spreadsheet. I feel it helps me when I reload to know the OALs that operate best in my gun and those that don't. I don't have the GS but I have some others in 380 I've measured which I will list here for reference: Federal HS 90g JHP .942 Blazer - cheap aluminum- 95g FMJ RN .964 MagTech 95g FMJ RN .975 Federal PD 90g JHP .926 Sellier & Bellot 93f FMJ RN .971 Might want to move this post over to reloading. You will probably get more answers.

October 19, 2009, 01:53 AM	#8
Streetking Junior Member Join Date: January 2, 2009 Location: Missouri Posts: 12	how about 9mm die to reload 380? __________________ Don't tread me

October 20, 2009, 01:20 PM	#9
Craig M. Arnold Member Join Date: December 4, 2002 Location: Southern Arizona Posts: 86	102gr. Remington Golden Saber I measured a box of factory Remington Golden Sabers in the past. They were all right around 0.950 OAL. So that is what I have been loading the GSs at. I use Bullseye powder and all of my reloads work fine in my KelTec P3ATs, SIG P238 and a Makarov with a 380 Barrel. Streetking - No, you need 380acp dies. 9mm is tapered, 380acp is straight walled. Best regards. __________________ I REJECT OBAMA AND HIS SOCIALIST AGENDA - KEEP THE CHANGE - HURRY UP 2012