Thoughts on a short barrel .32 ML

[Mac118]

I'm contemplating building a small frame .32 caliber muzzleloader on an underhammer action. I'd like to keep the barrel at 18-20 inches. I've read a number of conflicting opinions about ML barrel length to inspire me to ask; does anyone have experience (good or bad) with short barrel .32?

[Pahoo]

I feel that an important point when shooting M/L's with the various propellents, is to burn as much of that propellant, inside the barrel. Depending on your shot string, you could just be wasting propellant on shorter barrels. I think to a certain degree, you will always blow out some unburned propellant. We have run tests and placed a tarp in front of the M/L and sure enough we could ignite what we blew out. I'm not saying that you can't or should not, as there is no hard reason why you should not. ....

I have also noticed that many shorter barrels, excluding C&B's, have a faster twist. An example, I have a single shot Hawkeye, by Knight, that has the MK-85 action and a 12", .50 barrel. Basically a short rifle and it has a faster twist. I'm sure it's to provide better performance for conicals or sabots, on shorter barrels but it will also allow for more efficient burning of the propellant.

Another example, are the XR-Rated M/L's that claim Extended Range for a given shot string. What is the difference? Longer barrels. ......

You have posted and excellent and am looking forward to the replies. ....

Be Safe !!!

[arcticap]

I think that there would be some disadvantage to having such a compact barrel, although maybe for most practical purposes it wouldn't be all that much.
There would be some loss of velocity and possibly accuracy at longer distances too, even if only by virtue of the shorter sighting plane.
One trade off is that you'll have a handier and more compact rifle.
A quality barrel may be able to compensate for some of the accuracy difference, but I'm not so sure about making up for the shorter sighting plane.
Maybe a good peep and front sight set could help in that area.

If one looks at some conventional factory rifles, somewhat longer .32 barrels are the norm.
Traditions .32 Deerhunter - 24" barrel
Traditions .32 Crockett - 32" barrel
TC .32 Seneca - 26" barrel [?]

Most semi-custom and custom .32 squirrel rifles often have barrels that are 32" - 36" long or more.
Does that necessarily mean that having an 18"-20" .32 barrel is a disadvantage verses having a longer barrel?
Well I guess that all depends on the actual performance of the gun once it's built. But it's hard to deny that there will be some trade offs as a result.
It's mostly about how the rifle is expected to perform for the intended purpose which we don't have any idea about. For instance, how large is the expected target?
But in absolute terms some performance differences would be expected. Some of those differences may be able to be overcome, but I don't know about all of them, especially its performance at the fringe distances for even the longer barreled .32's.
For instance the shorter barrel may have lost its useful accuracy at 60 yards while the longer barrel may still have useful accuracy at 80 yards.
Who can predict how accurate your 18" - 20" barrel will be?

[Mac118]

This is all good information and I've done some experimenting myself with conical vs balls, and various rates of twist on larger caliber muzzleloaders, but I was hoping someone had first hand experience with the small bore and a cut down barrel. The short barrel wouldn't be expected to perform at long range, just camp-side target shooting.

[arcticap]

Shooting comparatively smaller targets at short distances is just as much as fun as shooting at the longer ranges.
That's why the NMLRA has 25 yard rifle target competitions.

[kwhi43]

Well, I just couldn't wait any longer. Our 10 inch barrel does 1200 fps with
only 18 grs. Goex black powder. I would think if you used say a 14-18 inch
barrel and upped it to say 20 grains you would get probably get over 1400 fps
You could get even more. Accuracy with the right load would be putting all
shots in the same hole at 50 yds. I think your project would work out OK.
Just to show you and not be bragging, Here is what the wife shot at 50 yds
with five shots. The 10 ring is about 3 inches in dia. When shooting over a
rest, or using a scope the group probably would shoot out the "X". This was
shot with one hand un-supported. Yes, those who know her, she shoots like
this all the time. Right Mykeal?

[bedbugbilly]

I think everyone has raised some excellent points and have greatly enjoyed this posting.

My only experience was with a CVA "Squirrel" rifle - .32 caliber - I believe it had a 24" inch barrel but I sold it a few yars aqo so perhaps someone can correct me on that if I'm wrong. It was a nice shooting little rifle. Up until the time I bought it used, I had always shot .36 or .40 caliber rifles that I custom built and they had 36 or 42 inch barrels. I loved the little .32 though and it was a sweet shooting rifle.

Without getting in to twists, etc. - I think it all depends on what you want to do with the rifle. If your intent is to shoot shorter ranges - 25 & 50 yards - I think you'd have a lot of fun with it. Shooting at longer ranges are going to make you "learn" your rifle and adjust for drop and windage.

With my eyesight problems, I went to an underhammer .36 and love it. I used to shoot with a guy who had a .32 underhammer with about a 30 inch barrel and he could "clean our clocks" most of the time at 25 and 50 yard targets - this was competing against all kinds of stock and custom built rifles.

I think your idea is a great one and I'd encourage you to try it. If you are using an underhammer action, you can always make an interchangeable barrel in a greater length and / or caliber. You could have the .32 barrel and if you wanted to try longer ranges, have a longer barrel either in 32, 36 or 40 caliber. Your ramrod pipes, etc. will be on the barrel along with the ramrod so it presents no problem when interchanging barrels. The combinations you could have of caliber / barrel lenght are limited only by your pocketbook.

Thanks for the great post and I hope you'll keep us posted on what you do!

[Mac118]

Thanks Bedgugbilly. I have seen squirrel rifles with a 24" barrel. That seems to be about the shortest made, which is part of my curiosity.

I like the removable barrel idea, in fact I built such a beast a few years back on a frame by Wade Ingrham of Texas. Currently outfitted with a 36", .40 cal barrel with a 1:48" twist. Does very nice at a 100 yards, still working loads for 200. I sent a write up about it to underhammers.blogspot.com.

But I don't want to get off topic. The current plan for the small .32 is to have a removable butt stock so it can be packed up in a box about the size of a clarinet case. I just don't want to cut down a good barrel before I do a little homework first.

[Mac118]

I was hoping there would be more practical feedback on this subject, but maybe it's just a little too specific to have many folks with hands on experience. For now I guess I'll plan on a 24" barrel as a starting point. Will try to find one already sized to 24' as I don't want to cut back either of two I already have.

[Busyhands94]

i like .32 muzzleloaders! that was actually the first muzzleloader i ever shot, a Traditions Deerhunter percussion .32 rifle. i think i need to build a nice .32 muzzleloader, i figure i could take it squirrel hunting!