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March 12, 2017, 10:18 AM | #1 |
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Are all Mossberg 500s "clunky"?
I have 2 new production Mossbergs 500s that have a "clunky" slide action, and I have a 1974 Remington 870 I just bought that is as slick as greased glass compared to the 2 Mossbergs. The 870 hasn't been fired very much, so it isn't simply "worn in", it just feels so much nicer working the action.
All three guns are lubed per manufacturer's suggestions. It just seems strange to me that there'd be such a huge difference in the way they feel. If I'd bought the 870 first, I'd never have bought the second Mossberg. One Mossberg was a $300 Stalker, the other was Mossberg's "Thunder Ranch". Did I buy a pair of lemons, or are Mossbergs always this clunky? |
March 12, 2017, 10:24 AM | #2 |
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they are all cheaply made guns.
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March 12, 2017, 10:57 AM | #3 |
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So you are comparing the actions of two new production guns to a gun that has been broken in over 40 years ago and wonder why there seems to be a difference?
My 25 year old Mossy is definitely smoother than my 5 year old which has seen a lot less use. |
March 12, 2017, 10:58 AM | #4 |
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Mossbergs are made to a price point, a low price point.
But they work and work and work. Think Energizer Bunny. And they pump fast, too. The only failure I've ever experienced with them is the plastic safety switch. Which is why metal ones are available. But if you find them objectionable, there's no short supply of alternatives. I like mine, clunky or not.
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March 12, 2017, 11:31 AM | #5 |
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Comparing both my NIB 870 Police to my NIB 590A1, the 870 was smoother and just nicer to rack. Also the 870 fits me very nicely unlike the 590A1. I do prefer that the shell elevator stay up during reloads on the 590A1 and slightly prefer its tang safety ovrer the Remy cross bolt.
Take your Mossberg and SHUCK SHUCK SHUCK and SHOOT SHOOT SHOOT till the cows come home. It'll smooth out nicely with time. |
March 12, 2017, 12:09 PM | #6 |
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Not exactly SHR970. The 870 is 40 years old, but the fella I bought it from said it had sat in his safe for over 30 years, and had about 35 shells through it since he bought it new.
The 870 looks new except for a few pinpoints of rust on the receiver, and a little wear on the barrel lugs & magazine tube. So I'm taking the man on his word that that 870 is lightly used. |
March 12, 2017, 12:17 PM | #7 |
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MSRP on an 870 Express is $417. A 500 All Purpose Field's is $419.
The part that's kind of clunky on a 500 is the stock. Isn't as, shall we say, refined, as an 870's. Mind you, a 43 year old 870 is going to be more worn than a new 500. If you want to get fast with any pump gun, you have to dry fire practice with it.
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March 12, 2017, 11:50 PM | #8 |
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Do you mean clunky like rough or clunky like loose/sloppy? If it's the latter, I've read that they are somewhat loose by design to be able to operate even if crud or debris gets introduced to the mechanism. Tighter tolerances would be more likely to bind up. I don't know from experience. I have the poor man's 500 which is definitely a little loose in the forend, but it doesn't bother me and it doesn't bother the gun.
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March 13, 2017, 01:02 AM | #9 |
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1974
A 1974 Rem 870 would be a true Wingmaster, the Express guns didn't come on the scene till late 1980's. The Wingmasters are known for steel on steel parts, quality of materials and assembly. Those steel on steel parts will work harden and the action will slick up well over time. A new Wingmaster today will run you in excess of $600 bucks, maybe more. While an early 870 is not the forged and milled dream pump of my Grandad's generation (Win Model 12) it is not what I would call a cheap gun.
The Mossberg 500 has always been thought of as a price point alternative to an 870. Back in the day, if you could/would not go the asking price of an 870, but wanted a reliable pump, the Mossberg was the alternative. The MOss 500 was a step above the single action bar Savage/Springfield line, which was about the lower end of pump prices. I suspect it's more of the same today. Were I in the market for a pump, I would not go the big money for a new 870........I don't see how Remington keeps selling them. With all the used 870's out there, that is the route I would go, used. The Moss 500 has an aluminum receiver, which makes the guns a tad lighter comparitively. Whether or not an alum receiver will work harden and slick up like an all steel model....I don't know. To me, MOssbergs have always had a sort of bang slam action , where as a Wingmaster, and the old Model 12's seems slicker. |
March 13, 2017, 12:33 PM | #10 |
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murphies law of combat #22 = your gun was built by the lowest bidder.
seals went with moss 500's. traded in the 870's in the 90's. heavy use using buck shot RF, in hot conditions caused the 500's to seize up until cooled. hulls would jam up in the action. when I left the teams, they were considering going back to the 870.
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March 14, 2017, 11:02 AM | #11 |
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As I have recently bought a Mossberg 500 and never had a 870, I can't compare the two. Since the Mossberg was much cheaper and has proven to be reliable over many decades, I don't give a hoot about "clunky". The Harley transmission is very "clunky" compared to the competition but they still dominate the large motorcycle market even at a premium price.
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March 14, 2017, 03:48 PM | #12 |
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They are clunky but they are affordable, work well and last a long time.
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March 14, 2017, 04:13 PM | #13 |
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If you really want slick or smooth operating shotgun action, try a
Winchester Model 12 or a Ithaca Model 37, now those two guns are smooth! |
March 14, 2017, 05:59 PM | #14 | |
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Quote:
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March 14, 2017, 07:21 PM | #15 |
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Sometimes a little sloppy is better than to tight. 50 years of dependability confirms it. Mossberg would have changed things if it wasn't working.
Last edited by Blindstitch; March 14, 2017 at 07:37 PM. |
March 15, 2017, 06:22 AM | #16 |
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My Thunder Ranch feels less refined "clunkier" than my 870 but it also feels like it could handle rougher treatment than the 870, kind of like an AK vs. an AR I guess. I like them both but a few things that I really like about the 500 is the safety location and as already mentioned, not having the shell lifter interfering with loading is very nice. As for take down, give me the 870 any day over the Mossberg.
If I had to choose one or the other? Well, I am glad I don't have to.... Last edited by Targa; March 15, 2017 at 06:32 AM. |
March 15, 2017, 06:50 AM | #17 |
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37
Was gonna post about the Ithaca 37 but it has already been done. So +1 to that idea.
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March 15, 2017, 09:14 AM | #18 |
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You're comparing a $300 shotgun made now to a shotgun that was made 40+ years ago. Back then you still got hand fitting and tuning. You can still get it in a Wingmaster, but it will cost you $700. Not exactly an apples to apples comparison.
A Mossberg can be made a LOT smoother with a good cleaning, some light stone work to knock the burrs off and a lube. |
March 15, 2017, 09:40 AM | #19 | |
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Quote:
I've used my 500 on very hot summer days, for long stages mostly steel challenge matches that got the thing just about too hot to hold. And without any failures that wasn't caused by me. Truth be told, very few rounds were slugs, most were medium velocity bird shot. But there were a lot of them fired as fast as possible. For any normal use, and even far beyond, no complaint for 500s from here. I've learned to trust mine completely. Mine is an old, used truck gun acquired from an acquaintance. You know, the kind that looks like it fell off the truck.
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March 15, 2017, 11:08 AM | #20 |
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I've always liked the old Remington 870's with machined steel parts, compared to todays slapped together econo shotguns.
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March 15, 2017, 12:56 PM | #21 |
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The 870's have a lot of stamped parts, BUT Remington has better quality control and parts are kept closer to design spec's. , so parts fit better and tha actions operate smoother.
Also aluminum is not the best bearing material in the world! |
March 16, 2017, 02:48 PM | #22 |
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Too much navel-gazing.
The 870 has a stamped receiver, as well as a bunch of other parts. Now that I think about the Mossberg probably has less stamped parts. I own both, and either works. I won a ton of side matches with a borrowed 870, but I'd have probably won if I'd have remembered to bring my 500 to the match. Seen on another discussion: "What that shotgun needs are some wear marks". |
March 16, 2017, 04:37 PM | #23 |
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I sure would like to know how Remington put all those machining marks inside of my TB trap 870?
And yes the trigger group is a high quality die casting, finished very nicely. A Mossberg 500 aluminum receiver is of some unknown alloy with a trigger group made of plastic! The safety is on top of the receiver, if it falls off the gun will not fire, some have lost game due to that ergo correct safety. Yes the 500's work, but the Remington's and other gun makes and models work so much better. If you are shooting trap it is still one shot at a time, so your pump gun is used as a single! |
March 16, 2017, 05:03 PM | #24 |
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And how many times have you had a 500 safety screw fall out? My dad has one almost 40 years old and the safety never fell off. I have one 20 years old and the safety never fell off. And I have one 4 years old and the safety never fell off.
I replaced the 20 year olds safety with an aluminum claw style safety for shooting with gloves on. The screw was still a trick to remove. Sure enough I loctited it back in but unless you're prying on and break your safety off it's a fluke for the screw to back out. |
March 16, 2017, 05:36 PM | #25 |
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I really can not say, just reports from others, I shoot better guns.
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