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Old March 24, 2014, 04:36 PM   #1
shane32
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new reloader, trouble sizing brass

Hello. Im am having trouble sizing my brass. Im loading for 22-250 and 300 win mag. Im using a hornady lock n load ap press with hornady dies. My reloading process is this.. 1) clean and inspect all brass 2)trim chamfer inside and out 3) lube, f l size and de prime. 4) prime 5) powder drop 6) seat bullet. The problem im having is when I try to chamber a round the bolt either wont close or is very tight. Iv also tried this with just brass thats only been f l sized and trimed to spec. Still having the same problem. iv set up my fl sizer die touching the shell plate and 1/4 more turn like the die specified. Same gun the brass was originally shot in. Any help is much appreciated.
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Old March 24, 2014, 04:44 PM   #2
nemesiss45
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You should trim after sizing. If that doesnt help, maybe go a little deeper on the sizing. You are using once fired brass?
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Old March 24, 2014, 04:47 PM   #3
shane32
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O crap. Sorry yes switch those two on my order. I resize then trim my brass. And yes this is once fired brass that was fired in the same gun.
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Old March 24, 2014, 05:04 PM   #4
Bart B.
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I agree with the above, maybe the case length is too long if one without powder and bullet won't chamber. Trim it back a few thousandths.

If just the sized case chambers easily, your bullet's may be seated out too far and need to be seated a bit deeper in the case neck.
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Old March 24, 2014, 05:10 PM   #5
shane32
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Thanks a bunch guys. Ill try trimming a bit more off the case
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Old March 24, 2014, 06:24 PM   #6
BOOMST1CK
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I had this problem when I first started reloading, or at least a similar problem. Turned out I was buckling the neck into the shoulder, over crimping.
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Old March 24, 2014, 07:16 PM   #7
jamaica
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To full length size the shell holder must contact the die on full up with a casing inserted in the die. I don't suspect that press has much flex, but sometimes a little flex will prevent the full sizing unless the die is turned in enough that you get firm contact.

If the sizing die is set right and the brass is the right length it should chamber just fine. If it does not perhaps the rifle is pretty tight.

There is a way you can shorten up the shoulder a bit more, but it requires machining a few thou off the end of the die. This is non reversible so consider it carefully.

One thing you must know is that even once sized the brass is not as small as it was in the factory package. So reloads seldom, if ever, drop in quite as freely as factory ammo. It should go without a fight though. Not a bit unusual to feel a bit of resistance as you push the bolt down to locking position.

Last edited by jamaica; March 24, 2014 at 07:23 PM.
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Old March 24, 2014, 07:38 PM   #8
shane32
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Thanks a bunch for the input guys. Will try these an see how it goes. I tried the brass in more than one rifle and it didnt work it the other one either.
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Old March 24, 2014, 07:54 PM   #9
hooligan1
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Jamaica, what books tell you to insert a case and then adjust the die down?

Hell I been doing wrong for thirty some years...
Anyway back to Op,s problem...when I size oncefired brass I always scrub carbon from outside and inside of neck first then lubricate inside of neck with neckbrush and roll it on the lubepad,(RCBS lube pad and Case Lube).
When I set up my diebto Full length resize I make sure rams at top dead center and adjust my die down til it touches shellholder solidly, and then I cam over the ram and adjust a tad more until I get a solid camover kiss... Then they fly into tumbler for a nit and then to trimmer, after trimmer they get camfered and bevelled.

And primer pocket cleaned....

Ready to prime...
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Old March 25, 2014, 06:58 AM   #10
Bart B.
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In the reloading tool industry, full length sizing has always meant that the full length of the case is sized down. Nothing mandates that the die press hard against the shell holder to do that. Instructions usually say to set the die that way in the press as cases so sized will fit into all chambers for that cartridge that are made to SAAMI specs.

If one chooses to set his die in the press so there's a few to several thousandths clearance between the die and shell holder at the top of the ram's stroke, that's fine. There are tools made to measure how much of the case body gets shortened (head to shoulder reference point length) so fired cases are not oversized.

Redding makes shell holders with .002" increments in their height above their bottom from the .125" standard. Such shell holders allow one to use one to set their sizing die to so fired cases can be minimally sized their full length for their specific chamber dimensions. Details in the following link:

http://www.redding-reloading.com/ind...ellholder-sets

All full length sizing dies properly set in the press will make cases easily drop right into chambers that are made correctly.

This is a good statement:
Quote:
One thing you must know is that even once sized the brass is not as small as it was in the factory package.
The following is a 3M syndrome; a mistake, myth or misconception in my opinion:
Quote:
So reloads seldom, if ever, drop in quite as freely as factory ammo.
If that happens, either the die's dimensions are wrong, the die's set incorrectly in the press or the barrel's chamber ain't up to snuff. I would like to learn the actual details regarding the tools and rifles this idea is based on. Never heard of such a thing before.
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Old March 25, 2014, 07:47 AM   #11
steve4102
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Quote:
Still having the same problem. iv set up my fl sizer die touching the shell plate and 1/4 more turn like the die specified.
Im loading for 22-250 and 300 win mag.
If you are having the same problem with both cartridges in more than one rifle of each cartridge, then Odds are it's not the rifles or the dies, but your set-up.

The first thing I would check is you, are you making a complete down-stroke and up-stroke of the press?

The next thing I would do is remove all the dies from the press and start over.

Start with the FL sizing die and set it up according to directions, touching plus 1/4 turn.

Size a piece of fired brass. Wipe off the excess lube and check to see it it chambers. If so continue installing the other dies. If not screw the die into the press a little at a time until the empty case chambers.

Oh, I almost forgot, check the sizing die markings and make sure they say FL or Full Length, not Neck.

Last edited by steve4102; March 25, 2014 at 07:54 AM.
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Old March 25, 2014, 11:31 AM   #12
shane32
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I tried this.. Put the 22 250 case in a buddy's gun. Same results it would not chamber. Then we put the same die I was using and installed it in his lee press. Resized it and then it worked fine.. Maybe this has something to do with my hornady shell plate. And yes it's the right shell plate. I'm not sure what I'm doin wrong.. Thanks for all the input guys!!!
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Old March 25, 2014, 12:19 PM   #13
eldermike
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When I set up a new die I try a few cases in the gun right off the press. I start with a dime under the die and lock the ring to set up a space. I lube a case and run it in the die and then measure it, if it's not over length I try it in the chamber of my gun. If it's to long I trim it and try it in the gun.
Next:
Bolt will not close - turn the die down slightly and try another new case and then in the gun.
Bolt will not close - try again same process.
When I can feel the shoulder contact (remove firing pin and you can feel it)I turn down very slightly and run another new one. Perfect............so now run them all includning the ones you tried first. And if you lock things down you don't have to touch that die again.

When I load the first round I remove the firing pin and try it in the gun. Bolt will not close........to much crimp pushing the shoulder back or too long OAL.....find the issue and resolve it.

Done.
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Old March 25, 2014, 12:31 PM   #14
hdbiker
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sizeing

I have one set of RGB Lee dies in .243 win. that has to cam over pretty hard to chamber in my Ruger 77 MK two. hdbiker
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Old March 25, 2014, 01:06 PM   #15
steve4102
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Quote:
I tried this.. Put the 22 250 case in a buddy's gun. Same results it would not chamber. Then we put the same die I was using and installed it in his lee press. Resized it and then it worked fine.. Maybe this has something to do with my hornady shell plate. And yes it's the right shell plate. I'm not sure what I'm doin wrong.. Thanks for all the input guys!!!
As I posted above, Take all the other dies out of the press and start from scratch.

One or more of your other dies could be set incorrectly causing the shell plate to stop short!
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Old March 25, 2014, 01:24 PM   #16
William T. Watts
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After you size a case while it's still in the sizing die look and see if there is a gap between the shell holder and sizing die, use a feeler gauge and see how many thousands of a inch the gap is, that's how much your press is flexing. Turn in your die 1/32nd that's fractionally more than .003" probable only one adjustment will need to be made. Another way is buy a L.E. Wilson cartridge case gauge and drop one of your fired cases in the in the gauge and you have a visually way to check a fired and your resized case side by side. I have a Wilson cartridge case gauge for every caliber I load for except my 307 Winchester (no one make a gauge for this caliber)! For new people these gauges makes it virtually impossible to do what you are doing and will keep you out of trouble.. William
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Old March 25, 2014, 05:40 PM   #17
jamaica
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hooligan1
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Jamaica, what books tell you to insert a case and then adjust the die down?
Beats me. Where do you get that idea? Certainly not anything I said.
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Old March 25, 2014, 06:04 PM   #18
jamaica
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"
So reloads seldom, if ever, drop in quite as freely as factory ammo."

"If that happens, either the die's dimensions are wrong, the die's set incorrectly in the press or the barrel's chamber ain't up to snuff. I would like to learn the actual details regarding the tools and rifles this idea is based on. Never heard of such a thing before."

OK, try this: Get your calipers and carefully measure a factory round that has not been fired, then measure a reload. If you can measure you don't need a book to see the truth in the statement.
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Old March 25, 2014, 06:19 PM   #19
jamaica
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"In the reloading tool industry, full length sizing has always meant that the full length of the case is sized down. Nothing mandates that the die press hard against the shell holder to do that."

The definition of full length re-sizing is that the shell holder kiss the die. This is as far as the brass can be pushed into the die and yes it is then full length sized. It is not full length sized unless you get the kiss.

Once the shell holder kisses the die it matters not if it is a hard kiss or if there is a cam-over. The brass will go no further into the die. You do need the kiss for full length sizing.

However depending on the press, if a die is set to kiss the shell holder on cam over with no brass in the shell holder, and there is some flex in the press, the shell holder may not kiss the die when you put a brass in. It is not rocket science, just see to it that you get the kiss with a brass installed.
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Old March 25, 2014, 06:22 PM   #20
jamaica
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hooligan1 "Hell I been doing wrong for thirty some years..."

Oh good for you...... I have only been at it since 1956.
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Old March 26, 2014, 07:33 PM   #21
shane32
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So what iv found out. May be of intrest to some. The shell plate on the hornady compared to other shell plates or holders , the hornady shell plate is not pushing the brass into the fl sizer die the amout that is needed to resize properly. I hope im wrong but a 30 year reloading friend filled me in on this. He experienced the same issue. Although only with certain calibers this has happened. I found a video on you tube that explanes this issue in detail better than I can.I hope this is not the issue. Im in the process of moving so have not had a chance yet to try some of the above advice. The video on you tube is titled. " hornady LnL case shoulder bumb issue" if ud like to take a look. Legit info or not i dont know. Let me know what you guys think. Thanks alot for all the help much appreciated!!!!!!
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