.270 reloads too tight in breech

rivertrash · December 29, 2011, 08:24 PM

I have been reloading since 1977 and for some reason my .270 recent loads do not fit well in my rifle. I have checked case length and overall length and both are good. My bolt does not close easily on some of the cartridges, not all of them, maybe 30% of them. I have had these rcbs dies since 1977 and have loaded several thousand rounds with them. Do they wear out? Any ideas would be appreciated. Thanks

kraigwy · December 29, 2011, 08:28 PM

Dies do wear out. I'd recommend getting a "case gage" to check the finished case and set up your sizing die.

Betcha a new sizing die will fix the problem.

mehavey · December 29, 2011, 09:43 PM

Quote:

My bolt does not close easily on some of the cartridges, not all of them, maybe 30% of them.

First question is whether the brass is same group/brand/firing history.
Work-stiffened brass will "spring back" from shoulder bumping more than other brass.

Second question is whether you are full-length resizing "plus ⅛ turn" to ensure
the reloading press isn't spring a bit under load.

454PB · December 29, 2011, 10:13 PM

Any chance the bullets are jamming into the leade?

You could test that by seating the bullet .020" deeper on one of the rounds that resists chambering.

mrawesome22 · December 29, 2011, 10:15 PM

Probably just need to push the shoulder back a little more.

JerryM · December 29, 2011, 10:51 PM

I suspect it is a die adjustment problem. Some dies will not fully resize the case unless you screw the die down with the shell holder cleared. I also have experienced the need to file down the shell holder so the case would be properly resized.

Trial and error is the only way to get the adjustment just right.
Jerry

rivertrash · December 30, 2011, 01:42 AM

In reply to MEHAVEY, the brass is not necessarily the same brand, group or firing history. Sizing is full length + 1/8 turn.

rivertrash · December 30, 2011, 02:05 AM

In reply to MRAWESOME22 & Jerry M, not sure how I can push the shoulder back any as I am full case sizing now with the die touching the press + 1/8 turn. I will recheck the adjustments to ensure everything is as it should be. Thanks for your input.

PawPaw · December 30, 2011, 08:50 AM

rivertrash, there's more to it than screwing the sizing die all the way down.

Try the technique described in this thread.

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=473269

However, if you're doing the sizing correctly, the next culprit might be bullet seating depth. If you're not seating the bullet far enough then it will jam into the lands of the barrel and you won't be able to lock the bolt.

Keep piddling with it and you'll get it to work.

savagelover · December 30, 2011, 10:35 AM

what rifle is it?
are the case's brass or nickle?

rivertrash · December 30, 2011, 01:10 PM

The gun is a Remington 700 and I am reloading brass.

savagelover · December 30, 2011, 01:42 PM

have you tried the factory loads in it? I had one that had a pretty tight chamber and had to use a small base die to load for it,but that was a Weatherby rifle in 300 short mag..

mehavey · December 30, 2011, 07:57 PM

If it's a bullet seating depth problem, that won't cause any appreciable difficulty in closing the bolt as it will easily cam the bullet into the case -- unless heavily crimped. (Then things can get real interesting as the bullet/crimp combination can bulge the shoulder even as the cartridge is chambered.) **

If the brass has been fired in thay same gun before w/o difficulty, then it unlikely to be a small-base die solution either.

** postscript: By ANY chance are you seating/crimping in one operation?

jepp2 · December 30, 2011, 08:39 PM

Quote:

If it's a bullet seating depth problem, that won't cause any appreciable difficulty in closing the bolt as it will easily cam the bullet into the case -- unless heavily crimped.

I had an experience with a 25-06 that doesn't support this. I loaded up some rounds for my new Remington 700. I seated them to the maximum length listed in the Sierra manual. When I went to fire them (first rounds I had fired in my new rifle), I found the bolt very hard to close. I fired 10 rounds to sight in the rifle. Everything looked Ok from a pressure standpoint. When I returned home I check the max length for my rifle and found the rounds were approx. 0.040" longer. So I was firmly seating the bullet against the lands and forcing the bullet deeper into the case. And it did take quite a bit of force to close the bolt. No crimp was involved the bullets didn't have a cannelure ring

I seated the bullet deeper to be 0.020" from the lands, and they chambered easily. So in my case the force to close the bolt to seat the bullets deeper into the case did substantially increase the bolt force.

I don't think that is the issue with the OP, due to the statement of only 30% closing harder. The minor variation in seating depth wouldn't cause the significant increase in bolt handle force. Insufficient shoulder setback would be the most likely explanation. Variations in case lube and cause differences in shoulder setback.

AllenJ · December 30, 2011, 11:45 PM

...the brass is not necessarily the same brand, group or firing history.

If 7 out of 10 are chambering fine the above statement makes me think you have a case problem rather than a die issue. If I were having this issue I'd carefully measure different areas of the cases and compare a bad round to a good one. I'd even seriously consider investing in a case gauging tool in this instance (yea I know they are expensive, but who couldn't use one of those

). You may be using brass that has exceeded it's reloadable life span.

JerryM · December 31, 2011, 10:21 AM

I'm surprised that the problem has not been solved by now. I do not remember a problem that took me more than a day to solve in over half century of reloading.

Jerry

hunter52 · December 31, 2011, 10:43 PM

Have you checked your necks? Friend of mine was having issues like you with a 243. after doing some measuring, turned out some of his brass, Remington in particular , had thick necks which when the bullet was seated were oversized enough to not fit in the chamber.

flashhole · January 1, 2012, 02:13 AM

One of these will come in handy to tell if your case shouders are the same relative length after sizing.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/365...30-33-calibers

I've had the same problem and the solution was to anneal the case shoulders and necks.

oldmanFCSA · January 1, 2012, 03:08 AM

I've had this very same problem before, in various bottle-necked rifle cartridges.

It boils down to too much neck tension when resizing case and when you extract neck button thru neck, it pulls shoulder forward. Lubing inside necks with dry graphite helps, but case lube works better although then you need to clean cases to get rid of lube.

OR size without expander ball, then expand necks in another step by putting ball back in die and adjust die high enough to prevent resizing neck. Expand-Iron is name of a product that does just this op.

Annealing case necks helps, but does not eliminate this problem.

Put you loaded cartridge back in chamber gage to verify this problem.

December 29, 2011, 08:24 PM	#1
rivertrash Junior Member Join Date: December 29, 2011 Location: Idaho Posts: 14	.270 reloads too tight in breech I have been reloading since 1977 and for some reason my .270 recent loads do not fit well in my rifle. I have checked case length and overall length and both are good. My bolt does not close easily on some of the cartridges, not all of them, maybe 30% of them. I have had these rcbs dies since 1977 and have loaded several thousand rounds with them. Do they wear out? Any ideas would be appreciated. Thanks

December 29, 2011, 08:28 PM	#2
kraigwy Senior Member Join Date: June 16, 2008 Location: Wyoming Posts: 11,061	Dies do wear out. I'd recommend getting a "case gage" to check the finished case and set up your sizing die. Betcha a new sizing die will fix the problem. __________________ Kraig Stuart CPT USAR Ret USAMU Sniper School Distinguished Rifle Badge 1071

December 29, 2011, 10:51 PM	#6
JerryM Senior Member Join Date: April 4, 1999 Location: New Mexico Posts: 1,889	I suspect it is a die adjustment problem. Some dies will not fully resize the case unless you screw the die down with the shell holder cleared. I also have experienced the need to file down the shell holder so the case would be properly resized. Trial and error is the only way to get the adjustment just right. Jerry __________________ Ecclesiastes 12:13 ¶Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. 14 For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.

December 30, 2011, 08:50 AM	#9
PawPaw Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 2010 Location: Central Louisiana Posts: 3,137	rivertrash, there's more to it than screwing the sizing die all the way down. Try the technique described in this thread. http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=473269 However, if you're doing the sizing correctly, the next culprit might be bullet seating depth. If you're not seating the bullet far enough then it will jam into the lands of the barrel and you won't be able to lock the bolt. Keep piddling with it and you'll get it to work. __________________ Dennis Dezendorf http://pawpawshouse.blogspot.com

December 31, 2011, 10:21 AM	#16
JerryM Senior Member Join Date: April 4, 1999 Location: New Mexico Posts: 1,889	I'm surprised that the problem has not been solved by now. I do not remember a problem that took me more than a day to solve in over half century of reloading. Jerry __________________ Ecclesiastes 12:13 ¶Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. 14 For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.

December 29, 2011, 10:13 PM	#4
454PB Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2005 Location: Helena, Mt. Posts: 122	Any chance the bullets are jamming into the leade? You could test that by seating the bullet .020" deeper on one of the rounds that resists chambering.

December 29, 2011, 10:15 PM	#5
mrawesome22 Senior Member Join Date: November 9, 2005 Location: Ohio, Appalachia's foothills. Posts: 3,779	Probably just need to push the shoulder back a little more.

December 30, 2011, 01:42 AM	#7
rivertrash Junior Member Join Date: December 29, 2011 Location: Idaho Posts: 14	In reply to MEHAVEY, the brass is not necessarily the same brand, group or firing history. Sizing is full length + 1/8 turn.

December 30, 2011, 02:05 AM	#8
rivertrash Junior Member Join Date: December 29, 2011 Location: Idaho Posts: 14	In reply to MRAWESOME22 & Jerry M, not sure how I can push the shoulder back any as I am full case sizing now with the die touching the press + 1/8 turn. I will recheck the adjustments to ensure everything is as it should be. Thanks for your input.

December 30, 2011, 10:35 AM	#10
savagelover Senior Member Join Date: March 5, 2011 Location: Alpine,,NY Posts: 254	what rifle is it? are the case's brass or nickle?

December 30, 2011, 01:10 PM	#11
rivertrash Junior Member Join Date: December 29, 2011 Location: Idaho Posts: 14	The gun is a Remington 700 and I am reloading brass.

December 30, 2011, 01:42 PM	#12
savagelover Senior Member Join Date: March 5, 2011 Location: Alpine,,NY Posts: 254	have you tried the factory loads in it? I had one that had a pretty tight chamber and had to use a small base die to load for it,but that was a Weatherby rifle in 300 short mag..

December 30, 2011, 07:57 PM	#13
mehavey Senior Member Join Date: June 17, 2010 Location: Virginia Posts: 6,886	If it's a bullet seating depth problem, that won't cause any appreciable difficulty in closing the bolt as it will easily cam the bullet into the case -- unless heavily crimped. (Then things can get real interesting as the bullet/crimp combination can bulge the shoulder even as the cartridge is chambered.) If the brass has been fired in thay same gun before w/o difficulty, then it unlikely to be a small-base die solution either. postscript: By ANY chance are you seating/crimping in one operation?

December 30, 2011, 11:45 PM	#15
AllenJ Senior Member Join Date: December 11, 2009 Location: Northern California Posts: 1,766	...the brass is not necessarily the same brand, group or firing history. If 7 out of 10 are chambering fine the above statement makes me think you have a case problem rather than a die issue. If I were having this issue I'd carefully measure different areas of the cases and compare a bad round to a good one. I'd even seriously consider investing in a case gauging tool in this instance (yea I know they are expensive, but who couldn't use one of those ). You may be using brass that has exceeded it's reloadable life span.

December 31, 2011, 10:43 PM	#17
hunter52 Senior Member Join Date: January 27, 2011 Location: Colorado Posts: 101	Have you checked your necks? Friend of mine was having issues like you with a 243. after doing some measuring, turned out some of his brass, Remington in particular , had thick necks which when the bullet was seated were oversized enough to not fit in the chamber.

January 1, 2012, 02:13 AM	#18
flashhole Senior Member Join Date: February 9, 2005 Location: Owego, NY Posts: 2,000	One of these will come in handy to tell if your case shouders are the same relative length after sizing. http://www.midwayusa.com/product/365...30-33-calibers I've had the same problem and the solution was to anneal the case shoulders and necks. __________________ ,,, stupidity comes to some people very easily. 8/22/2017 my wife in a discussion about Liberals. Are you ready for civil war?

January 1, 2012, 03:08 AM	#19
oldmanFCSA Senior Member Join Date: November 8, 2010 Location: WISCONSIN Posts: 283	FIX for cases not fitting chamber. I've had this very same problem before, in various bottle-necked rifle cartridges. It boils down to too much neck tension when resizing case and when you extract neck button thru neck, it pulls shoulder forward. Lubing inside necks with dry graphite helps, but case lube works better although then you need to clean cases to get rid of lube. OR size without expander ball, then expand necks in another step by putting ball back in die and adjust die high enough to prevent resizing neck. Expand-Iron is name of a product that does just this op. Annealing case necks helps, but does not eliminate this problem. Put you loaded cartridge back in chamber gage to verify this problem.