B&T GHM9

simonrichter · June 28, 2020, 07:56 AM

does anybody here own this gun, any first hand experience? (It's on my shortlist for a replacement formy AR15-style subcarbine).

Btw, what is the correct terminology for this class of weapons that would be considered submachine guns or PDWs if they were full auto-capable? Pistol caliber sub-carbine? I know that these are often only classified simply as "pistols" (at least that's the case here in Austria), but thismakrs no sense whatsoever in terms of distinguishing between real pistols and these "semi-auto-SMGs"...

GarandTd · June 28, 2020, 11:36 AM

I had to look it up to see what it was. Depending on barrel length and stock configuration, in the states, it would be a PCC(pistol caliber carbine) or pistol. Not sure what full auto or select fire would do to change the classification, though, I imagine it would.

smee78 · June 28, 2020, 11:59 AM

If they were full auto capable they could be a machine pistol or a smg. They look cool though.

**44 AMP** · June 28, 2020, 09:20 PM

There are two general names/classifications of firearms. One is the way the shooting community refers to them, and the other is the legal definition given by the government.

For some guns, these are the same. For others. they can be different.

In the US, a gun that meets the legal definition of a rifle, and is chambered for a pistol caliber cartridge (such as 9mm Luger) is legally a rifle, but is usually referred to as a Pistol Caliber Carbine.

A full automatic firearm is, under US law, a machine gun. No other design features matter. It could be a tripod mounted belt fed gun, or a select fire assault rifle, or a submachine gun like the Tommygun. All are equally "machine guns" under US law.

simonrichter · June 29, 2020, 04:23 AM

interesting... Still, when I think of a carbine, I picture something more of a short rifle with at least a 10" barrel rather than a semi-auto SMG... So I guess the best description for the gun in question would be "pistol caliber sub-carbine"

**44 AMP** · June 29, 2020, 02:10 PM

Quote:

So I guess the best description for the gun in question would be "pistol caliber sub-carbine"

No, that would be incorrect. The maker describes it as a 9x19mm carbine.

Thompson coined the term "submachine gun" to emphasize that his gun wasn't a belt fed "full" machine gun firing rifle ammo. It was on a level below that, firing pistol ammo, it was a "sub"machine gun.

The term "sub" is not applied to semi autos. They aren't "sub" anything. They are semi auto rifles, which may (and usually are) called carbines.

TBM900 · June 29, 2020, 09:16 PM

The MP5 is widely considered to be the gold standard of the sub-gun world
I would largely agree and own a few myself

The GHM9 is without a doubt 99% of what the MP5 is
In fact the the APC version actually exceeds the MP5 by a tiny margin

Fire your AR variant sub, then pick ups GHM9 and fire it
You'll want to fling your AR into the nearest trashcan while saying "Why bother"

The build quality exceeds that of the MP5 by a wide margin
The shoot-ability is shoulder to shoulder
All in a package that easier to maintain, service, mod, etc

Ferris said it best...

Two of the three I own

June 28, 2020, 07:56 AM	#1
simonrichter Senior Member Join Date: December 3, 2011 Location: Austria Posts: 758	B&T GHM9 does anybody here own this gun, any first hand experience? (It's on my shortlist for a replacement formy AR15-style subcarbine). Btw, what is the correct terminology for this class of weapons that would be considered submachine guns or PDWs if they were full auto-capable? Pistol caliber sub-carbine? I know that these are often only classified simply as "pistols" (at least that's the case here in Austria), but thismakrs no sense whatsoever in terms of distinguishing between real pistols and these "semi-auto-SMGs"... __________________ "Get off of my lawn!" Walt Kowalski . ISSC PAR .223

June 28, 2020, 11:36 AM	#2
GarandTd Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 2016 Location: Rural PA Posts: 1,639	I had to look it up to see what it was. Depending on barrel length and stock configuration, in the states, it would be a PCC(pistol caliber carbine) or pistol. Not sure what full auto or select fire would do to change the classification, though, I imagine it would. __________________ 22lr, 20 gauge, 8mm Mauser, 35 Remington, 30-06, 5.56x45/223, 9mm, 380acp

June 28, 2020, 11:59 AM	#3
smee78 Senior Member Join Date: July 14, 2008 Location: South Carolina Posts: 2,918	If they were full auto capable they could be a machine pistol or a smg. They look cool though. __________________ We know exactly where one cow with Mad-cow-disease is located, among the millions and millions of cows in America, but we haven't got a clue where thousands of illegal immigrants and terrorists are

June 28, 2020, 09:20 PM	#4
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,839	There are two general names/classifications of firearms. One is the way the shooting community refers to them, and the other is the legal definition given by the government. For some guns, these are the same. For others. they can be different. In the US, a gun that meets the legal definition of a rifle, and is chambered for a pistol caliber cartridge (such as 9mm Luger) is legally a rifle, but is usually referred to as a Pistol Caliber Carbine. A full automatic firearm is, under US law, a machine gun. No other design features matter. It could be a tripod mounted belt fed gun, or a select fire assault rifle, or a submachine gun like the Tommygun. All are equally "machine guns" under US law. __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

June 29, 2020, 04:23 AM	#5
simonrichter Senior Member Join Date: December 3, 2011 Location: Austria Posts: 758	interesting... Still, when I think of a carbine, I picture something more of a short rifle with at least a 10" barrel rather than a semi-auto SMG... So I guess the best description for the gun in question would be "pistol caliber sub-carbine" __________________ "Get off of my lawn!" Walt Kowalski . ISSC PAR .223

June 29, 2020, 09:16 PM	#7
TBM900 Senior Member Join Date: November 2, 2015 Posts: 777	The MP5 is widely considered to be the gold standard of the sub-gun world I would largely agree and own a few myself The GHM9 is without a doubt 99% of what the MP5 is In fact the the APC version actually exceeds the MP5 by a tiny margin Fire your AR variant sub, then pick ups GHM9 and fire it You'll want to fling your AR into the nearest trashcan while saying "Why bother" The build quality exceeds that of the MP5 by a wide margin The shoot-ability is shoulder to shoulder All in a package that easier to maintain, service, mod, etc Ferris said it best... Two of the three I own __________________ Playboy billionaire Retired Colonial Marine 1st to walk on the moon without a spacesuit