Rhode Island bans "Ghost Guns"

**Aguila Blanca** · June 29, 2020, 02:16 PM

According to an article on the Bearing Arms web site, which I found through a link from an NSSF e-mail. Predictably, the Governor of RI is trying to portray banning ghost guns as a "public health" issue, and she claims the ban will make the people of Rhode Island safer.

https://bearingarms.com/tom-k/2020/0...ghost-gun-ban/

Be aware of this. The AMA has been pushing the "public health" thing for years, trying to make gunshot injuries and deaths into an epidemiological issue. It's not. It's either an accident, or it's a crime. It's not a disease (in any legitimate medical sense), and it's not like you can catch a gunshot wound from breathing the air or drinking the water. If you catch any politicians in your state making this argument ... please CALL THEM OUT ON IT.

**44 AMP** · June 29, 2020, 11:09 PM

So, yet another law to make something that was illegal, illegal....
and also covering the "loophole" (as THEY see it) of the individual hobbyists who just wants to make something for themselves.

As a "health" issue, in these times, what isn't?

Lots of things aren't, but are being sold as such.

I think the AMA has been barking up the wrong tree for a long time now, personal choice is not a disease. However, when its your paycheck to "manage" diseases, I can understand why they want it to be so.

**Aguila Blanca** · June 30, 2020, 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 44_AMP

I think the AMA has been barking up the wrong tree for a long time now, personal choice is not a disease. However, when its your paycheck to "manage" diseases, I can understand why they want it to be so.

I think they are desperately seeking ways to justify getting the CDC back in the gun control business.

TBM900 · June 30, 2020, 04:32 AM

Just wait until the pendulum inevitably swings and the marxists are back in control 3x
They are going to go for “paybacks” like the nation has never seen before...
Personal manufacture... GONE
Braces... GONE
Cans... GONE
Mags 10+... GONE
AW’s... GONE
On and on and on...

And why not, no one is going to stop them
The Rhinos are utterly impotent
The “silent majority” will continue being silent
Gun owners will continue arguing 9 vs 45
All while the marxists continue to take over
Sad to see our once great nation die this way

DaleA · June 30, 2020, 05:37 AM

Well 60 Minutes did a "Ghost Guns" piece in early May, 2020 and that might have helped raise the alarm. Google "60 Minutes Ghost Guns" and you'll find the links but if you want to see the whole thing I think you need to be a paying member of CBS Access.

Here's just a taste (30 seconds) of the piece on youtube.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4f5heW_n_c
It'll give you a general feel for the tenor/bias of the piece.

TXAZ · June 30, 2020, 09:07 AM

This is EXTREMELY important legislation!
How else can “do nothing” pols claim they did anything constructive worthy of being re-elected?

DaleA · June 30, 2020, 03:19 PM

^^^Excellent point.

One thing that CONSTANTLY amazes me is that politicians that do NOT approve of legislation that would restrict our rights are said to be doing "nothing". I'd REALLY like to see some push back on this as in "I'm not doing nothing, I'm attempting to preserve a right guaranteed in the Bill of Rights."

Note: if the politician is up for election he can substitute "fighting" for "attempting" or if their race is really close they can use "fightin".

TBM900 · July 1, 2020, 06:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaleA

I'd like to see some push back on this

Then push back

KyJim · July 1, 2020, 10:38 PM

So has anybody heard of someone getting robbed, shot, or killed by someone with a ghost gun? Not saying it can't or didn't happen, but I don't think I would run out of fingers or toes before running out of deaths from someone with a ghost gun.

**44 AMP** · July 1, 2020, 11:22 PM

Unfortunately actual use in crime is irrelevant to law being created and passed.

The people proposing such seem to deem inanimate objects responsible for criminal behavior, and act accordingly.

Therefore, they reason that by prohibiting possession of specific objects will prevent criminal behavior.

I disagree, but that's just me....

**Spats McGee** · July 2, 2020, 06:36 AM

Mod Note: This is Law & Civil Rights, not Activism. While law and politics can be difficult to separate, please try to stick to the legal issues.

5whiskey · July 2, 2020, 01:06 PM

There was a shooter in California a year or two ago that was reported to use a ghost gun. He was a convicted felon. Other than that, nothing.

And I hate the term ghost gun. For two reasons. One, most of the guys building a firearm from an 80% receiver doesn’t have a primary motivation of flouting the paper trail. It may be a consideration at first, but eventually it’s 90% about the hobby aspect. Second, It’s not the federal (or Rhode island) governments darn business to have a paper trail to trace back a firearm from the manufacturer to the end user. Were I in Congress (and I never will be because I think like this) I would introduce a bill to similarly provide a paper trail for computers used by reporters. After all, words and libel can cause at least as much damage as firearms. Words in the form of speeches and media articles can alter the course of history. So if the GCA is constitutional then so should a computer used by reporter control act.

**44 AMP** · July 4, 2020, 03:38 PM

The entire issue of "Ghost Guns" wouldn't be an issue had not some people childishly taunted the antis about how they could "get around" the rules.

Pointing out to your enemy where they are making mistakes is barking STUPID!

But people on "our side" repeatedly do it, and the rest of us suffer for that.

**Aguila Blanca** · July 4, 2020, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 44 AMP

The entire issue of "Ghost Guns" wouldn't be an issue had not some people childishly taunted the antis about how they could "get around" the rules.

Pointing out to your enemy where they are making mistakes is barking STUPID!

But people on "our side" repeatedly do it, and the rest of us suffer for that.

^^^TRUTH.

I've been saying that for years. Sometimes we are our own worst enemies.

silvermane_1 · July 5, 2020, 03:48 AM

Does Casper make "Ghost Guns"?

, but in all seriousness there is no such 'thing' as a "Ghost Gun" it's a made up term, just like there is no such thing as a "semi-auto assault rifle".

**Aguila Blanca** · July 5, 2020, 09:41 AM

"Ghost guns" is a made-up term, as is "assault weapon," but it has caught on and multiple states have enacted or are considering bills to ban so-called "ghost guns." As 44 AMP has pointed out, state legislators likely would never have even noticed home-made firearms if some members of the shooting community hadn't been so blatant about bragging how they could "get around" the laws by building their own firearms.

Unfortunately, that's how the ability to manufacture your own firearm, for personal use, without needing a manufacturing FFL, came to be viewed as a "loophole." Once legislators become aware of something they consider to be a "loophole," their natural tendency is to close the loophole. That's what cost us bump stocks. That's what is in the process of costing us home-made firearms. And that's likely going to cost us pistol "arm braces" -- people who can't just shut up and fly the mission.

**44 AMP** · July 5, 2020, 02:33 PM

Even the most foolish made up terms/names become real when enacted into law. Because, at that point, they become "real" with valid, LEGAL definitions.

Personally, I've always felt one of the biggest mistakes we made as a society was to allow the government the power to define our language.

And, redefine it, at will, under the prevailing common use of the day.

Quote:

just like there is no such thing as a "semi-auto assault rifle".

Sadly, there is such a thing, now, in Washington state. Not sure about other states, most of them that define such things are still using the term "assault weapon", but, as of the summer of 2019, every semiautomatic rifle in WA became, legally, a "semiautomatic assault rifle".

Every

single

one!

All the way from ARs and AKs to a Sears Ted Williams tube fed .22LR..

There is no argument over what is and isn't, they all are. NO exemption or exceptions based on features, caliber, feed system, capacity, age, or anything else. ALL semi auto rifles are now "semiautomatic assault rifles". It's the LAW!

**Aguila Blanca** · July 5, 2020, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 44 AMP

Even the most foolish made up terms/names become real when enacted into law. Because, at that point, they become "real" with valid, LEGAL definitions.

True - except for "assault weapon," which has become a poster child for "your mileage may vary."

Originally, I think every state that had an AWB copied the definition from the federal AWB. Since Sandy Hook, though, I think every state that still had an AWB on the books revised the definition, and today I doubt that any two of them match. So "assault weapon" is real and defined in those states ... but an "assault weapon" in state A may or may not be an "assault weapon" in state B or C or Y or Z.

**44 AMP** · July 5, 2020, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally, I think every state that had an AWB copied the definition from the federal AWB.

Some of them were virtually word for word, minus the sunset clause.

Now, here's something to consider, if you're still sleeping well at night...

The Fed AWB contained language that could be used to ban DA revolvers!!

Might want to check state AWBs for the same language.

It's a sneaky little thing, just a phrase that reads "or substantially similar to..."

They haven't tried to use it, yet. I figure tis a time bomb, just waiting for the right moment. I can see them doing it, when the feel the time is right, and then, factually claiming its been in the law for decades, you didn't complain then....

Look at the language of the law about the Streetsweeper / Stryker 12 shotguns...

silvermane_1 · July 6, 2020, 01:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 44 AMP

Even the most foolish made up terms/names become real when enacted into law. Because, at that point, they become "real" with valid, LEGAL definitions.

Personally, I've always felt one of the biggest mistakes we made as a society was to allow the government the power to define our language.

And, redefine it, at will, under the prevailing common use of the day.

Sadly, there is such a thing, now, in Washington state. Not sure about other states, most of them that define such things are still using the term "assault weapon", but, as of the summer of 2019, every semiautomatic rifle in WA became, legally, a "semiautomatic assault rifle".

Every

single

one!

All the way from ARs and AKs to a Sears Ted Williams tube fed .22LR..

There is no argument over what is and isn't, they all are. NO exemption or exceptions based on features, caliber, feed system, capacity, age, or anything else. ALL semi auto rifles are now "semiautomatic assault rifles". It's the LAW!

Well then we need to a better job at educationing folks that would be tyrants are using non-canon terms to deprive law abiding citizens of there creator endowed constitutional enumerated rights.

**44 AMP** · July 7, 2020, 01:30 AM

Quote:

Well then we need to a better job at educationing folks that would be tyrants...

Educating the people who would be tyrants isn't the problem (and likely wouldn't work, anyway)

The problem is the under educated people that believe their lies and vote for them and their power.

The law I referred to was passed by voter initiative (they couldn't get it through the legislature) after a slick tv ad campaign (only in the most populated part of the state) telling people that the law was needed to keep domestic abusers from buying guns.

It passed in only 5 of 39 counties, however, those 5 counties (the "I-5 Corridor") had the sheer numbers of votes to make it state law.

Always remember that democracy, wonderful as it is, is also 3 wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for dinner....

rc · July 9, 2020, 11:33 PM

California is working to force the purchase of all precursor parts through a dealer. Big brother wants to know everything about us. These laws are more nonsense from those who hate the 2A.

**Aguila Blanca** · July 10, 2020, 01:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rc

California is working to force the purchase of all precursor parts through a dealer. Big brother wants to know everything about us. These laws are more nonsense from those who hate the 2A.

Already being discussed here: https://thefiringline.com/forums/sho...ight=precursor

June 29, 2020, 02:16 PM	#1
Aguila Blanca Staff Join Date: September 25, 2008 Location: CONUS Posts: 18,457	Rhode Island bans "Ghost Guns" According to an article on the Bearing Arms web site, which I found through a link from an NSSF e-mail. Predictably, the Governor of RI is trying to portray banning ghost guns as a "public health" issue, and she claims the ban will make the people of Rhode Island safer. https://bearingarms.com/tom-k/2020/0...ghost-gun-ban/ Be aware of this. The AMA has been pushing the "public health" thing for years, trying to make gunshot injuries and deaths into an epidemiological issue. It's not. It's either an accident, or it's a crime. It's not a disease (in any legitimate medical sense), and it's not like you can catch a gunshot wound from breathing the air or drinking the water. If you catch any politicians in your state making this argument ... please CALL THEM OUT ON IT. __________________ NRA Life Member / Certified Instructor NRA Chief RSO / CMP RSO 1911 Certified Armorer Jeepaholic

June 29, 2020, 11:09 PM	#2
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,795	So, yet another law to make something that was illegal, illegal.... and also covering the "loophole" (as THEY see it) of the individual hobbyists who just wants to make something for themselves. As a "health" issue, in these times, what isn't? Lots of things aren't, but are being sold as such. I think the AMA has been barking up the wrong tree for a long time now, personal choice is not a disease. However, when its your paycheck to "manage" diseases, I can understand why they want it to be so. __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

June 30, 2020, 04:32 AM	#4
TBM900 Senior Member Join Date: November 2, 2015 Posts: 777	Just wait until the pendulum inevitably swings and the marxists are back in control 3x They are going to go for “paybacks” like the nation has never seen before... Personal manufacture... GONE Braces... GONE Cans... GONE Mags 10+... GONE AW’s... GONE On and on and on... And why not, no one is going to stop them The Rhinos are utterly impotent The “silent majority” will continue being silent Gun owners will continue arguing 9 vs 45 All while the marxists continue to take over Sad to see our once great nation die this way __________________ Playboy billionaire Retired Colonial Marine 1st to walk on the moon without a spacesuit

June 30, 2020, 09:07 AM	#6
TXAZ Senior Member Join Date: September 5, 2010 Location: McMurdo Sound Texas Posts: 4,322	This is EXTREMELY important legislation! How else can “do nothing” pols claim they did anything constructive worthy of being re-elected? __________________ Cave illos in guns et backhoes

July 1, 2020, 11:22 PM	#10
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,795	Unfortunately actual use in crime is irrelevant to law being created and passed. The people proposing such seem to deem inanimate objects responsible for criminal behavior, and act accordingly. Therefore, they reason that by prohibiting possession of specific objects will prevent criminal behavior. I disagree, but that's just me.... __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

June 30, 2020, 05:37 AM	#5
DaleA Senior Member Join Date: September 12, 2002 Location: Twin Cities, MN Posts: 5,310	Well 60 Minutes did a "Ghost Guns" piece in early May, 2020 and that might have helped raise the alarm. Google "60 Minutes Ghost Guns" and you'll find the links but if you want to see the whole thing I think you need to be a paying member of CBS Access. Here's just a taste (30 seconds) of the piece on youtube. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4f5heW_n_c It'll give you a general feel for the tenor/bias of the piece.

June 30, 2020, 03:19 PM	#7
DaleA Senior Member Join Date: September 12, 2002 Location: Twin Cities, MN Posts: 5,310	^^^Excellent point. One thing that *CONSTANTLY* amazes me is that politicians that do NOT approve of legislation that would restrict our rights are said to be doing "nothing". I'd *REALLY* like to see some push back on this as in "I'm not doing *nothing*, I'm attempting to preserve a right guaranteed in the Bill of Rights." Note: if the politician is up for election he can substitute "fighting" for "attempting" or if their race is really close they can use "fightin".

July 1, 2020, 10:38 PM	#9
KyJim Senior Member Join Date: July 26, 2005 Location: The Bluegrass Posts: 9,142	So has anybody heard of someone getting robbed, shot, or killed by someone with a ghost gun? Not saying it can't or didn't happen, but I don't think I would run out of fingers or toes before running out of deaths from someone with a ghost gun.

July 2, 2020, 06:36 AM	#11
Spats McGee Staff Join Date: July 28, 2010 Location: Arkansas Posts: 8,821	Mod Note: This is Law & Civil Rights, not Activism. While law and politics can be difficult to separate, please try to stick to the legal issues. __________________ I'm a lawyer, but I'm not your lawyer. If you need some honest-to-goodness legal advice, go buy some.

July 2, 2020, 01:06 PM	#12
5whiskey Senior Member Join Date: October 23, 2005 Location: US Posts: 3,652	There was a shooter in California a year or two ago that was reported to use a ghost gun. He was a convicted felon. Other than that, nothing. And I hate the term ghost gun. For two reasons. One, most of the guys building a firearm from an 80% receiver doesn’t have a primary motivation of flouting the paper trail. It may be a consideration at first, but eventually it’s 90% about the hobby aspect. Second, It’s not the federal (or Rhode island) governments darn business to have a paper trail to trace back a firearm from the manufacturer to the end user. Were I in Congress (and I never will be because I think like this) I would introduce a bill to similarly provide a paper trail for computers used by reporters. After all, words and libel can cause at least as much damage as firearms. Words in the form of speeches and media articles can alter the course of history. So if the GCA is constitutional then so should a computer used by reporter control act. __________________ Support the NRA-ILA Auction, ends 03/09/2018 https://thefiringline.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=593946

July 4, 2020, 03:38 PM	#13
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,795	The entire issue of "Ghost Guns" wouldn't be an issue had not some people childishly taunted the antis about how they could "get around" the rules. Pointing out to your enemy where they are making mistakes is barking STUPID! But people on "our side" repeatedly do it, and the rest of us suffer for that. __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

July 5, 2020, 03:48 AM	#15
silvermane_1 Senior Member Join Date: November 6, 2011 Location: Burien,WA Posts: 897	Does Casper make "Ghost Guns"? , but in all seriousness there is no such 'thing' as a "Ghost Gun" it's a made up term, just like there is no such thing as a "semi-auto assault rifle". __________________ Rugers:SR1911 CMD,MK 3 .22lr 6",Sec. Six '76 liberty .357 4",SRH .480 Ruger 7.5",Mini-14 188 5.56/.233 18.5", Marlins: 795 .22lr 16.5",30aw 30-30 20",Mossberg:Mav. 88 Tact. 12 ga, 18.5",ATR 100 .270 Win. 22",S&W:SW9VE 9mm 4",Springfield:XD .357sig 4", AKs:CAI PSL-54C, WASR 10/63, WW74,SLR-106c

July 5, 2020, 09:41 AM	#16
Aguila Blanca Staff Join Date: September 25, 2008 Location: CONUS Posts: 18,457	"Ghost guns" is a made-up term, as is "assault weapon," but it has caught on and multiple states have enacted or are considering bills to ban so-called "ghost guns." As 44 AMP has pointed out, state legislators likely would never have even noticed home-made firearms if some members of the shooting community hadn't been so blatant about bragging how they could "get around" the laws by building their own firearms. Unfortunately, that's how the ability to manufacture your own firearm, for personal use, without needing a manufacturing FFL, came to be viewed as a "loophole." Once legislators become aware of something they consider to be a "loophole," their natural tendency is to close the loophole. That's what cost us bump stocks. That's what is in the process of costing us home-made firearms. And that's likely going to cost us pistol "arm braces" -- people who can't just shut up and fly the mission. __________________ NRA Life Member / Certified Instructor NRA Chief RSO / CMP RSO 1911 Certified Armorer Jeepaholic

July 9, 2020, 11:33 PM	#22
rc Senior Member Join Date: April 28, 2001 Location: CA Posts: 1,759	California is working to force the purchase of all precursor parts through a dealer. Big brother wants to know everything about us. These laws are more nonsense from those who hate the 2A.

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