This happened near my parents house.

[JohnKSa]

They live in a pretty nice part of a suburb of Dallas--this particular incident happened a mile or two from them. My dad has been to this restaurant.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/33456552/

The most recent robbery took place Tuesday at a Waffle House on South Jupiter Road in Garland. Nearly every seat in the restaurant was taken when police say the robbers rushed in with guns drawn. “They do a lot of, you know, screaming and they've got the guns,” Dallas Police Sgt. Ross Salverino said. “It’s pretty intimidating.” Police say one of the robbers goes after the cash register and the others go out in the dining area and rob the customers.

Lesson 1: Bad things can happen in nice places near (and even in) quiet neighborhoods where nice, quiet people live.

Lesson 2: Not every armed robbery is an opportunity for an armed citizen to showcase his weapon handling skills.

From another article the team of robbers consists of 4 to 6 armed men. So far they've not harmed anyone. I've thought about this scenario some and unless I happened to be eating waffles with several armed friends who I knew I could count on when the robbers stormed the place the best strategy appears to be to remain calm, smile, grit your teeth and fork over your wallet & jewelry.

[OldMarksman]

In my mind I've often pictured armed robberies pulled off by a couple of perps, but four to six armed men?

I wouldn't try anything unless the perps started shooting.

[Double Naught Spy]

Since when is a Waffle House a nice place? I have eaten at that Waffle House as well.

I actually grew up very close to one of the other places they robbed and have eaten there a few times, Bobo China. It was located on my paper route.

Interesting...large group takeover robberies. You have to wonder if it is profitable enough for them to continue in this vane or if these are just practice and confidence runs for something bigger. I would not imagine them making too much money (divided 4-6 ways), especially robbing lower class or small time businesses and their patrons such as Waffle House and Bobo China.

[JerseyDrez]

Think about when 4-6 people rob a bank and get away with a measly $50k. Depending, thats about $10k per person...really not that much for the time served in prison, nonetheless all the trouble you have to go through.

Now think about that, but now a Wafflehouse with a few hundred bucks in the register...

[ZeSpectre]

I read the news report and then sat back and considered it for a while in the context of my usual habits and awareness level.

While I almost always sit where I can observe the entrance of eating establishments, I also have to consider reaction time, options, and the layout of the average Waffle house and so forth.

The only conclusion I can come to is that (as I've said before) sometimes you are just jacked.

The thing about group actions like that one is that someone in the group will have a big mouth and just HAVE to brag about what they've been doing and it'll be their undoing.

[markj]

I always park near the door, have 20 lbs of c4 wired to a cell phone, robbers come in I call that cell......... walk home........

Robbers sure are getting ballsy these days. But does a weapon at hand mean no harm will befall you? What could you do in a Waffle house against a group of thugs? Just you and your one weapon? Might make matters worse if you pull it.

I never thought a waffle house would attract a robber.

[MTT TL]

Four to six armed dudes is a pretty robust threat.

Unless I was just returning from a range trip with 4-6 buddies armed buddies I wouldn't even consider engaging unless the bad guys started shooting people first.

Even with 4-6 armed buds I think we would have to be pretty hard pressed to start a shootout in a Wafflehouse between 8-12 armed people. The risk of collateral damage would be insanely high and there would have to be some sort of really compelling reason to engage. Some days you get the bear, and some days the bear gets you....

[Claude Clay]

carry throw-down money and a throw-down wallet. an old wallet filled with 'your name here' credit cards and some singles.

go light on the jewelery when out & about.

yup to rule #2.......and #1 is what i have always preached. bad people go where the opportunity is.
perhaps even take the bus there and with your keys they drive home.......

[Big Bill]

I would think that in the OP scenario the danger of collateral damage (loss of innocent life) would be much greater than all the financial gain the perps would obtain. Perhaps that's one thing they counted on which would explain their attack when the place was full of guests.

Home invasion taken to a new level!

[omkhan]

Two days ago, here, 5 armed robbers : 4 men + 1 woman, got into a home @ 11:00 AM. A neighbor saw them and called 15 (kinda like your 911 but of course no match of the response/ service). Meanwhile the homeowner fired on them killing 2 while the 3 fled including the woman. The police came, took the bodies to hospital and the homeowner to Police station. He was back home after an hour or so.

Apparently, the police is taking credit of the killings by calling it a Police Encounter.http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default...10-2009_pg12_3 Which is IMO good since that means the homeowner will be safe from any charges/ cases that may have come across him. Another good reason to carry while at home.

[DRice.72]

Back in the early 80's my girlfriend and her grand mother were eating at a Burger King ( I think) In the Greenville/Spartanburg area, when two armed men stormed in and robbed it. During the robbery a police officer came to eat lunch, he was NOT responding to the robbery, one of the robbers shot and killed him as he entered the restaurant. She will never forget having to step over his dead body after the police arrived in response. You never know what is going to happen, when or where.

[Daugherty16]

where the off-duty cop tries to take on the whole band of armed robbers in the bank. Every time i see it i cringe. In that kind of scene, unless the bullets are flying - stay low, be a good witness. When a guy is holding a shotgun or a .44 on you, and your gun is concealed, you may have the element of surprise but only for an instant, and with his finger already on the trigger it's hard to imagine getting the drop on him.

I have actually considered this kind of no-win scenario in the past when we would take the kids or (now) grandkids out to eat. Back to the wall, in sight of the entrance, fine. But if 6 guys bust in armed and screaming, not only couldn't you get the drop on them, you most likely wouldn't even be able to see them all at one time. There just isn't a good scenario for this, outside of the movies. and you have all of your loved ones right there, at risk.

Here's my scenario screenplay: Play it cool, draw and keep it low, under the table, wallet in your other hand. Tell the wife to drop to the floor with the kids if you have to make a move. Hope you don't. Unless they start beating on your wife or shooting at folks, you really can't. Any way you calculate the odds, if you start a shooting war inside a restaurant, innocent people are certain to be hit. You are most likely to be one of them. Your family may too. That violates all three of the most important reasons i carry.

Makes me want to order a pizza delivery and stay at home.

[mrnkc130]

thats why i stay west of 35 and north of 820...

[AZAK]

Waffles? Really, as was mentioned above, what would the "take" be at a waffle restaurant?

This makes me shake my head, and further realize that I do not understand their mentality.

But, maybe for some a fourth or a sixth of a Waffle house take is worth the risk of death (their own or some innocent persons), debilitating injury, or a long "vacation" at the taxpayers expense.

Again, I shake my head.

[Double Naught Spy]

thats why i stay west of 35 and north of 820...

So you can still go to the NASCAR races, air shows, shoot at my place, but not go to Cheaper than Dirt or Cabelas?

I still thinking knocking off eateries for chump change is just practice of some sort that is supposed to lead up to something else. There just seems to be a lot more input going into the operation than would be necessary for what they are getting out of it. It isn't even like they are driving away with 4-6 of the patrons cars.

[Dan M.]

If nearly every seat in the restaurant was taken as the article stated, they probably got more from the customers than they did from Waffle House, plus maybe they had a fence for the credit cards they took from the customers.

[Van55]

Pulp Fiction.

[Fer]

Nice thread, I constantly make up scenarios of what could happen and how I should react, and defenatelly if the odds are 6 to 1 I wont start anything.
The reason I make up these scenarios was beacause I had a scary experience once.
I was at a chinesse restauran waiting for a to go order, the owner a friend of mine was not there ony one waitress, 5 weird looking guys where at a table with only on soda bottle and not doing anything, not even talking, this put me on alert! I had then a NAA blackwidow 22mag in my pocket, that would require a 100% accuracy on my part only 5 shots and no reload(as if the BW was easy to reload! yeah right), and even if I got 1 shot of at each guy who knows if they where dead with one shot. Ok so two guys leave(go outside) I asked the waitress if she knew them, she said no but they also had ordered to go. I began looking at the door for the two that went out side, I walked towards the door and when I looked outside one guy was sitting in the passenger side of a pickuptruck with the door open, the other was standing back to me talking to the other as they opened the glove box and pulled out some sort of 1911 model semiauto, I remember it was either stainless steel or nickel, I felt a knot in my throat and my legs began to shake, I dont know why I did not leave at that moment, maybe it was the fact that they where outside, really dont know.
Seconds later two more male clients came in to eat and my chineese friend returned also. It appears the food was ready and the other 3 guys left.
I will never know their intentions, but I had taken the desicion not to draw, I was no match for 5 guys and at least 1 semiauto. The odds moved to my favor when the two males came in and my chineese buddy also packs a weapon.
after that experience I try not to be caught of guard and try to think on how I would react in different scenarios.

[markj]

I too had troubles at a chineese resturant. It was all you can eat, after 4 hours the little guy comes out and tells me:

You leave now, you scare my wife, you eat eveyting, you go now you no pay just go......

he had a meat cleaver


all I had was an appetite and a napkin...

Havent went back....

[serf 'rett]

At first I thought the robbers had a stupid MO; however, upon reflection, they may be smarter than I assumed. The take has to be quite low when split, but the upside is the operation is low risk if they continue to encounter reasonable folks, even given there may be a few concealed carry people in the crowd. If the robbers didn't escalate the situation, I sure wouldn't.

[armoredman]

markj, nice one!
I doubt it's the cash, it's the wallet with credit cards, drivers licenses, identities to be stolen, etc. Might be practie, but I don't know. I have eaten at two Waffle Houses in Tucson, neither in what you would call a "good" area. We limit our fine dining to KFC drive through and Eva's Mexican take out.

[JimL]

During the robbery a police officer came to eat lunch, he was NOT responding to the robbery, one of the robbers shot and killed him as he entered the restaurant.

Even when I was a LEO I was laughed at for advising total paranoia at all times, even in my small town. Small towns attract crooks who see them as easy pickings. If ANYONE approached my car, even a friend, I covered him with an armor piercer below the window, etc.

I just read an Ayoob story in which the "handcuffer's" partner didn't even draw his gun. After all, the BG was on the ground motionless. They are both dead now. Too many cops are permanently relaxed because they were too relaxed on the job.

I had then a NAA blackwidow 22mag in my pocket, that would require a 100% accuracy on my part only 5 shots and no reload(as if the BW was easy to reload! yeah right), and even if I got 1 shot of at each guy who knows if they where dead with one shot.

You've convinced me. If I can't carry my 12 round .45 I won't carry.

[rdmallory]

Just sit tight and hope my gun is not printing on my side.

And thinking why did I pick up this .380 and leave the .45 in the gun safe. If something does break out I want 11 45s not 6 380s.

Doug

[besafe2]

My best advice here, avoid Waffle Houses. Here they are robbed all time. All of the Waffle Houses also have the sign stating no concealed weapons(or something like that) allowed on the property.

So wonder why they are targets

[LightningJoe]

Well, it was Garland. It was probably a nice suburb 40 years ago. Even Richardson is succumbing to the blight now. Why do you think McKinney is the fastest growing city in America? 25 years from now it'll be Melissa.