Vermont Carry (Problem ?)

Vermonter · March 16, 2012, 04:09 PM

Folks,
Being a Vermonter has its privileges namely the ability to carry 14 revolvers and a backup if I want just about anywhere.

The issue I am running into however is this. Because my state does not issue CCW there is no resiprosity with states that do. I of course have the option to file for an out of state CCW to the states I would like to be able to carry in. My question is this.

As a holder of an out of state ccw say New Hampshire do I get to enjoy the reseprosity that a resident license holder would enjoy? NH residents with a CCW can carry in several other states and I am wandering if this would apply to me as well.

I am looking to get as few Non Resident CCWs as possible so I can travel and visit family while carrying if I so choose.

Regards, Vermonter

Willie Sutton · March 16, 2012, 05:32 PM

Try using this mapping tool: You click on the permits that you have (or plan to get) and the map will tell you where you can carry.

https://www.google.com/#hl=en&safe=o...w=1024&bih=403

It's likely that a Florida non resident CCW is the easiest and most valuable one you can get.
New Hampshire non-resident permits are not as widely accepted.

Some states have differing reciprocity depending on if you are a resident permot holder v/s a non resident.
It's important to know the laws when you travel.

Willie

.

Sefner · March 16, 2012, 05:36 PM

OP is making a good point. Some states require you to be a resident of the State in which you have the permit in order for them to reciprocate, others do not. More do not than do, fortunately.

Pbearperry · March 16, 2012, 05:39 PM

I think if I lived in Vermont,I probably would not leave it to go anywhere unless it was necessary.

hermannr · March 16, 2012, 06:48 PM

A lot depends on where you are going. Some states (out your way, PA, VA, OH and KY, out my way, OR, WA, ID, MT, NV, WY, AZ....) all have open carry available without a license. In WA (and AZ) there are times when you can CC without a permit if you want to. May be in the other states too, just don't know for sure. WY CC without a permit is for residents only.

There are quite a few states that will accept any state's permits. You might read their laws to see if they made special provision for VT. There are other states (like NY, NJ, MD, CA), that I think the best thing is to send there tourism board a letter and state, I went on extensive hiolliday this year..we did not go to your state because of your restrictive carry laws.

graysmoke · March 16, 2012, 07:06 PM

Thus, I moved to Florida.....Not only because of the great weather.
It's a firearm owners paradise.....and those fine folk in North Florida, still refuse to accept the Civil War ended.

gunsmokeTPF · March 16, 2012, 08:16 PM

Vermont is great where guns are concerned. It is the way it should be everywhere. Unfortunately, because there is no licensing at all I don't know of any states that will issue a non resident permit. That's something you'll have to check out. NY being NY recognizes no one. NYC even threatened out of state active police officers with arrests if they came to the city armed from Florida I believe. They came and left happily.

Being a retired police officer and licensed to carry concealed, I can qualify each year for permission to carry in all states under Federal Law HR218. I think retired police officers in Vermont may also have a problem, since HR218 requires a license where you reside.

Because I'm lazy and spend a lot of time in Pa. I simply got a Florida carry, which is good for 5 years. Different states that accept licenses from other states sometimes restrict those licenses to only residents of those states. Be careful. For example, being a non Florida resident many states like NH won't allow me to carry there, cause they only recognize Florida residents. A friend of mine has a target permit in NY and wanted a cwp in Pa., cause he has a vacation home there, but was told because he didn't have a concealed carry in NY they wouldn't give it to him. He then got a cwp from Florida and can now carry in Pa..

Willie Sutton · March 16, 2012, 08:34 PM

Florida will issue a resident of any state, including Vermont, a non resident permit.

It can be done thru the mail.

It is the most widely reciprocated CCW in the USA.

Just get one....

Willie

.

Vermonter · March 16, 2012, 08:56 PM

Seems Like that would cover PA. I would like to cover NH that would about do it for me.

gunsmokeTPF · March 16, 2012, 09:00 PM

NH does not recognize the Florida license, unless you are a Florida resident.

hermannr · March 16, 2012, 11:23 PM

Same for MI, must be a resident of the state that issued. This is where HR 822 would help

Jim March · March 17, 2012, 03:37 AM

It's true that some states only recognize permits held by other states by residents of those states. Colorado is being sued over this - oral arguments in a federal circuit court appeal in the Peterson case are happening on the 19th of this month.

Gray Peterson is a WA state resident with both that and a Utah permit. CO recognizes UT permits but only by UT residents. Worse, the city of Denver refuses to recognize open carry so Peterson has no legal carry recourse at all in Denver.

Sparks1957 · March 17, 2012, 03:57 AM

Quote:

I think if I lived in Vermont,I probably would not leave it to go anywhere unless it was necessary.

Living here, that is the attitude I have assumed. I've done a lot of traveling, and now I really like being at home.

I am listening closely to this, though, as the lack of reciprocity is an issue for us in VT. About the only drawback I can think of of having such sensible gun laws; there's nothing for other states to recognize.

SwampYankee · March 17, 2012, 06:04 AM

Veromonter, the answer is: it depends.

I ran into the same problem with having a RI CCW. No one has reciprocity (well, just a very few and it's not 2-way reciprocity). So I can get a Florida if I want, but there are a number of states that will not recognize it because it is not my state of residence. A number of the states will, some will not. You need to check each state to confirm.

I ended up getting a CT, NH, ME and PA license because they were easy and the places I generally go. I would like to get a MASS license but it's a little more difficult and costs $100 a year- and you have to reapply EVERY year. I just do my best to stay out of MASS if I can.

Salmoneye · March 17, 2012, 07:27 AM

Quote:

I think if I lived in Vermont,I probably would not leave it to go anywhere unless it was necessary.

I came to this conclusion in 1994 after returning from SLC, Utah on a 6-month stint for work...

I have not left the borders of Vermont since then, except for the occasional troll across the deep water line into New York while fishing Salmon...

SwampYankee · March 17, 2012, 07:28 PM

If I could find work in VT, I would move there myself. Best state in the Union. Hands down. I can find no fault with Vermont. And half of my ancestors are buried there and founded most of the villages in the Northeast Kingdom. Just another bonus.

**Aguila Blanca** · March 17, 2012, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GunsmokeTPF

Being a retired police officer and licensed to carry concealed, I can qualify each year for permission to carry in all states under Federal Law HR218. I think retired police officers in Vermont may also have a problem, since HR218 requires a license where you reside.

No it doesn't. It requires that you be requalified annually by the department from which you retired or, if you live out of state, by the state police in your state of residence, and you must carry with you documentation of your retired status and your qualification. I am 98.73 percent certain there is no requirement to hold a carry license/permit from your home state. Please cite the portion of the law that says this.

YARDDOG(1) · March 17, 2012, 08:52 PM

^^^^^^^^this is true^^^^^^^^^
y/d

jgcoastie · March 17, 2012, 09:11 PM

And this is the biggest reason I rank Alaska above Vermont as far as best gun state... Alaska residents can get a permit for reciprocity with other states, yet no one in Alaska needs a permit to carry (Constitutional Carry, mirror of VT's)...

Florida non-res permit is your best bet. Widely accepted, though some states do not recognize non-res permits.

SwampYankee · March 17, 2012, 10:44 PM

Ah, but Alaska is huge and in the middle of Canada. Vermont is a gorgeous state, within spitting distance of Boston, Worcester, Amherst/Northampton (which are a lot of fun), Hartford and even New York. In Vermont, you're actually within a reasonable distance to American civilization, if you desire. In Alaska you might as well be in another country (and those Canadians are all weird).

gunsmokeTPF · March 19, 2012, 01:20 PM

Aguila Blanca, I don't know for sure and that's why I said I think and I didn't know for sure whether, or not under HR218 a retired police officer was required to present to LE of another state his proof of qualification within the past year, as well as his department ID and carry permit where he, or she resides. It was mentioned to me some time ago that your carry permit must be shown. Since my permit's always in my wallet anyway it's no big deal. Vermont is an unusual situation.

For me it's a pain in the rear end to get qualified each year due to the fact I'm not travelling anywhere that my Florida license won't cover me. Why should I have to go out of my way and pay $80 a year to keep being requalified?

I'll leave additional research into this question for others not as old and lazy as I am.

FTG-05 · March 19, 2012, 01:46 PM

I'd get an AZ permit before UT or FL. Very little training (a hunter safety course or NRA safety course will do), less cost for permit and last 5 years.

UT requires a special UT-specific course; not sure about FL, but the cost of the permit is $117, but it lasts 7 years.

I use these maps to determine where I can carry legally with what permit: http://www.usacarry.com/concealed_ca...city_maps.html

Good luck.

gunsmokeTPF · March 19, 2012, 02:03 PM

I set aside my laziness and checked a couple of things out. Under HR218 it's required to show a retiree's department ID card and proof of qualification within the past year. You can only carry the weapon you qualified with. You can qualify with two.

I went further to check out the Florida requirements for non resident cwp. There's no problem carrying in Vermont "GOD bless them", but since there is no licensing Florida will not issue any permit to anyone who is not licensed to carry in their home state. Therefore, they will not issue a permit to a resident of Vermont. It's written very clearly on their website. That's a real shame.

The odd thing is that a friend of mine only has a NY target permit, but was issued a Florida carry permit in order to carry in Pa.. I guess some people fall through the cracks. Lucky him!

gunsmokeTPF · March 19, 2012, 02:18 PM

FTG-05, I have a retired PO friend in Vegas who didn't want to bother like me to qualify for HR218 every year and also got an Arizona license, which he says is great and a breeze to renue.

Florida just requires proof of a gun safety course. Copy of police ID is good enough. Also, their website is always current where carrying is concerned. When I just went on it showed Iowa was just added for carry in January and Nevada was removed in 2009 when they refused to recognize Florida. In addition there are code #'s next to each state that indicates what you're allowed to carry in addition to a gun, such as a knife and whether, or not non resident licenses are recognized, etc..

Vermonter · March 19, 2012, 07:55 PM

Looks like this is the ticket for me. It will NH VT PA and NC. This covers the states where I travel often even as a non resident permit. I am going to take the needed steps and apply.
Regards, Vermonter

March 16, 2012, 04:09 PM	#1
Vermonter Senior Member Join Date: October 17, 2010 Posts: 962	Vermont Carry (Problem ?) Folks, Being a Vermonter has its privileges namely the ability to carry 14 revolvers and a backup if I want just about anywhere. The issue I am running into however is this. Because my state does not issue CCW there is no resiprosity with states that do. I of course have the option to file for an out of state CCW to the states I would like to be able to carry in. My question is this. As a holder of an out of state ccw say New Hampshire do I get to enjoy the reseprosity that a resident license holder would enjoy? NH residents with a CCW can carry in several other states and I am wandering if this would apply to me as well. I am looking to get as few Non Resident CCWs as possible so I can travel and visit family while carrying if I so choose. Regards, Vermonter

March 16, 2012, 05:32 PM	#2
Willie Sutton Junior member Join Date: January 26, 2012 Posts: 1,066	Try using this mapping tool: You click on the permits that you have (or plan to get) and the map will tell you where you can carry. https://www.google.com/#hl=en&safe=o...w=1024&bih=403 It's likely that a Florida non resident CCW is the easiest and most valuable one you can get. New Hampshire non-resident permits are not as widely accepted. Some states have differing reciprocity depending on if you are a resident permot holder v/s a non resident. It's important to know the laws when you travel. Willie . Last edited by Willie Sutton; March 16, 2012 at 05:37 PM.

March 16, 2012, 05:36 PM	#3
Sefner Senior Member Join Date: June 24, 2009 Location: Michigan Posts: 769	OP is making a good point. Some states require you to be a resident of the State in which you have the permit in order for them to reciprocate, others do not. More do not than do, fortunately. __________________ gtalk:renfes steamID: Sefner

March 16, 2012, 07:06 PM	#6
graysmoke Senior Member Join Date: August 25, 2011 Location: Tennessee Posts: 378	Thus, I moved to Florida.....Not only because of the great weather. It's a firearm owners paradise.....and those fine folk in North Florida, still refuse to accept the Civil War ended. __________________ "Keep your powder dry, and eyes on the target". -R. Lee Ermey

March 16, 2012, 08:56 PM	#9
Vermonter Senior Member Join Date: October 17, 2010 Posts: 962	Florida carry Seems Like that would cover PA. I would like to cover NH that would about do it for me.

March 16, 2012, 05:39 PM	#4
Pbearperry Senior Member Join Date: December 9, 2008 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 283	I think if I lived in Vermont,I probably would not leave it to go anywhere unless it was necessary.

March 16, 2012, 06:48 PM	#5
hermannr Senior Member Join Date: March 24, 2011 Posts: 730	A lot depends on where you are going. Some states (out your way, PA, VA, OH and KY, out my way, OR, WA, ID, MT, NV, WY, AZ....) all have open carry available without a license. In WA (and AZ) there are times when you can CC without a permit if you want to. May be in the other states too, just don't know for sure. WY CC without a permit is for residents only. There are quite a few states that will accept any state's permits. You might read their laws to see if they made special provision for VT. There are other states (like NY, NJ, MD, CA), that I think the best thing is to send there tourism board a letter and state, I went on extensive hiolliday this year..we did not go to your state because of your restrictive carry laws.

March 16, 2012, 08:16 PM	#7
gunsmokeTPF Junior member Join Date: February 14, 2012 Posts: 268	Vermont is great where guns are concerned. It is the way it should be everywhere. Unfortunately, because there is no licensing at all I don't know of any states that will issue a non resident permit. That's something you'll have to check out. NY being NY recognizes no one. NYC even threatened out of state active police officers with arrests if they came to the city armed from Florida I believe. They came and left happily. Being a retired police officer and licensed to carry concealed, I can qualify each year for permission to carry in all states under Federal Law HR218. I think retired police officers in Vermont may also have a problem, since HR218 requires a license where you reside. Because I'm lazy and spend a lot of time in Pa. I simply got a Florida carry, which is good for 5 years. Different states that accept licenses from other states sometimes restrict those licenses to only residents of those states. Be careful. For example, being a non Florida resident many states like NH won't allow me to carry there, cause they only recognize Florida residents. A friend of mine has a target permit in NY and wanted a cwp in Pa., cause he has a vacation home there, but was told because he didn't have a concealed carry in NY they wouldn't give it to him. He then got a cwp from Florida and can now carry in Pa..

March 16, 2012, 08:34 PM	#8
Willie Sutton Junior member Join Date: January 26, 2012 Posts: 1,066	Florida will issue a resident of any state, including Vermont, a non resident permit. It can be done thru the mail. It is the most widely reciprocated CCW in the USA. Just get one.... Willie .

March 16, 2012, 09:00 PM	#10
gunsmokeTPF Junior member Join Date: February 14, 2012 Posts: 268	NH does not recognize the Florida license, unless you are a Florida resident.

March 16, 2012, 11:23 PM	#11
hermannr Senior Member Join Date: March 24, 2011 Posts: 730	Same for MI, must be a resident of the state that issued. This is where HR 822 would help

March 17, 2012, 03:37 AM	#12
Jim March Senior Member Join Date: February 14, 1999 Location: Pittsburg, CA, USA Posts: 7,417	It's true that some states only recognize permits held by other states by residents of those states. Colorado is being sued over this - oral arguments in a federal circuit court appeal in the Peterson case are happening on the 19th of this month. Gray Peterson is a WA state resident with both that and a Utah permit. CO recognizes UT permits but only by UT residents. Worse, the city of Denver refuses to recognize open carry so Peterson has no legal carry recourse at all in Denver. __________________ Jim March

March 17, 2012, 06:04 AM	#14
SwampYankee Registration in progress Join Date: November 1, 2008 Location: I can be found on a number of other forums. Posts: 1,333	Veromonter, the answer is: it depends. I ran into the same problem with having a RI CCW. No one has reciprocity (well, just a very few and it's not 2-way reciprocity). So I can get a Florida if I want, but there are a number of states that will not recognize it because it is not my state of residence. A number of the states will, some will not. You need to check each state to confirm. I ended up getting a CT, NH, ME and PA license because they were easy and the places I generally go. I would like to get a MASS license but it's a little more difficult and costs $100 a year- and you have to reapply EVERY year. I just do my best to stay out of MASS if I can.

March 17, 2012, 07:28 PM	#16
SwampYankee Registration in progress Join Date: November 1, 2008 Location: I can be found on a number of other forums. Posts: 1,333	If I could find work in VT, I would move there myself. Best state in the Union. Hands down. I can find no fault with Vermont. And half of my ancestors are buried there and founded most of the villages in the Northeast Kingdom. Just another bonus.

March 17, 2012, 08:52 PM	#18
YARDDOG(1) Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: GATOR COUNTRY HA HA HA! Posts: 721	^^^^^^^^this is true^^^^^^^^^ y/d __________________ There's a GATOR in the bushes & She's Callin my name >Molly Hatchett<

March 17, 2012, 09:11 PM	#19
jgcoastie Senior Member Join Date: February 15, 2009 Location: Kodiak, Alaska Posts: 2,118	And this is the biggest reason I rank Alaska above Vermont as far as best gun state... Alaska residents can get a permit for reciprocity with other states, yet no one in Alaska needs a permit to carry (Constitutional Carry, mirror of VT's)... Florida non-res permit is your best bet. Widely accepted, though some states do not recognize non-res permits. __________________ "To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms, and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them." -Richard Henry Lee, Virginia delegate to the Continental Congress, initiator of the Declaration of Independence, and member of the first Senate, which passed the Bill of Rights.

March 17, 2012, 10:44 PM	#20
SwampYankee Registration in progress Join Date: November 1, 2008 Location: I can be found on a number of other forums. Posts: 1,333	Ah, but Alaska is huge and in the middle of Canada. Vermont is a gorgeous state, within spitting distance of Boston, Worcester, Amherst/Northampton (which are a lot of fun), Hartford and even New York. In Vermont, you're actually within a reasonable distance to American civilization, if you desire. In Alaska you might as well be in another country (and those Canadians are all weird).

March 19, 2012, 01:20 PM	#21
gunsmokeTPF Junior member Join Date: February 14, 2012 Posts: 268	Aguila Blanca, I don't know for sure and that's why I said I think and I didn't know for sure whether, or not under HR218 a retired police officer was required to present to LE of another state his proof of qualification within the past year, as well as his department ID and carry permit where he, or she resides. It was mentioned to me some time ago that your carry permit must be shown. Since my permit's always in my wallet anyway it's no big deal. Vermont is an unusual situation. For me it's a pain in the rear end to get qualified each year due to the fact I'm not travelling anywhere that my Florida license won't cover me. Why should I have to go out of my way and pay $80 a year to keep being requalified? I'll leave additional research into this question for others not as old and lazy as I am. Last edited by gunsmokeTPF; March 19, 2012 at 01:30 PM.

March 19, 2012, 01:46 PM	#22
FTG-05 Senior Member Join Date: March 18, 1999 Location: TN Posts: 301	I'd get an AZ permit before UT or FL. Very little training (a hunter safety course or NRA safety course will do), less cost for permit and last 5 years. UT requires a special UT-specific course; not sure about FL, but the cost of the permit is $117, but it lasts 7 years. I use these maps to determine where I can carry legally with what permit: http://www.usacarry.com/concealed_ca...city_maps.html Good luck.

March 19, 2012, 02:03 PM	#23
gunsmokeTPF Junior member Join Date: February 14, 2012 Posts: 268	I set aside my laziness and checked a couple of things out. Under HR218 it's required to show a retiree's department ID card and proof of qualification within the past year. You can only carry the weapon you qualified with. You can qualify with two. I went further to check out the Florida requirements for non resident cwp. There's no problem carrying in Vermont "GOD bless them", but since there is no licensing Florida will not issue any permit to anyone who is not licensed to carry in their home state. Therefore, they will not issue a permit to a resident of Vermont. It's written very clearly on their website. That's a real shame. The odd thing is that a friend of mine only has a NY target permit, but was issued a Florida carry permit in order to carry in Pa.. I guess some people fall through the cracks. Lucky him!

March 19, 2012, 02:18 PM	#24
gunsmokeTPF Junior member Join Date: February 14, 2012 Posts: 268	FTG-05, I have a retired PO friend in Vegas who didn't want to bother like me to qualify for HR218 every year and also got an Arizona license, which he says is great and a breeze to renue. Florida just requires proof of a gun safety course. Copy of police ID is good enough. Also, their website is always current where carrying is concerned. When I just went on it showed Iowa was just added for carry in January and Nevada was removed in 2009 when they refused to recognize Florida. In addition there are code #'s next to each state that indicates what you're allowed to carry in addition to a gun, such as a knife and whether, or not non resident licenses are recognized, etc..

March 19, 2012, 07:55 PM	#25
Vermonter Senior Member Join Date: October 17, 2010 Posts: 962	NH Non Resident Looks like this is the ticket for me. It will NH VT PA and NC. This covers the states where I travel often even as a non resident permit. I am going to take the needed steps and apply. Regards, Vermonter

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