tested my 357 Cowboy load

Real Gun · June 14, 2017, 07:37 PM

I have the option with the guns I have to shoot 44 Special or 38 Special in SASS. However, my 357 rifle will not feed 38 Special. I can use 38 Special in the revolvers, which are not 357s, but I need a mild load to use 357 Magnum cases in the rifle. Using different cartridges is not ideal. I bought some 158 gr LRNFP from Xtreme and seated them over the front band, since they wouldn't feed otherwise using the crimp groove. I used 4.0 gr Bullseye. Test firing some this afternoon makes me believe these are perfect for what I need.

The revolvers are Uberti Lightnings (Model P Jrs.) and will shoot 125 gr lead with that same 4.0 Bullseye charge. If I were to use 158 in both cartridges I would need 3.0 in the 38 Special. If I were to use 125 gr bullets in the rifle using 357 cases, I would need a 5.0 gr charge. That's by my figuring anyway, basing it mostly on Lyman data.

I guess I should add that the revolver rounds need to be under 1000fps, preferably under 700. The rifle rounds need to be under 1400, but anything strong enough to exit the barrel and make a good clang on a steel target at close range is what we want. I am using the 158 rifle bullet weight to control velocity

rclark · June 14, 2017, 07:55 PM

Sounds good. Enjoy! You should get a chronograph to see what your actual velocities are.

It is no problem what-so-ever to load .38 Special level loads in .357 cases. That is one reason I reload because I can tailor my loads to what "I" want to shoot. Same with any and all the cartridges I load and shoot.

reddog81 · June 14, 2017, 11:45 PM

I don't understand how it can be necessary to use .357 brass but also necessary to seat to 38 special OALs. But whatever works I guess...

Real Gun · June 15, 2017, 06:19 AM

Quote:

I don't understand how it can be necessary to use .357 brass but also necessary to seat to 38 special OALs. But whatever works I guess...

The fallacy in your question is that the COL is well beyond 38 Special maximum, which absolutely will not feed except a single round, any following round causing a nightmare jam.

First I seated two rounds to the crimp groove on bullets with a very round nose and a flat point, yet with a single driving band. When they did not chamber, seeming to catch on the driving band, I moved the crimp forward to roll over the leading edge. It then worked and shot really well. What's not to like? They sit on my loading stick beside 10 rounds of 38 Special, and very noticeably are absolutely longer in length than the 38 Specials, TCFP crimped in the groove.

griz · June 15, 2017, 06:48 AM

From my days in SASS I prefer to have the same load for the rifle as the six guns to reduce thinking if a reload is required. But it sounds as if you have the problem solved. If you want to experiment further you might look for a bullet that is longer from the crimp groove to the nose, which would let you use 38 cases in the rifle.

Real Gun · June 15, 2017, 07:15 AM

Quote:

<snip>If you want to experiment further you might look for a bullet that is longer from the crimp groove to the nose, which would let you use 38 cases in the rifle.

Good thought, but I would be bound by what would fit in the revolvers, or I still wouldn't be sharing ammo among guns.

458winshooter · June 16, 2017, 12:46 AM

What brand of rifle are you using ?This is not an uncommon problem for a Rossi.Most folks have found that if they replace the plastic bullet follower with a metal one from a Marlin it'll take care of it,or you can load the 38s out a little long.

Hammerhead · June 16, 2017, 12:30 PM

My old Rossi 1892 clone was fussy that way too. Didn't like 38s of any flavor or SWCs in 357 brass. They fed from the mag just fine, just didn't like the transition from carrier to chamber.

My Handi rifle has no such problems (other than follow up shots).

Seating deep and crimping on the nose is a long established technique for 357 and other revolver calibers.

I do it anytime I'm using a long nose 38 special or 38 Super bullet in 357 brass. (I load everything in 357 brass)

June 14, 2017, 07:37 PM	#1
Real Gun Senior Member Join Date: May 19, 2004 Location: SC Posts: 2,743	tested my 357 Cowboy load I have the option with the guns I have to shoot 44 Special or 38 Special in SASS. However, my 357 rifle will not feed 38 Special. I can use 38 Special in the revolvers, which are not 357s, but I need a mild load to use 357 Magnum cases in the rifle. Using different cartridges is not ideal. I bought some 158 gr LRNFP from Xtreme and seated them over the front band, since they wouldn't feed otherwise using the crimp groove. I used 4.0 gr Bullseye. Test firing some this afternoon makes me believe these are perfect for what I need. The revolvers are Uberti Lightnings (Model P Jrs.) and will shoot 125 gr lead with that same 4.0 Bullseye charge. If I were to use 158 in both cartridges I would need 3.0 in the 38 Special. If I were to use 125 gr bullets in the rifle using 357 cases, I would need a 5.0 gr charge. That's by my figuring anyway, basing it mostly on Lyman data. I guess I should add that the revolver rounds need to be under 1000fps, preferably under 700. The rifle rounds need to be under 1400, but anything strong enough to exit the barrel and make a good clang on a steel target at close range is what we want. I am using the 158 rifle bullet weight to control velocity __________________ Not an expert, just a reporter. Last edited by Real Gun; June 14, 2017 at 07:43 PM.

June 14, 2017, 07:55 PM	#2
rclark Senior Member Join Date: February 12, 2009 Location: Butte, MT Posts: 2,622	Sounds good. Enjoy! You should get a chronograph to see what your actual velocities are. It is no problem what-so-ever to load .38 Special level loads in .357 cases. That is one reason I reload because I can tailor my loads to what "I" want to shoot. Same with any and all the cartridges I load and shoot. __________________ A clinger and deplorable, MAGA, and life NRA member. When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns. Single Action .45 Colt (Sometimes colloquially referred to by its alias as the .45 'Long' Colt or .45LC). Don't leave home without it. That said, the .44Spec is right up their too... but the .45 Colt is still the king.

June 16, 2017, 12:46 AM	#7
458winshooter Senior Member Join Date: June 16, 2008 Location: Transplanted to Ridgeland,SC Posts: 606	357 rifle What brand of rifle are you using ?This is not an uncommon problem for a Rossi.Most folks have found that if they replace the plastic bullet follower with a metal one from a Marlin it'll take care of it,or you can load the 38s out a little long.

June 14, 2017, 11:45 PM	#3
reddog81 Senior Member Join Date: October 16, 2014 Location: Iowa Posts: 1,634	I don't understand how it can be necessary to use .357 brass but also necessary to seat to 38 special OALs. But whatever works I guess...

June 15, 2017, 06:48 AM	#5
griz Senior Member Join Date: July 31, 2000 Location: Middle Peninsula, VA Posts: 1,588	From my days in SASS I prefer to have the same load for the rifle as the six guns to reduce thinking if a reload is required. But it sounds as if you have the problem solved. If you want to experiment further you might look for a bullet that is longer from the crimp groove to the nose, which would let you use 38 cases in the rifle.

June 16, 2017, 12:30 PM	#8
Hammerhead Senior Member Join Date: May 31, 2004 Location: Minnesota Posts: 2,432	My old Rossi 1892 clone was fussy that way too. Didn't like 38s of any flavor or SWCs in 357 brass. They fed from the mag just fine, just didn't like the transition from carrier to chamber. My Handi rifle has no such problems (other than follow up shots). Seating deep and crimping on the nose is a long established technique for 357 and other revolver calibers. I do it anytime I'm using a long nose 38 special or 38 Super bullet in 357 brass. (I load everything in 357 brass)