The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Hide > The Dave McCracken Memorial Shotgun Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old August 14, 2017, 09:41 AM   #1
Siggy-06
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 2, 2014
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,148
Mossberg Shockwave: Tax Stamps

The Mossberg Shockwave has been out since earlier this year, and no tax stamp is needed when bought as it comes from the factory.

My question now is, if I put a stock on it it becomes a short barreled shotgun and need to file for a stamp @ $200(in Florida). But what if I want to just put a pistol grip and foregrip on it? Would that make it an AOW(therefore only costing $5 in FL)?

I've gotten a few different answers from several people, 2 of which really know their stuff but they gave different answers. I'm probably going to end up writing a letter to the ATF anyways.

So does adding a pistol grip instead of the shockwave grip, along with a foregrip make it an AOW or a SBS?
__________________
Flicks just like a lighter, just a different kind of fire.
Siggy-06 is offline  
Old August 14, 2017, 06:00 PM   #2
Bill DeShivs
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 7, 2006
Posts: 10,967
The gun must be 26 inches overall. If the new grip reduces the length to below 26', a tax stamp is required.
Not sure about the pistol foregrip-but it would probably put it in tax stamp territory, too.
__________________
Bill DeShivs, Master Cutler
www.billdeshivs.com
Bill DeShivs is offline  
Old August 14, 2017, 06:40 PM   #3
FITASC
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 6, 2014
Posts: 6,432
The reason for the particular grip is to get that 26" OAL.
__________________
"I believe that people have a right to decide their own destinies; people own themselves. I also believe that, in a democracy, government exists because (and only so long as) individual citizens give it a 'temporary license to exist'—in exchange for a promise that it will behave itself. In a democracy, you own the government—it doesn't own you."- Frank Zappa
FITASC is offline  
Old August 14, 2017, 08:28 PM   #4
Siggy-06
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 2, 2014
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,148
So of it's below 26 inches overall does it become a smoothbore pistol or an AOW?
__________________
Flicks just like a lighter, just a different kind of fire.
Siggy-06 is offline  
Old August 15, 2017, 08:49 AM   #5
Siggy-06
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 2, 2014
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,148
So after a bunch of research, I've come to this:

PGO shotguns -- manufactured and sold without ever having a shoulder stock installed -- are "Other Firearms" on the 4473 form. Just like a stripped AR receiver or a belt-fed, semi-auto M1919. They cannot be sold by a dealer to anyone under 21.

A "Shotgun" is restricted to at least an 18" barrel, and 26" overall by the definitions of the National Firearms Act '34. BUT, a shotgun by definition must be "designed or redesigned to be fired from the shoulder."

So, the ATF says, an "Other Firearm" is not subject to the 18" barrel rule. However, if it becomes less than 26" overall, it is now a concealable arm and thus falls into their interpretation of one definition of a Title II "Any Other Weapon."
__________________
Flicks just like a lighter, just a different kind of fire.
Siggy-06 is offline  
Old August 15, 2017, 12:43 PM   #6
Bill DeShivs
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 7, 2006
Posts: 10,967
A smoothbore pistol IS an AOW.
__________________
Bill DeShivs, Master Cutler
www.billdeshivs.com
Bill DeShivs is offline  
Old August 15, 2017, 01:00 PM   #7
Siggy-06
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 2, 2014
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,148
Exactly right Bill. I can change the shockwave grip to a shorter style pistol grip once I have an AOW stamp for it(only $5 here in FL). As for putting a foregrip on a smoothbore pistol, I'm at a bit of a loss.
__________________
Flicks just like a lighter, just a different kind of fire.
Siggy-06 is offline  
Old August 15, 2017, 02:49 PM   #8
FITASC
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 6, 2014
Posts: 6,432
The $5 stamp is not limited to Florida, that is Federal, not state.

So, can someone who buys a standard PGO cruiser that is an "other" and then buy a bird's head grip and a 14" barrel and change it legally? Can you even buy a 14" barrel legally in the US (Canada notwithstanding)?
__________________
"I believe that people have a right to decide their own destinies; people own themselves. I also believe that, in a democracy, government exists because (and only so long as) individual citizens give it a 'temporary license to exist'—in exchange for a promise that it will behave itself. In a democracy, you own the government—it doesn't own you."- Frank Zappa
FITASC is offline  
Old August 17, 2017, 06:34 PM   #9
MadDawg
Member
 
Join Date: December 27, 2014
Posts: 51
I asked this question to the ATF real recently.. They said - as long as it was still over 26 inches overall length, I'm good to go without any paperwork.

I don't particularly like the birds head grip on the shockwave; so I dug around and found the Blackhawk Specops Gen III BreachersGrip..

It's about 27.25 inches long with the grip installed.

I should add.. I've done a lot of research into the "Firearm" category, mainly because of an AR pistol. At 26.x inches, anything above 26 inches, you should be good to go on adding a forward pistol grip. IMO, a pistol grip on the front would be far better safety measure than the sling Mossberg chose to ship with.
MadDawg is offline  
Old August 17, 2017, 09:03 PM   #10
CalmerThanYou
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 16, 2017
Posts: 323
This months "World of Firepower' magazine has a good article on the Shockwave. FYI
CalmerThanYou is offline  
Old August 25, 2017, 06:35 AM   #11
Auto5
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 18, 2013
Location: Chicago suburbs
Posts: 662
Here's another thought: I have a RIFLED slug barrel for a mossberg. If I were to cut that down and the overall length was less than 26", would I have an AOW, or a big bulky pistol? (This is assuming I started with an "other", not a shoulder fired "shotgun").
__________________
At the young age of five, a bear told me that I was the only person who could prevent forest fires. Why I was chosen, I'll never know.
Auto5 is offline  
Old August 25, 2017, 10:54 AM   #12
Don Fischer
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 2, 2017
Posts: 1,868
A guy I worked for in Alaska yeas ago had an 870 he'd cut down just like that. He said it was his bear gun when he was out fooling around. He only owned two gun's that one and some kind of rifle. He wasn't a gun nut.

But that gun was easy to tote around and a heck of a lot handier than a full length shotgun. Didn't know anyone made then. That would be a shotgun I'd consider for home defense! I wouldn't hunt chukars with it though!
Don Fischer is offline  
Old August 25, 2017, 12:24 PM   #13
CalmerThanYou
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 16, 2017
Posts: 323
Another good article in the NRA's latest magazine,
CalmerThanYou is offline  
Old August 25, 2017, 03:49 PM   #14
Bill DeShivs
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 7, 2006
Posts: 10,967
Siggy 06- you are confused.
The transfer of an existing AOW is a $5 tax.
MAKING an AOW (which is what you would be doing) is a $200 tax.
Both taxes are federal, and have nothing to do with Florida
__________________
Bill DeShivs, Master Cutler
www.billdeshivs.com
Bill DeShivs is offline  
Old August 27, 2017, 08:55 AM   #15
Siggy-06
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 2, 2014
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,148
It looks like my best bet is to find a pistol grip that would keep it at 26 inches, and then just add a verticle foregrip. No stamp needed that way.
__________________
Flicks just like a lighter, just a different kind of fire.
Siggy-06 is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:41 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2021 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Page generated in 0.06719 seconds with 8 queries