November 1, 2018, 04:54 PM | #51 | ||
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The link to the request for prototypes was to a document dated January 2016. That is 3 years old--or 2 years 10 months, if you prefer. Quote:
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November 1, 2018, 04:59 PM | #52 | |||
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I will buy the beer if the US Army keeps 5.56mm. |
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November 1, 2018, 05:15 PM | #53 | |
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Your saying thats something new? |
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November 1, 2018, 05:22 PM | #54 | ||
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It hurts your position when you make statements that are so painfully obviously not based in fact.
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November 1, 2018, 05:38 PM | #55 | |
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ONE engagement occurred in 2009 where body armor was reported. The enemy unit was suspected of being a foreign fighter element and not mainstream AQ or Taliban. |
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November 1, 2018, 05:42 PM | #56 |
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Regardless of what may or may not have been likely in one theater, the idea that opponents with body armor is something new or is a possibility that the designers of the current 5.56 ammo were unaware of is pretty far-fetched.
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November 1, 2018, 05:42 PM | #57 | ||
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While the statement is most certainly based upon fact, it is not intended to be a scientific literal declaration hence to offer the of frosty beverages to be shared among friends, LOL. Thanks for setting the lines and the terrain. I will let you guys get back to it. Quote:
The Marines...still using PRC-77's in 1997... Man if they realize it, you know it has to be bad. |
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November 1, 2018, 05:47 PM | #58 | ||
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We're on the same page that there is at least some chance of the 5.56 being retained. That was the context in which your offer for the beer was made.
My comment that you quoted was about the assertion that "even rudimentary body armor" rendered 5.56mm "completely ineffective", not about the chances of the 5.56 being retained or replaced. Quote:
Just as it is common knowledge that "rudimentary body armor" is not going to defeat rifle rounds. Quote:
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November 1, 2018, 06:17 PM | #59 | ||
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Why didn't we push the M14 as the rifle for our allies before the M16? Might be that the huge stocks of WWII and Korean war leftovers were enough to supply anti-communist forces who needed something but didn't need, or couldn't afford our "cutting edge" M14. By the time we might have reached the point where the Garands, Carbines and other WWII small arms weren't enough, we had switched to the M16, and retired the M14. How many of our allies adopted the M16, anyway? And I mean shortly after we did? or even a couple decades later? Not a lot. Lots went to the 5.56mm round, but NOT in the M16 series of rifles, they adopted rifles either of their own domestic make, or from the major world arms dealers (such as FN, H&K,etc.) So, while many nations adopted our "standard" cartridge, not so many accepted our rifle for it. My understanding the reason for the steel penetrator insert in the M855 ammo was to counter the body armor then being fielded by Warsaw Pact forces. That armor is unlikely to be found used by the terrorist guerilla forces. But there is a "low tech" body armor that is common, the Chinese style chest pack of magazine pouches full of loaded mags.
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November 2, 2018, 09:22 AM | #60 | |
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An armed conflict with N. Korea or China, any of the Baltic states, Iran, any other major player WILL involve first rate body armor. Youve gotta look into the crystal ball and predict what the NEXT conflict will be and whats needed to fight THAT. |
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November 2, 2018, 10:31 AM | #61 | |
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November 2, 2018, 05:47 PM | #62 | |
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November 2, 2018, 06:19 PM | #63 |
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Seems to me we've wandered enough in this briar patch. Rest assured that the subject will rise again.
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