Catastrophic Failure - Page 2

F. Guffey · February 12, 2019, 04:53 PM

And then there was the problem with knowing it could happen and no one believe it because it did not happen ever time.

F. Guffey

RC20 · February 12, 2019, 06:16 PM

For those that are sorry about the gun, I have a different take.

Screw the gun, is the shooter ok? If so, phew and count your blessing (by whatever power or powers you believe in)

Me? I am the only copy. I can buy a replacement for any gun I have (granted it would cost) but there is no replacing me (my mother and wife agree, phew)

disseminator · February 12, 2019, 06:41 PM

spawndn72 wrote:

Quote:

Answering questions:

Bullets were "Extreme Bullets" hardcast 158 gr LSWC with an overall length of 0.724
Not asked, but the cartridge length is 1.595
Powder was made in USA, Miles City, Montana
I was not hurt, not even a scratch. I was very lucky. I was also shooting on my property with no one around so no one else was hurt either.
Picture:

The shooter is ok.

JKP · February 12, 2019, 07:27 PM

That happened to me with my S&W model 66. It had to be a double charge of my regular load of 8.9 gr. of HS-6 with 158 lswc. I checked when I was back at the bench and a double charge will fit in the case without showing. I pulled all 250 of my other .357 loads as I didn't trust them (they were all fine). Then I tried double charges in all the other calibers I load, none will fit in the case. I was very lucky, only a small scratch on my nose and no other shooters on the range when the cylinder blew sideways! The $700 gun can be replaced, someday.

spawndn72 · February 12, 2019, 07:42 PM

Quote:

The shooter is ok.

Well, physically ok anyway. I mean let's not go crazy here. I had issues before now so...

Longshot4 · February 12, 2019, 08:18 PM

I have seen powder throwers throw charges short when the bottle is allowed to get too low. That could cause a light charge. I believe that could of caused the problem. Now you can get baffles for the throwers to give chargers more consistent charges. I personally always look into the case with good lighting before seating. Also if your in a hurry. Go jogging.

disseminator · February 12, 2019, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Well, physically ok anyway. I mean let's not go crazy here. I had issues before now so...

Haven't we all.....

rural12 · February 13, 2019, 02:08 AM

I saw a guy blow up a revolver about 2 yrs ago...I watched him load the round that destroyed the gun...IT WAS NOT A DOUBLE CHARGE...but it did the exact same thing to his revolver that you did to yours. He was using Unique powder and it was loaded in a block...he loaded 5rds and weighed each charge...I saw him weigh them. I did not pay close attention to his seating the bullets...full wadcutters. This man is an experienced reloader of thousands and thousands of rounds over many years...be careful of charging cases and seating depth if you are pushing the loads. Stuff happens...

Pathfinder45 · February 13, 2019, 02:26 PM

I would expect that this kind of event could induce a bad case of flinching. Imagine for a moment that every time you pull the trigger it could be a bomb attached to your hand.... It gives me the willies just thinking about it. I reload single-stage so I look at all powder levels of every case together and compare under a bright light. This reminds me that this could be the single most important precaution.... I don't even know how you all that have progressive equipment deal with it.

Dufus · February 13, 2019, 02:51 PM

I saw a guy shoot that had loaded 2 wadcutters into one case. It was exciting to me, but not to him.

RC20 · February 13, 2019, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Well, physically ok anyway. I mean let's not go crazy here. I had issues before now so..

Lets amend that then, the shooter was not hurt by the blown up gun.

Hopefully there is counseling for the rest (or drugs - whatever it takes)

reddog81 · February 13, 2019, 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pathfinder45

I don't even know how you all that have progressive equipment deal with it.

It's simple - look in each case before you set the bullet down. A progressive press is a much more streamlined process. You touch each case one time. Much fewer fewer opportunities for a person to introduce errors into the process assuming the press is setup correctly.

Dufus · February 13, 2019, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Much fewer fewer opportunities for a person to introduce errors into the process assuming the press is setup correctly.

Such as in this case??

dahermit · February 13, 2019, 07:18 PM

Quote:

I saw a guy blow up a revolver about 2 yrs ago...I watched him load the round that destroyed the gun...IT WAS NOT A DOUBLE CHARGE...but it did the exact same thing to his revolver that you did to yours. He was using Unique powder and it was loaded in a block...he loaded 5rds and weighed each charge...I saw him weigh them. I did not pay close attention to his seating the bullets...full wadcutters. This man is an experienced reloader of thousands and thousands of rounds over many years...be careful of charging cases and seating depth if you are pushing the loads. Stuff happens...

So...what do you attribute the cause of the blow-up to? Majic?

reddog81 · February 13, 2019, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dufus

Such as in this case??

The Dillon 550 used by the OP is manual indexing. Making fairly easy to double charge a case I suppose...

The Dillon 650 or Hornady LNL are auto indexing making it much less likely to double charge a case. None of them are fool proof but both the 650 and LNL are far easier to prevent mistakes than when running a single stage.

rural12 · February 13, 2019, 09:11 PM

Quote:

So...what do you attribute the cause of the blow-up to? Majic?

I attribute it to seating depth...as I know it was not a double charge.

You do understand that seating too deep does increase pressure....

Dufus · February 13, 2019, 09:20 PM

Normally a wad cutter is seated flush with the case mouth. How can that be too deep???

rural12 · February 13, 2019, 09:48 PM

Quote:

Normally a wad cutter is seated flush with the case mouth. How can that be too deep???

Duh...that is not too deep...but if you push it further down in the case, it increases pressure.

Y'all can think it was a double charge all you want...I really don't care what you think as I know it was not. There was another issue present...I suspect that he seated that bullet too deep...might have been a residual chunk of lead in the die that pushed it deeper and he did not notice it...not sure..but that case was not double charged. There were 2 experienced reloader's present when the cases were charged...both of us did not miss a double charge when only 5rds were loaded. As I said, I was not really paying attention when he seated the bullets...consequently, I cannot attest to that...only suspect what might have gone wrong. BTW, these were not "target" wadcutter loads...these were pretty stout loaded. First 3 shot fine...4th one, not so much...5th round powder charge was correct when pulled down after incident.

dahermit · February 13, 2019, 11:58 PM

Quote:

..might have been a residual chunk of lead in the die that pushed it deeper...

One can only speculate where that lead came from.

When I used NRA Alox 50/50, the lube would build up in the seating die over long time and a lot of loadings, but the increase in seating depth was slight and was apparent in the loaded rounds.

Also, your post begs the question, why were you hot-rodding wadcutters? I don't remember if you stated they were cast or commercially swaged wadcutters but with hollow base wadcutters, they have been known to blow the skirts off the wadcutter and leave them in the barrel. Could that have happened?

std7mag · February 14, 2019, 06:02 AM

Perhaps Unclenick and some others may remember.
Several years ago someone on here mistook Titegroup for Varget or another Hodgdon powder in his rifle.
Messed up their hand pretty good. Rifle was obviously in pieces.
Hence why only one powder on bench at a time.

While i'm glad the OP is ok, tis yet another reason i like my turret press, and if i am loading singlely i seat the bullet as soon as i put powder in each case.

jetinteriorguy · February 14, 2019, 06:04 AM

I will have to say, while blowing up my revolver resulted in some heavily revamped loading procedures, I don't feel like my flinch got any worse. I definitely don't worry every time I go to pull the trigger, I haven't even given it a second thought.

**Unclenick** · February 14, 2019, 11:19 AM

I was reloading once fired LC 30-06 cases one time and noticed that one seemed unusually heavy. I looked in with a light and saw a dark patch to the side of the flash hole. Stuck a dental pick in and loosened a 35-grain piece of lead that then dropped to the top of the shoulder where I could reach in and get it out using needle nose pliers to bend it enough to make fit through the neck. M72 loaded that way by LC. How that size and shaped piece of lead got in the case is a mystery. Luckily, too small to affect pressure appreciably. Strange things happen.

Dufus · February 14, 2019, 01:17 PM

Quote:

BTW, these were not "target" wadcutter loads...these were pretty stout loaded.

If they were pretty stout loaded, then y'all were doing so on yer own as I have never observed ANY stout loads for lead wadcutters in my 56 years of hand loading.

Can you document where the load data came from?

You have already told everyone that you don't care what any one thinks, so with that attitude, expect some more blown up hand guns. Maybe wear a glove??

Dufus · February 14, 2019, 01:20 PM

Quote:

I was reloading once fired LC 30-06 cases one time and noticed that one seemed unusually heavy. I looked in with a light and saw a dark patch to the side of the flash hole. Stuck a dental pick in and loosened a 35-grain piece of lead that then dropped to the top of the shoulder where I could reach in and get it out using needle nose pliers to bend it enough to make fit through the neck. M72 loaded that way by LC. How that size and shaped piece of lead got in the case is a mystery. Luckily, too small to affect pressure appreciably. Strange things happen.

I bought some brand new WW brass for 7x57 back around 1972. I think it was 5 or 6 boxes of 20.

I was in the process of getting ready to load them and noticed something odd about one that caught my eye.

I peeked in the case and it was half full of brass shavings. I can't begin to explain that one.

F. Guffey · February 14, 2019, 01:52 PM

Quote:

I peeked in the case and it was half full of brass shavings. I can't begin to explain that one.

If I trim a case with a pilot in the neck there is little chance the shavings will fall into the inside of the case.

My favorite method/technique for case trimming is done with a trim/form die. When using a form/trim die the case is setting upright in a forming die with nothing in the neck because the case "IS BEING SUPPORTED BY A DIE THAT SUPPORTS THE CASE BODY". After trimming the neck with a hack saw I use a file to finish. filings from the file can also drop into the case because the case is standing upright.

And then there is that thing with deburring the flash hole. It just does not seem fair because I have never found a case with burs around the flash hole, With other reloaders it seem to be one of the most talked about problem they have. I have deburring tools with those corks stuck on the pointed end, I have the tools JIC as just in case I need one but the one thing I insist on having is the little cork.

F. Guffey

February 12, 2019, 06:16 PM	#27
RC20 Senior Member Join Date: April 10, 2008 Location: Alaska Posts: 7,014	For those that are sorry about the gun, I have a different take. Screw the gun, is the shooter ok? If so, phew and count your blessing (by whatever power or powers you believe in) Me? I am the only copy. I can buy a replacement for any gun I have (granted it would cost) but there is no replacing me (my mother and wife agree, phew) __________________ Science and Facts are True whether you believe it or not

February 14, 2019, 06:02 AM	#45
std7mag Senior Member Join Date: June 23, 2013 Location: Central Taxylvania.. Posts: 3,609	Perhaps Unclenick and some others may remember. Several years ago someone on here mistook Titegroup for Varget or another Hodgdon powder in his rifle. Messed up their hand pretty good. Rifle was obviously in pieces. Hence why only one powder on bench at a time. While i'm glad the OP is ok, tis yet another reason i like my turret press, and if i am loading singlely i seat the bullet as soon as i put powder in each case. __________________ When our own government declares itself as "tyrannical", where does that leave us??!! "Januarary 6th insurrection". Funny, I didn't see a single piece of rope...

February 14, 2019, 11:19 AM	#47
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,061	I was reloading once fired LC 30-06 cases one time and noticed that one seemed unusually heavy. I looked in with a light and saw a dark patch to the side of the flash hole. Stuck a dental pick in and loosened a 35-grain piece of lead that then dropped to the top of the shoulder where I could reach in and get it out using needle nose pliers to bend it enough to make fit through the neck. M72 loaded that way by LC. How that size and shaped piece of lead got in the case is a mystery. Luckily, too small to affect pressure appreciably. Strange things happen. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

February 12, 2019, 04:53 PM	#26
F. Guffey Senior Member Join Date: July 18, 2008 Posts: 7,249	And then there was the problem with knowing it could happen and no one believe it because it did not happen ever time. F. Guffey

February 12, 2019, 07:27 PM	#29
JKP Member Join Date: May 3, 2010 Location: Colorado Springs Posts: 90	That happened to me with my S&W model 66. It had to be a double charge of my regular load of 8.9 gr. of HS-6 with 158 lswc. I checked when I was back at the bench and a double charge will fit in the case without showing. I pulled all 250 of my other .357 loads as I didn't trust them (they were all fine). Then I tried double charges in all the other calibers I load, none will fit in the case. I was very lucky, only a small scratch on my nose and no other shooters on the range when the cylinder blew sideways! The $700 gun can be replaced, someday.

February 12, 2019, 08:18 PM	#31
Longshot4 Senior Member Join Date: February 22, 2014 Posts: 868	I have seen powder throwers throw charges short when the bottle is allowed to get too low. That could cause a light charge. I believe that could of caused the problem. Now you can get baffles for the throwers to give chargers more consistent charges. I personally always look into the case with good lighting before seating. Also if your in a hurry. Go jogging.

February 13, 2019, 02:08 AM	#33
rural12 Member Join Date: November 1, 2005 Location: Vidalia Ga Posts: 50	I saw a guy blow up a revolver about 2 yrs ago...I watched him load the round that destroyed the gun...IT WAS NOT A DOUBLE CHARGE...but it did the exact same thing to his revolver that you did to yours. He was using Unique powder and it was loaded in a block...he loaded 5rds and weighed each charge...I saw him weigh them. I did not pay close attention to his seating the bullets...full wadcutters. This man is an experienced reloader of thousands and thousands of rounds over many years...be careful of charging cases and seating depth if you are pushing the loads. Stuff happens...

February 13, 2019, 02:26 PM	#34
Pathfinder45 Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2008 Posts: 3,224	I would expect that this kind of event could induce a bad case of flinching. Imagine for a moment that every time you pull the trigger it could be a bomb attached to your hand.... It gives me the willies just thinking about it. I reload single-stage so I look at all powder levels of every case together and compare under a bright light. This reminds me that this could be the single most important precaution.... I don't even know how you all that have progressive equipment deal with it.

February 13, 2019, 02:51 PM	#35
Dufus Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2014 Posts: 1,965	I saw a guy shoot that had loaded 2 wadcutters into one case. It was exciting to me, but not to him.

February 13, 2019, 09:20 PM	#42
Dufus Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2014 Posts: 1,965	Normally a wad cutter is seated flush with the case mouth. How can that be too deep???

February 14, 2019, 06:04 AM	#46
jetinteriorguy Senior Member Join Date: April 28, 2013 Posts: 3,173	I will have to say, while blowing up my revolver resulted in some heavily revamped loading procedures, I don't feel like my flinch got any worse. I definitely don't worry every time I go to pull the trigger, I haven't even given it a second thought.