9mm Puzzler - Round 2

[Aguila Blanca]

I'm past the question I raised in Round 1: https://thefiringline.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=604832

Unclenick was kind enough to crunch my reloads through Quickload, and he verified that my 4.3-grain load is not unsafe for pressure using wither the Berry's plated bullets or actual Golden saber bullets. So far, so good.

So this afternoon I loaded up an initial run of fifty of the Berry's bullets. Once I had them loaded, I dropped each round into a 9mm barrel to verify that they passed the "plunk" test. One didn't -- the bullet must have gone into the case skewed, and the case mouth scraped off some some of the plating and piled it up just beyond the case mouth. Easy fix -- knock out and discard the bullet, and reload the case.

Then, as a double check, I pulled out an EGW chamber checker. SURPRISE! NONE of my rounds fully seated. So I tried a second EGW chamber checker, and got the same result. A fired and resized case plunks nicely into the EGW chamber checker, but my loaded ammo doesn't.

So I then tried multiple rounds from two different brands of commercial 9mm ammo -- Cor-Bon, and Wilson Combat. Those also pass the plunk test in my barrel, but NONE of those rounds will fully seat in the EGW chamber checker.

Has anyone else ever encountered this?

[RC20]

Yes

[74A95]

It happens. That's why case gauges have limited use.

The real test is whether they fit in your gun's chamber. If they do, you're good to go.

Simply put, it does not matter if they fit the case gauge or not. It does matter if they fit your barrel. After all, you're shooting them from your barrel, not the cage gauge.

[std7mag]

Of all the different cartridges i load, 9mm gives me the most issues.
Part of the problem i suspect is it's worldwide use and manufacture.
Then there's the +P, and +P+ pressure specs.

As was mentioned, the final say is your chamber.

[jetinteriorguy]

One thing I did to eliminate feeding issues with 9mm was to get a Lee undersize sizing die. You can get them on Amazon, EBAY, or cheaper than dirt. Mine works great.

[Grey_Lion]

What brass headstamps are you using? Are these once fired range brass or have some or all of them been reloaded several times?

I have used thousands of Berrys plated rounds and maybe 2 or 3 did what you described with the case exposing a defect in the plating and or core and crumpling the plating. By and large, I find their stuff acceptable and will likely continue to use them in the future.

As for cases not seating - I'm with the others - if it chambers in the weapon - fire it.

For the stuff that doesn't seat - in my experience those have been bad brass - typically stuff that's been reloaded multiple times which can eventually cause case bulge.

As for bad brass - I will not reload Blazer ( even once fired ) Aguila, or Perfecta - I have found far too many bad pieces of brass w/ those headstamps and have photo documented them here in the past.

[Sequins]

I really like the undersize sizing die from lee as well. It's helpful.

The chamber gauges on the other hand are more of a guideline. If it passes the checker it's probably good, and a failure is probably bad, but the plunk test is the test that matters.

[Aguila Blanca]

Originally Posted by Grey Lion

What brass headstamps are you using? Are these once fired range brass or have some or all of them been reloaded several times?

Winchester, once-fired.

[Jim Watson]

The EGW checker does not have a throat like a barrel. If there is any bullet bearing surface ahead of the case mouth, it will not pass.
I use a Lyman 9mm because Wilson like my .45 was out of stock at Midway.

I had one gun set up for a load above standard OAL. I had a gauge recut with the same reamer as the barrel.

I only plunk to be sure my load clears the shortest throat on hand. That done, the gauge is a lot more convenient than pulling out a barrel for 100% inspection.

[mikld]

Whenever there is a "fit" issue, measure. Measure your "plunkable" handloads and compare to the factory ammo. Factory ammo sounds like it's smaller, and your handloads are still in tolerance. I haven't had much luck with case gauges, so I just use the plunk test. Once I had fits trying to get 30-06 reloads to chamber in my Wilson gauge, worked for a few weeks; new methods, new case prep, and even new dies. My Garand was my first semi-auto rifle and I just guessed a gauge was necessary. Asked about my "problem" on the CMP forum and one reply I got was "do they chamber?". They did and I went shooting. A couple hundred rounds later I found one case with a dinged rim, bent just enough to keep the round from gauging. I put my case gauges in a drawer and just plunk test my handloads, revolver, pistol and rifle...

[T. O'Heir]

Quickload is not a proper manual. Plated bullets or actual Golden saber bullets require a different load anyway. Plated bullets are NOT jacketed. They use cast bullet data.
And an EGW chamber checker is not the chamber of your pistol. Said pistol chamber, that works, is the best case gauge there is.
Failing the "plunk" test is usually caused by excessive OAL. Or the flare isn't sufficiently crimped out. Taper crimp only, of course.
I've never had any issues loading 9mm though.

[gwpercle]

Yes !
Just because they will fit in a chamber gauge doesn't mean they will fit in your guns barrel.
And the other way around is also true .
If factory ammo won't fit in your chamber "checker" but will fit in your guns barrel ... throw the checker in the trash can... it ain't working .
Always use your guns barrel to check ammo fit .
Gary

[SHR970]

EGW uses SAAMI minimum chamber spec. so it's no surprise that once fired brass doesn't go all the way after full length resizing and loading.

[stagpanther]

EGW uses SAAMI minimum chamber spec. so it's no surprise that once fired brass doesn't go all the way after full length resizing and loading.

I was going to point that out after visiting their site, but you beat me to it.

I believe what the OP is really asking for is some reassurance that his loads are safe to use--and my money is on if unclenick says his charge load is safe, it is.

[Aguila Blanca]

Actually, I was asking if anyone else has experienced ammunition that chambers properly in a gun but won't chamber in a chamber gauge. I could see that happening with my own reloads (maybe), but I was more than a little surprised when three different brands of factory ammo wouldn't "plunk" in the chamber gauge. I need to do some investigation to see if the sticking point is the mouth of the case where the bullet has expanded it during seating, or if it's the ogive of the bullet itself. Once I figure that out, I'll get in touch with George at EGW for comment.