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February 10, 2008, 11:44 AM | #1 |
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Location: Florida
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To reload or not to reload.
I reloaded many, many years ago. I didn't have the patience for the single stage press then. Now, forty years later, I'm just getting involved with IDPA, and find the 9MM ammo from Wal-Mart costing me $16.66 per 100 & I know I can reload better quality ammo. I'm finding it very expensive to shoot 400 - 600 rounds a month & would like to shoot more.
I was given some reloading equipment: die sets, scale, bullet puller, small tumbler, caliper, & trays. I'm considering the Lock-N-Load progressive. Mainly what's holding me back is the fact that the only space I can use is in my garage. I live in West Central Florida and am concerned if the climatic conditions would be a problem to reloading. I could keep some of the components inside, but the reloading equipment would be in the garage. What do you think & would the savings be worthwhile? |
February 10, 2008, 12:18 PM | #2 |
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how do you feel about rust?
Better is in the house, frankly.
Reconsider 'space'. Worth it to handload; save about 2/3rd the cost. On my bench RIGHT NOW is a Hornady L-N-L someone gave me to 'tune up'; recommend a Dillon XL650. You only buy the press once...... I have a Forster/Bonanza Co-Ax, a couple LEEs, a Lyman Crusher II, and a Dillon XL650.
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February 10, 2008, 12:40 PM | #3 |
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I like the heck out of my L&L, but that's a whole different argument. The house would be better, but, get an old freezer or refrigerator for free, put a de-humidifier in it and you have climate controlled component storage. I live in the Pacific Northwest so I deal with humidity and this works for me.
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February 10, 2008, 01:07 PM | #4 |
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store the primers and powder in the house. as long as it doesn't get too humid leaving the press and dies in the garage won't hurt them. Storing loose dies in a cabinet with a golden rod would work. put in an extension cord and put a 5W bulb in will keep it dry enough.
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February 10, 2008, 01:21 PM | #5 | |
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Patience is a virtue...
2rott--No insult intended, no facetious crack, but a much more significant thing than storing your supplies:
Quote:
With reloading ammunition, we are making a product that deals with hella hot gases, and fiendish pressures. Especially with pistol ammo, where with some powders, a double charge is easy to accomplish and to overlook, AND can have disastrous, life-threatening results, the idea is to take your time and do it right, check and double-check everything. If you've mellowed, if you are a slower and wiser man now, then to answer your question, reloading will definitely save you money, especially if you are competing regularly (and practicing in between!) If not, then the way to do it would be for you to become a stock investor, play the market, and make so much money that the expense of factory ammo is no longer a consideration. Unlike reloading, the stock market sometimes richly rewards risk takers. And even if you lose your shirt in the stock market, you won't lose your fingers, your eyes, or your life.
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God Bless America --Smokey Joe Last edited by Smokey Joe; February 10, 2008 at 01:26 PM. Reason: Clumsy wording |
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February 10, 2008, 01:49 PM | #6 |
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Smokey Joe,....I've always been a very careful & meticulous person & maybe thats why reloading wasn't for me. The pay off wasn't worth the time invested. Now being older, wiser & poorer, I think I could handle the boredom of reloading, especially going progressive, because the pay off would be greater.
Joe, no insult taken. I think it's a very good question to ask me. I've been asking myself the same one since considering reloading again. I wish I could enjoy reloading like some of you seem to, but to me it's only the means to an end. |
February 10, 2008, 02:03 PM | #7 |
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Individual choice...
2rott--Thx for the reply. As to enjoying reloading, that's a very individual thing. For myself, I began reloading as a fresh-out-of-college wage slave, to save money, period. And I did save money with reloading; could afford to shoot more.
Now a number of years down the road I do somewhat enjoy reloading; it is more than a means to an end. And the enhanced accuracy of the tuned loads is a big plus. However I still like emptying the brass more than filling it!
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February 11, 2008, 10:22 AM | #8 |
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Smokey Joe has a way of putting in to words (very eloquently) what I'm thinking at times. He addressed a very good point and I think you gave a very good answer, 2rott.
The difference between single stage and progressive loading is nothing short of monumental. And, while I've loaded single stage for 20 years and have no real aspirations to move to progressive, I wouldn't recommend single stage for anyone who's primary motivation to reload is for action pistol shooting. Hey, there's enjoyable and then there's trying to mow your lawn with scissors. I think your idea that progressive will flow much better for you in your situation is likely to be right dead on. Given your setup situation, I think you should keep your powders and primers and brass indoors, and keep your press in the garage. And if you buy a Dillon press, it won't matter if a pack of wild monkeys breaks in to the garage and fornicates with it-- Dillon will fix or replace whatever might possibly happen to it. Dillon is ridiculous in that way. If it were me, I'd find a way to come up with an indoor, climate controlled setup. Hell, in the Florida heat, you could pass out just doing the work to build the ammo. Good thing for you--most of the folks you shoot with are probably reloaders. They'll give you real-world advice on which bullets, powder, etc. Pick some brains at the next match. But ya gotta do us one favor... come back in a year and tell us if you don't find yourself actually enjoying the time spent at the loading bench these days!
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February 11, 2008, 12:25 PM | #9 | |
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WESHOOT2 said:
Quote:
I'm specifically looking at reloading 38-special/357mag. Problem is, I can buy 38s from Wal-Mart for $0.25/round. 357s are closer to $0.50. It looks like, though, that I can't get the raw materials at less than about $0.15/round. And that's assuming that I can find a way to acquire them without paying exhorbitant shipping (don't have any gun shops around here -- how far will I have to go to find competitive prices without shipping?). If I factor in shipping for the various materials, it looks like it's hard to beat $0.23/round. Now, if I reload .357s exclusively, I can be happy, knowing I'm saving 50% or more. But the 38s from Wal-Mart are awfully cheap... And I've been shooting those about 2/3 of the time. I know that if I start reloading, I'll switch completely to .357s since the cost differential isn't that high, and I prefer to shoot them so I don't get the rings on my cylinders. But I know that I *could* be shooting the factory 38s, so I know I would be fooling myself about the cost savings. It's really not a monetary tradeoff -- it's time for no ugly rings in my cylinders. I'm aware of the "ammo quality" issue, but I guess I'm much more concerned about the cost. It's my primary motivator, given that I'm a young guy, just starting out, with a growing family. The largest individual cost (if I can get around shipping/haz-mat, etc., for powder) is bullets -- how do you get bullet cost down? It looks like I'd be scraping the bottom of the barrel at $0.08 per bullet... am I missing something? Please bear in mind, I'm doing all this by reading extensively on what I would need and looking at prices online. For you who really do it -- how do you understand the cost per round? If you know I'm calculating wrong, or missing the "right" way to get materials -- please tell me! I will join your happy, hand-reloading ranks immediately! -Jephthai- |
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February 11, 2008, 12:35 PM | #10 | |
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Quote:
I've started casting my own and I can load .45 Colt cartridges for about a nickel apiece. They'd cost almost a dollar each if I had to buy them. |
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February 11, 2008, 12:43 PM | #11 |
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It's the intitial cost of setting up to reload that concerns most shooters. But if you shoot often enough, it will save you healthy sums of money.
I started out loading 38 special and 9mm for IPSC. I already had a lot of brass (the single most expensive piece of the bullet), and once you have your brass acquired, you can reload it many times over. If you shoot lead bullets, which if you're shooting IDPA or IPSC you're crazy not to use lead bullets, you further reduce your cost. If you cast your own bullets, you almost eliminate your cost--but casting is a whole nother world. Since I reload, I buy my materials in bulk to negate shipping charges. Instead of one-pound bottles of powder, I buy four/five/eight pound kegs of powder. I have a five pound keg of one make of Hogden powder that I've been using for over fifteen years and it's still over half-full. I bought in Shawnee, Kansas, during a trip, for something like $2/per pound. I buy my primers in lots of 5000, again to negate the HAZMAT charges. I buy my corncob media at the petstore for a fourth the cost of "brand name" media elsewhere, and I add regular NuFinish (a half cap every fourth or fifth load) rather than the expensive "name-brand" polishes. So when I load up a box of .38 LRN, my cost comes out to around between eight cents and ten cents per round, depending upon the type (lead) bullet I load. Same goes for my 9mm. When I get my casting setup up, running and a hardness factor I desire, my cost for loading a .38 special 158 gr SWC will drop to around three cents per round. That's $1.50 for a box of 50 brand new shiny target loads. And on my progressive, I can load up fifty rounds in less than ten minutes. Best of all, I have zero compromises. My ammo is exactly how I either want it or prefer it in terms of type and charge of powder, bullet, primer, casing and all combinations thereof. Jeff
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February 11, 2008, 01:16 PM | #12 |
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I started reloading on a single-stage press about 35 years ago. I got involved in high-volume shooting and could not keep up with my ammo usage, so I supplemented with buying reloaded ammo. After a few squib loads, I went back to loading all my own, but had to cut down on shooting because I couldn't keep up. All that ended when I bought my first progressive press. Now I reload as many as I need in an hour or less. I can set up and crank out 1000 rounds in a few hours, or load the 100 or so rounds I will need for the next day in less than half an hour. If you are involved in IDPA, I definitely recommend a progressive press, which one you get is entirely up to you.
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February 11, 2008, 02:29 PM | #13 |
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I agree with you. I started with a second hand RCBS Rock Chucker which I still have. I added a Dillon 550 progressive for volumes of pistol shells, but I still use the single stage for my rifles. I found that I can afford to be a control freak in reloading and so I do weigh each load individually. I can still load a hundred shells in a couple of hours and know for certain that they are all exactly the same.
My loading is done in the corner of our guest bedroom. If company comes, I just drape it, as all our friends know that when they enter my home, they have arrived at the Department of Homeland Security. |
February 11, 2008, 04:41 PM | #14 | |
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Quote:
Rusty
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February 11, 2008, 09:28 PM | #15 |
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Well thanks for all the good replies, including the recommendation of lead bullets. I never really thought of which bullets to use but it seems like lead will be the cheapest. Thanks again.
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February 11, 2008, 10:06 PM | #16 | |
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February 11, 2008, 11:37 PM | #17 |
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Thankyou, thankyouverymuch!
Sevens--I am deeply complimented by your comment, and would be remiss not to thank you for expressing it.
On the subject of those fiendish pressures--for me, today, Monday, is Pistol League Day, and @ the range one of the club officers was showing around a sterling example of what we reloaders try to avoid. It was a Ruger (I think a Blackhawk) .44 Magnum, which was missing the top strap to the frame and 3 chambers from the cylinder. Seems someone had fired off a reload in it which went KaBoom. The shooter was not hurt, thanks to the revolver in question having been built like a tank, but no thanks to the reloader of that ammo! The shooter just left the gun @ the range, so the officer in question kept the revolver for use in Hunter Safety classes. After the incident, someone disassembled one of the 3 cartridges left in the cylinder. It had a 230 grain jacketed bullet, and a compressed load of Bullseye powder. Ye Gods! Good example of why most reloaders will not use any reloads except their own.
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God Bless America --Smokey Joe Last edited by Smokey Joe; February 11, 2008 at 11:38 PM. Reason: Clumsy wording |
February 12, 2008, 12:46 AM | #18 | |
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February 12, 2008, 11:34 AM | #19 |
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Thanks for the encouragement and some real numbers. I've been looking at the cost of presses, etc. -- since my employer was witholding double last year, my tax situation may enable me to pick up a reloading setup.
Thanks much! -Jephthai- |
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