Ruger 77 replacement?

TruthTellers · May 20, 2017, 03:04 AM

With the Ruger Model 77 rifles in .357 and .44 Mag discontinued, is there any chance that Ruger is going to come out with a new line under the American bolt gun series for rimmed revolver cartridges?

FrankenMauser · May 20, 2017, 03:10 AM

Nope.

Reintroduction of a past product - maybe.
Replacement of the 77/-- series by something in the American line? ... Nope.

Dranrab · May 20, 2017, 08:29 AM

I think they'd sell reasonably well if Ruger priced them like Americans and they shot like Americans. I just don't see it happening though.

Snyper · May 20, 2017, 10:30 AM

I suspect they will do future runs of those rifles as long as there is enough demand.

TruthTellers · May 20, 2017, 03:03 PM

^ Is there no demand for a non-lever action rifle in .357 or .44 Mag?

Berserker · May 20, 2017, 07:41 PM

Great deal of demand for lever 357 and 44.

With shotgun states allowing straight wall cartridges, I would think those guns would be popular in bolt.

Though while fun to shoot, they are a niche. You might as well get something bigger. Lever is fast handling and considered self defense to some, where bolt is not.

Reloadron · May 20, 2017, 10:15 PM

This line of questioning comes up every now and then and it seems despite our claims the demand should exist the Ruger marketing guys apparently don't see things as we do. I have a Ruger 44 Carbine, a gun which really had a good run and when it stopped I believe the logic was Ruger could no longer build the 44 Carbine and market it for a fair price. Today when I do see those guns they run about $600 and up. Later Ruger tried several 44 Carbine variations including the lever guns all of which went out of production. I like those short handy carbine designs in the 44 Remington Magnum and the best way to get one is at a large gun show or take a chance with an auction site. I have walked some large shows with thousands of vendors and been fortunate to see a single version of any of those fine rifles.

I seriously doubt Ruger will bring any back into production.

Ron

TruthTellers · May 20, 2017, 10:48 PM

So that's it then? Revolver cartridges are lever and single shot rifles only. If that's the case, then that's the case, I guess Henry and Rossi will get my money instead. All the other bolt gun makers are losing out.

Berserker · May 20, 2017, 11:03 PM

Thompson contenders probably.

Cowboy action probably props up the levers quite a bit. But they still make other models.

fourbore · May 21, 2017, 08:03 AM

How can you all be so sure her will NEVER be a Ruger American in 44mag? They have medium and full length center fire and rimfire upto 22mag. How much trouble to split the difference and introduce a 44mag. That would probably be a $400 rifle with lot of profit and potential buyers.

The 44mag size gun might handle some other interesting new rounds ranging from 17 WSM up to 460 S&W, depending on the action size and weight. The 357, 32 mag obviously, would work if Ruger did a 44 American size gun.

I dont know any more than anyone else. But; not currently on the agenda, says little about the future.

jmr40 · May 22, 2017, 05:55 AM

The American in 450 bushmaster is being made to fill that void. I wouldn't be interested in the round, but if I lived in an area with cartridges restrictions I'd take the 450 over 44 or 357 mag any day.

Texas45 · May 22, 2017, 06:01 AM

Hope they do.
I am currently "looking" for a 77 in 357.
Have 3 lever rifles already and a 357 rifle is on the want list but not really wanting another lever.
I WILL find one eventually I can wait. But if they did reintroduce it Im in.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Sure Shot Mc Gee · May 22, 2017, 09:13 AM

Both Ruger & Remington are known for discontinuance of their firearm models over night irregardless of a models popularity. Don't see a replacement model coming any time soon.

My suggestion: OP keep checking those used gun racks. Maybe you'll get lucky.

dvdcrr · June 3, 2017, 09:49 PM

I get a little bored of the same old line. Come out with a bare bones black push feed with full diameter bolt, and it will OF Course be chambered in 223, 243,270,308,30-06.
That is why I own 270 WSM 257 Weatherby, 6mm Rem. Get tired of the same old. Even more tired of the "You should use what we use" mentality.
So yeah dismayed with Ruger shutting down the old models.

dvdcrr · June 3, 2017, 09:55 PM

Quote:

The American in 450 bushmaster is being made to fill that void. I wouldn't be interested in the round, but if I lived in an area with cartridges restrictions I'd take the 450 over 44 or 357 mag any day.

Nice! Absolutely. You dont see too many 450 Bushmaster

bamaranger · June 4, 2017, 12:00 AM

Well, Ruger did come out with the American .22/.22WMR and I see those rifles as replacements for the 77/22 series. But I do not see Ruger or anybody else coming out with bolt rifles, or semi carbines in the rimmed revolver cartridges.

I believe there is indeed a market for a modern .44 (and possibly .357) lever like their defunct 96/44. Not all those lever rifles sold by Henry, Rossi, Taurus are going to cowboy shooters, some folks are indeed hunting them.

The issue I believe, is Ruger cannot make that series and still produce the profit THEY NOW DESIRE. Similarly, Ruger could certainly produce a .44 American Ranch, and likely affordably, as cheaper production (higher profit) was what was driving the American series anyhow.....but they do not foresee the sales in sufficient numbers (in .44) to achieve the profit......they now desire.

The .450 BM cartridge is new and exotic, and also has a niche in the pistol caliber only deer states, and has the AR crowd as an driving force. I believe Ruger has decided that the rifle will sell based on those (and likely other) reasons and is producing the BM Ranch. You can get into the BM cartridge for less than $400 bucks w/ an American Ranch. The BM exceeds .44 mag ballistics by quite a bit. And most importantly, Ruger can make a BM Ranch for about the same cost they can make you one in any other American series caliber. For awhile, they will sell, and Ruger will profit....at the level they desire!

Wasn't always that way though. Ruger often made firearms because Bill Ruger Sr. said they would. The profit may not have been there AT THE LEVELS THE BEAN COUNTERS DESIRED.....but the Old Man was going to make the gun, cause it was HIS company. Old Ruger made some interesting guns, and for the most part, they are all gone. Yes, Bill Ruger made some dicey deals and comments in the recent bad years of gun law. But Bill Sr is gone, and I do not see the family name anywhere on the list of "key people" anymore.

As for reintroducing past products.....don't think so. Has New Ruger brought back any discontiued series? Don't think so. We will never see the .44 carbines of any guise (unless in the American and not likely), the N0. 3 carbine, certainly not the Old Army,....add your own favorite. I predict the Mini14/30 series is next BTW, and the No1 is not long for this world either.

Wouldn't it be nice if Ruger made the .450 BM available in their AR platform?

johnwilliamson062 · June 4, 2017, 08:42 PM

I agree with Bama Ranger except on account of the #1. I think Ruger will keep it around in the limited fashion they produce it now.

Ruger couldn't make the 77 series at a price and quality level that could compete with their competitors generally better reviewed guns. Whether current production deserves it or not many of the older Ruger rifle designs have an established history and reputation of poor accuracy. Easier to change the model than change the reputation.

bamaranger · June 5, 2017, 11:15 PM

The early 77's, and perhaps the early 77MkII's (not sure) had outsourced barrels, and there are lots of reports on marginal accuracy. But when Ruger started making their own barrels, to the best of my knoweledge, that problem was largely solved. Was their sufficient damage done in those days to stain the 77 series reputation overall? I dunno.........but I kinda doubt it.

What I think is that Ruger had a cost/effieciency advantage with their casting process for receivers, and thus could make wood and steel rifles, and later synthetic stocked rifles, with traditional screw in, headspaced barrels, and Mauser style bolt/feed system, a tad cheaper than everybody else, and realized sufficient profit to satisfy the number crunchers.

But as production costs rose (materials and labor), even with their casting process reducing the amount of machining necessary to produce a part/gun, they could not realize the profit they wanted. They first dropped the polished blue of the MkII series and gave us the Hawkeye with its matte steel. We also saw the demise of the Frontier bolt carbine in that erea as well. After that point, their engineering people went to the barrel nut design, as well as the 3 lugged bolt and plunger ejector of the American series, essentially the same budget design as the Savage, the Mossberg and I believe the new Rem price point rifle (can't think of model) All this to cut production cost, which allows them to realize more profit.

I do not have a degree or any experience in production or marketing, but look at the models that have been discontinued,and the corners cut to bring rifles to the market, and to come up with a new price point rifle, and it seems clear.

Course I could be all wrong.

May 20, 2017, 03:10 AM	#2
FrankenMauser Senior Member Join Date: August 25, 2008 Location: In the valley above the plain Posts: 13,424	Nope. Reintroduction of a past product - maybe. Replacement of the 77/-- series by something in the American line? ... Nope. __________________ Don't even try it. It's even worse than the internet would lead you to believe.

May 20, 2017, 10:30 AM	#4
Snyper Senior Member Join Date: December 16, 2013 Location: Eastern NC Posts: 3,047	I suspect they will do future runs of those rifles as long as there is enough demand. __________________ One shot, one kill

May 20, 2017, 03:03 PM	#5
TruthTellers Senior Member Join Date: October 22, 2016 Posts: 3,883	^ Is there no demand for a non-lever action rifle in .357 or .44 Mag? __________________ "We always think there's gonna be more time... then it runs out."

May 20, 2017, 10:48 PM	#8
TruthTellers Senior Member Join Date: October 22, 2016 Posts: 3,883	So that's it then? Revolver cartridges are lever and single shot rifles only. If that's the case, then that's the case, I guess Henry and Rossi will get my money instead. All the other bolt gun makers are losing out. __________________ "We always think there's gonna be more time... then it runs out."

May 22, 2017, 05:55 AM	#11
jmr40 Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 2008 Location: Georgia Posts: 10,806	The American in 450 bushmaster is being made to fill that void. I wouldn't be interested in the round, but if I lived in an area with cartridges restrictions I'd take the 450 over 44 or 357 mag any day. __________________ "If you're still doing things the same way you were doing them 10 years ago, you're doing it wrong" Winston Churchill

May 20, 2017, 03:04 AM	#1
TruthTellers Senior Member Join Date: October 22, 2016 Posts: 3,883	Ruger 77 replacement? With the Ruger Model 77 rifles in .357 and .44 Mag discontinued, is there any chance that Ruger is going to come out with a new line under the American bolt gun series for rimmed revolver cartridges? __________________ "We always think there's gonna be more time... then it runs out."

May 20, 2017, 08:29 AM	#3
Dranrab Senior Member Join Date: January 24, 2016 Location: NOLA Posts: 203	I think they'd sell reasonably well if Ruger priced them like Americans and they shot like Americans. I just don't see it happening though.

May 20, 2017, 07:41 PM	#6
Berserker Junior member Join Date: April 6, 2015 Location: WI & UP Posts: 284	Great deal of demand for lever 357 and 44. With shotgun states allowing straight wall cartridges, I would think those guns would be popular in bolt. Though while fun to shoot, they are a niche. You might as well get something bigger. Lever is fast handling and considered self defense to some, where bolt is not.

May 20, 2017, 10:15 PM	#7
Reloadron Senior Member Join Date: June 8, 2016 Location: Cleveland, Ohio Suburbs Posts: 1,750	This line of questioning comes up every now and then and it seems despite our claims the demand should exist the Ruger marketing guys apparently don't see things as we do. I have a Ruger 44 Carbine, a gun which really had a good run and when it stopped I believe the logic was Ruger could no longer build the 44 Carbine and market it for a fair price. Today when I do see those guns they run about $600 and up. Later Ruger tried several 44 Carbine variations including the lever guns all of which went out of production. I like those short handy carbine designs in the 44 Remington Magnum and the best way to get one is at a large gun show or take a chance with an auction site. I have walked some large shows with thousands of vendors and been fortunate to see a single version of any of those fine rifles. I seriously doubt Ruger will bring any back into production. Ron

May 20, 2017, 11:03 PM	#9
Berserker Junior member Join Date: April 6, 2015 Location: WI & UP Posts: 284	Thompson contenders probably. Cowboy action probably props up the levers quite a bit. But they still make other models.

May 21, 2017, 08:03 AM	#10
fourbore Senior Member Join Date: August 22, 2015 Location: new england Posts: 1,159	How can you all be so sure her will NEVER be a Ruger American in 44mag? They have medium and full length center fire and rimfire upto 22mag. How much trouble to split the difference and introduce a 44mag. That would probably be a $400 rifle with lot of profit and potential buyers. The 44mag size gun might handle some other interesting new rounds ranging from 17 WSM up to 460 S&W, depending on the action size and weight. The 357, 32 mag obviously, would work if Ruger did a 44 American size gun. I dont know any more than anyone else. But; not currently on the agenda, says little about the future.

May 22, 2017, 06:01 AM	#12
Texas45 Senior Member Join Date: October 20, 2016 Posts: 223	Hope they do. I am currently "looking" for a 77 in 357. Have 3 lever rifles already and a 357 rifle is on the want list but not really wanting another lever. I WILL find one eventually I can wait. But if they did reintroduce it Im in. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

May 22, 2017, 09:13 AM	#13
Sure Shot Mc Gee Senior Member Join Date: January 2, 2012 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,876	Both Ruger & Remington are known for discontinuance of their firearm models over night irregardless of a models popularity. Don't see a replacement model coming any time soon. My suggestion: OP keep checking those used gun racks. Maybe you'll get lucky.

June 3, 2017, 09:49 PM	#14
dvdcrr Senior Member Join Date: July 5, 2010 Posts: 665	I get a little bored of the same old line. Come out with a bare bones black push feed with full diameter bolt, and it will OF Course be chambered in 223, 243,270,308,30-06. That is why I own 270 WSM 257 Weatherby, 6mm Rem. Get tired of the same old. Even more tired of the "You should use what we use" mentality. So yeah dismayed with Ruger shutting down the old models. __________________ "All warfare is based on deception. Hence when we are able to attack we must seem unable....when using our forces we must appear inactive. When we are near we must make the enemy believe we are far away."Sun Tzu The Art of War.

June 4, 2017, 12:00 AM	#16
bamaranger Senior Member Join Date: October 9, 2009 Location: North Alabama Posts: 8,303	new Well, Ruger did come out with the American .22/.22WMR and I see those rifles as replacements for the 77/22 series. But I do not see Ruger or anybody else coming out with bolt rifles, or semi carbines in the rimmed revolver cartridges. I believe there is indeed a market for a modern .44 (and possibly .357) lever like their defunct 96/44. Not all those lever rifles sold by Henry, Rossi, Taurus are going to cowboy shooters, some folks are indeed hunting them. The issue I believe, is Ruger cannot make that series and still produce the profit THEY NOW DESIRE. Similarly, Ruger could certainly produce a .44 American Ranch, and likely affordably, as cheaper production (higher profit) was what was driving the American series anyhow.....but they do not foresee the sales in sufficient numbers (in .44) to achieve the profit......they now desire. The .450 BM cartridge is new and exotic, and also has a niche in the pistol caliber only deer states, and has the AR crowd as an driving force. I believe Ruger has decided that the rifle will sell based on those (and likely other) reasons and is producing the BM Ranch. You can get into the BM cartridge for less than $400 bucks w/ an American Ranch. The BM exceeds .44 mag ballistics by quite a bit. And most importantly, Ruger can make a BM Ranch for about the same cost they can make you one in any other American series caliber. For awhile, they will sell, and Ruger will profit....at the level they desire! Wasn't always that way though. Ruger often made firearms because Bill Ruger Sr. said they would. The profit may not have been there AT THE LEVELS THE BEAN COUNTERS DESIRED.....but the Old Man was going to make the gun, cause it was HIS company. Old Ruger made some interesting guns, and for the most part, they are all gone. Yes, Bill Ruger made some dicey deals and comments in the recent bad years of gun law. But Bill Sr is gone, and I do not see the family name anywhere on the list of "key people" anymore. As for reintroducing past products.....don't think so. Has New Ruger brought back any discontiued series? Don't think so. We will never see the .44 carbines of any guise (unless in the American and not likely), the N0. 3 carbine, certainly not the Old Army,....add your own favorite. I predict the Mini14/30 series is next BTW, and the No1 is not long for this world either. Wouldn't it be nice if Ruger made the .450 BM available in their AR platform?

June 4, 2017, 08:42 PM	#17
johnwilliamson062 Junior member Join Date: May 16, 2008 Posts: 9,995	I agree with Bama Ranger except on account of the #1. I think Ruger will keep it around in the limited fashion they produce it now. Ruger couldn't make the 77 series at a price and quality level that could compete with their competitors generally better reviewed guns. Whether current production deserves it or not many of the older Ruger rifle designs have an established history and reputation of poor accuracy. Easier to change the model than change the reputation.

June 5, 2017, 11:15 PM	#18
bamaranger Senior Member Join Date: October 9, 2009 Location: North Alabama Posts: 8,303	accuracy The early 77's, and perhaps the early 77MkII's (not sure) had outsourced barrels, and there are lots of reports on marginal accuracy. But when Ruger started making their own barrels, to the best of my knoweledge, that problem was largely solved. Was their sufficient damage done in those days to stain the 77 series reputation overall? I dunno.........but I kinda doubt it. What I think is that Ruger had a cost/effieciency advantage with their casting process for receivers, and thus could make wood and steel rifles, and later synthetic stocked rifles, with traditional screw in, headspaced barrels, and Mauser style bolt/feed system, a tad cheaper than everybody else, and realized sufficient profit to satisfy the number crunchers. But as production costs rose (materials and labor), even with their casting process reducing the amount of machining necessary to produce a part/gun, they could not realize the profit they wanted. They first dropped the polished blue of the MkII series and gave us the Hawkeye with its matte steel. We also saw the demise of the Frontier bolt carbine in that erea as well. After that point, their engineering people went to the barrel nut design, as well as the 3 lugged bolt and plunger ejector of the American series, essentially the same budget design as the Savage, the Mossberg and I believe the new Rem price point rifle (can't think of model) All this to cut production cost, which allows them to realize more profit. I do not have a degree or any experience in production or marketing, but look at the models that have been discontinued,and the corners cut to bring rifles to the market, and to come up with a new price point rifle, and it seems clear. Course I could be all wrong.