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Old May 19, 2017, 10:23 PM   #26
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You're saying it wrong. Not much, but just enough to be confusing.

What you're talking about is hammer mounted vs. frame mounted firing pins, right??

BOTH TYPES are "hammer fired".

S&W did NOT discontinue hammer fired revolvers, (at any point in time), what was discontinued was hammer mounted firing pins.

There is a difference.
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Old May 19, 2017, 10:34 PM   #27
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I explained it poorly. But Smithophiles prefer it on the hammer, not in the frame.

Wouldn't have needed so much detail on smith site.

Last edited by Berserker; May 19, 2017 at 10:44 PM.
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Old May 20, 2017, 09:46 AM   #28
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I prefer a hammer mounted firing pin, pinned barrel, recessed chambers in magums, the "square" cylinder latch and NO HOLE IN THE FRAME for a lock.

But, that's just me, and the reason I prefer those features is continuity with the past.

Quote:
Wouldn't have needed so much detail on smith site.
Perhaps not, but you're not there, you're in GENERAL HANDGUNS on TFL.


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Many S&W fans like the hammer fired revolvers, which were discontinued around 2000ish.
I think if you had posted this exact sentence on a "smith site" you would get at least as much flak there as you did here, and likely more.
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Old May 20, 2017, 09:59 AM   #29
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Not all striker fired pistols look like Austrian combat Tupperware.
True enough but funny how the things that make it to what most people carry around really do resemble that Austrian fare .

I never could warm up to a striker fired anything......it had a lot to do with an unfortunate unexpected discharge one day that nearly hit a waterbed in a downstairs bedroom

The irony is that, the one of the two guns (Shield)I settled on for carry is a striker gun....go figure.....
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Old May 20, 2017, 12:03 PM   #30
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Lock time?

Would think that hammer guns may have slower lock time than a striker gun?
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Old May 20, 2017, 12:33 PM   #31
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It should do to hammer mass.

but honestly how many of us could tell the difference?
I know Im a damn long ways off from being able to notice.
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Old May 20, 2017, 12:34 PM   #32
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Would think that hammer guns may have slower lock time than a striker gun?
That would be the amount of time it takes for the tripping of the guns sear (or similar in a striker) till ignition of the powder.

I've heard this argument. I've also read where somewhere, someone had timed a number of both and determined that some striker fired guns do have a faster lock time. However in both cases the lock times were faster than any human could notice in semi auto pistols. Far faster than a person could pull the trigger.

It may vary as well from gun to gun and model to model. It would take a considerable number of various gun to test to draw even a general conclusion. And once you do this whatta ya got?

So if "in general" it's true in practice it has no practical difference.

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Last edited by tipoc; May 20, 2017 at 12:53 PM.
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Old May 20, 2017, 02:47 PM   #33
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Buzzard Bait: Would think that hammer guns may have slower lock time than a striker gun?
By chance this occurred to me as I tried my new "Wunderhammer" this morning. The process can't be as slow as it feels. The thing shot well enough anyway, but it reminded me of a Ruger SBH with one leg of the hammer spring (or is it trigger spring ) removed. It's like you hear the hammer swooshing through the air. Small complaint though.
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Old May 20, 2017, 04:33 PM   #34
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By chance this occurred to me as I tried my new "Wunderhammer" this morning. The process can't be as slow as it feels. The thing shot well enough anyway, but it reminded me of a Ruger SBH with one leg of the hammer spring (or is it trigger spring ) removed. It's like you hear the hammer swooshing through the air. Small complaint though.
You may want to consult a doctor for your symptoms of preternatural sensitivity. Such physical hyper tenderness cannot be healthy.

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Old May 20, 2017, 05:59 PM   #35
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I've no objection to the striker fired concept, having three Glocks myself.

But I think my preference is for the superior control of the hammer-fired pistol.
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Old May 20, 2017, 06:40 PM   #36
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You may want to consult a doctor for your symptoms of preternatural sensitivity. Such physical hyper tenderness cannot be healthy.
Yes, it is quite a burden.

If you've ever fired a Ruger SBH though, you'll know just how lazy a hammerfall can be. The new autoloader...well that may be more of a perception issue. Not noticeable when live firing but dry firing, just a lot more noise and resonance giving the impression of a slow motion auto wreck.

Not a real problem in a service pistol though.
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Old May 20, 2017, 09:22 PM   #37
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And just to show how much it matters...

My Ruger SBH is my most accurate centerfire handgun.
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Old May 20, 2017, 10:15 PM   #38
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more noise and resonance giving the impression of a slow motion auto wreck.
Clearly then, flintlocks are not for you!
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Old May 20, 2017, 11:16 PM   #39
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I think my affinity for the hammer stems from my 1st real firearm. A break action single shot 20gauge NEF pardner.
I've been gently lowering a hammer on live rounds since I was 12.
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Old May 21, 2017, 02:27 AM   #40
random guy
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tallball And just to show how much it matters...

My Ruger SBH is my most accurate centerfire handgun.
Yeah, in the context of "normal" handgun use, not a real issue. Such locktime would be atrocious in a modern rifle though.

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Clearly then, flintlocks are not for you!
Somehow I've never fired a single BP round. I stand in awe of those who can do good shooting with a flintlock in particular.
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Old May 21, 2017, 07:21 AM   #41
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Score one for the single-shot shotgun! I have a Pardner in 410, 20, and the 12-guage that my dad gave me when I was young. I have hunted just about everything there is with that old thing.

Maybe that's why I prefer hammer-fired also. Two of my first firearms were a Ruger Single Six and the single-shot 12 guage.
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Old May 29, 2017, 10:54 PM   #42
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Maybe I missed it, but I haven't seen any mention of the main advantage of a hammer fired auto pistol. That is that the hammer and sear are fixed to the same solid piece of metal, the frame, and cannot get out of alignment or have the trigger pull change due to the movement of other parts.

When the striker is in the slide and the sear in the frame (the usual arrangement), trigger pull can vary depending on the relationship of the slide to the frame. At best that makes little difference; at worst, the slide fit to the frame is such that the slide is dragged along as the sear moves down to disengage in response to trigger pull. A really good trigger pull is nearly impossible since the trigger will be moving the heavy slide with its own spring pressure as well as the sear.

In addition, in order to ensure safety, the sear engagement is usually rather long, to make up for wear in the slide/frame fit, where when the sear and hammer are in the frame, the engagement can be reduced to a minimum.

Added: Just to prove there is a worse system, I cite the BHP. The sear and trigger are in the frame, but the "around the corner and down the street" trigger/sear connection manages to combine the worst of both systems.

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Old May 30, 2017, 09:39 AM   #43
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Some of the designs are better than others, but I think distinguishing between "hammer" and striker is misleading, especially when some designs basically feature a hammer hitting a striker.
Some seem to think a massive hammer is more reliable than a lighter striker, but the mass of the hammer is only part of the equation. A stronger spring and lighter striker can hit just as hard as a hammer and correct strength spring.

Slide hammer versus sledge hammed.
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Old May 30, 2017, 10:01 AM   #44
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Some of the designs are better than others, but I think distinguishing between "hammer" and striker is misleading, especially when some designs basically feature a hammer hitting a striker.
If that's the case then it's a hammer fired gun. If a hammer hits a firing pin (even if some call the firing pin a striker, which is incorrect) then it's a hammer fired gun. A striker fired gun has no hammer of any kind. An internal hammer is still a hammer. I hope this helps clarify what's being discussed.

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Old May 30, 2017, 10:48 AM   #45
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The biggest issue for me is a trust in mechanical devices, or the lack there of. Striker fired pistols have a spring loaded firing pin (called a striker) that can only be released in two ways. The way it is released in firing, by pulling the trigger and the way it is "made safe" with a decocking mechanism. I know of many?? decocking mechanisms that either failed or (and more likely) fired the chambered round through the fault of the operator. Adding another mechanism is adding another failure point. I am not saying that it is necessarily bad but it is one more thing that can fail. Mechanisms do wear and they do fail.
With a hammer I can let the hammer down on a loaded chamber in a controlled fashion to render the gun "safe". (not cleared but safe) With a double action I can then pull the trigger to fire the chambered round. There are no extra steps necessary. In fact When I am at the range my CZ is holstered with the hammer down on a loaded chamber. If I was to use the gun as a carry piece that is the way it would be carried. It is possible for the hammer to slip and fire the gun as it is lowered so I am extremely careful and aware when I lower the hammer. I could leave the hammer cocked and use the safety but there again you are relying on a mechanical device that can wear and fail. Having carried revolvers my whole life I would have to relearn my draw to release the safety before I got it on target. It is easier for me to just pull the trigger like I do with my revolver.
I do own a couple of striker fired guns - in 22LR - and I hate that I have to fire them on an empty chamber to store the gun. It is hard on the firing pin and on the rear of the chamber. The guns were both inherited and mean a great deal to me so I will never get rid of them but I have a strong dislike of striker fired pistols.
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Old May 30, 2017, 11:07 AM   #46
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I do own a couple of striker fired guns - in 22LR - and I hate that I have to fire them on an empty chamber to store the gun. It is hard on the firing pin and on the rear of the chamber. The guns were both inherited and mean a great deal to me so I will never get rid of them but I have a strong dislike of striker fired pistols.
Out of curiosity what guns are these?

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Old May 30, 2017, 11:23 AM   #47
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I hate that I have to fire them on an empty chamber to store the gun.
snap caps!

Problem solved.

cheap alternate is a fired case, inserted so that the firing pin does not strike the spot struck when the case was fired.

It cushions the firing pin fall enough to prevent damage.
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Old May 30, 2017, 11:42 AM   #48
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Shootist I am curious why you have to release the striker to store your .22 pistols. The handling practices don't change and the amount of tension on the partially or fully cocked striker spring will not effect function based on my study and experience.
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Old May 30, 2017, 11:50 AM   #49
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Length wise the striker fired appears to have an advantage. My striker fired Glock with 4" barrel has about the same length as the hammer fired Walther P5 with 3.5" barrel. Both are 9mm.
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Old May 30, 2017, 01:28 PM   #50
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I prefer hammer fired guns as I like to "ride" the hammer (or hook it on SA guns) into the holster as one more step against negligent discharge. I do keep a G29 as a compromise on that but its one more thing that leaves me worrying.
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