Patch thickness

dirtman45 · October 16, 2017, 12:05 PM

This morning my couriosity got the better of me. I had been doing a lot of research into patches and loading for my .50 cal. JB Browning smoke pole. I found a lot of reference to patches of different thicknesses being tried and the different methods of measuring. So i pulled out a dozen or so different store bought ones. I used both a set of calipers and a 1" micrometer. Both were checked with a ribbon of known thickness to check their calibration. That was as good as it gets for them. Then i measured the patches.the variance was pretty much across the board of apx. .002 between the two methods. The calipers were dead on with the labeling and the micrometer showed under size. So what i come away with is that what ever method is used should probably be mentioned when giving patch information and recording your information.
The other information is on ball and patch tightness. I have been loading the .490 balls and .015 patching as measured with my calipers and as labeled by the sellers. It takes a fair amout of pressure to run them down the bore and then another firmer press to seat them into the powder. I used a bathroom scale to see where i was and i varied between 40-50 lbs. on compressing the load. Had not measured what it takes to run the ball and patch down.
Is any of this even worthwhile or am i just looking for something to do?

Oliver Sudden · October 16, 2017, 02:49 PM

For me the right patch and ball combo is easy to push down and I just measured the approximant pressure I seat on the powder, about 30 pounds. I use the wood ram rod and never feel like it's in any danger of braking. Sorry I've never measured the patch material other then it feels right at the fabric store. That's true for any of my rifles over the last 50 years. They shoot just fine.
https://imgur.com/a/XB3u9

Irish Jack · October 16, 2017, 08:14 PM

The patches were very thick and smaller diameter balls were used. Balls were thumb started an no short starters. The Frontier hunter did use a firewall to protect the patch from blow by. Many old loaded rifles had over powder wads made from grass leaves etc. It seems they used what ever was available.
I have experimented with these loads in a .54 Rice barrel 44" long. These loads shoot well enough for hunting our fighting.

rebs · October 17, 2017, 07:43 AM

Here is a good web site for some great info. I bought the program and my groups with my New Englander went from 4 to 5" at 50 yds to 1.5". Patch lube is also very much worth looking at. I now use moose milk and take one quick barrel wipe between shots.

http://www.blackpowderrifleaccuracy.com/index.html

Gemmer · October 17, 2017, 10:32 AM

Another vote for the “Dutch” system mentioned by rebs!

October 16, 2017, 12:05 PM	#1
dirtman45 Junior Member Join Date: May 19, 2017 Posts: 12	Patch thickness This morning my couriosity got the better of me. I had been doing a lot of research into patches and loading for my .50 cal. JB Browning smoke pole. I found a lot of reference to patches of different thicknesses being tried and the different methods of measuring. So i pulled out a dozen or so different store bought ones. I used both a set of calipers and a 1" micrometer. Both were checked with a ribbon of known thickness to check their calibration. That was as good as it gets for them. Then i measured the patches.the variance was pretty much across the board of apx. .002 between the two methods. The calipers were dead on with the labeling and the micrometer showed under size. So what i come away with is that what ever method is used should probably be mentioned when giving patch information and recording your information. The other information is on ball and patch tightness. I have been loading the .490 balls and .015 patching as measured with my calipers and as labeled by the sellers. It takes a fair amout of pressure to run them down the bore and then another firmer press to seat them into the powder. I used a bathroom scale to see where i was and i varied between 40-50 lbs. on compressing the load. Had not measured what it takes to run the ball and patch down. Is any of this even worthwhile or am i just looking for something to do?

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October 16, 2017, 02:49 PM	#2
Oliver Sudden Senior Member Join Date: January 7, 2017 Location: Colorado Posts: 272	For me the right patch and ball combo is easy to push down and I just measured the approximant pressure I seat on the powder, about 30 pounds. I use the wood ram rod and never feel like it's in any danger of braking. Sorry I've never measured the patch material other then it feels right at the fabric store. That's true for any of my rifles over the last 50 years. They shoot just fine. https://imgur.com/a/XB3u9

October 16, 2017, 08:14 PM	#3
Irish Jack Member Join Date: February 26, 2017 Posts: 29	The patches were very thick and smaller diameter balls were used. Balls were thumb started an no short starters. The Frontier hunter did use a firewall to protect the patch from blow by. Many old loaded rifles had over powder wads made from grass leaves etc. It seems they used what ever was available. I have experimented with these loads in a .54 Rice barrel 44" long. These loads shoot well enough for hunting our fighting.

October 17, 2017, 07:43 AM	#4
rebs Senior Member Join Date: January 10, 2012 Posts: 3,881	Here is a good web site for some great info. I bought the program and my groups with my New Englander went from 4 to 5" at 50 yds to 1.5". Patch lube is also very much worth looking at. I now use moose milk and take one quick barrel wipe between shots. http://www.blackpowderrifleaccuracy.com/index.html

October 17, 2017, 10:32 AM	#5
Gemmer Member Join Date: November 15, 2013 Posts: 38	Another vote for the “Dutch” system mentioned by rebs!