Comments on Winchester 748?

Swamp Yankee · July 8, 2001, 10:21 AM

In the next couple of weeks I'll be making up a some .223 loads for target and varmit shooting. Typically use Speer 50 gr. TNT-HP and 52 gr Match BT-HP. In the past I've used 3031. Had good results but was never impressed with the way it metered.
Shooting buddy recommended I try 748. Ballistics look good from the data. My question how does it meter and does anyone have any comments about 748 in .223 loads either pro or con?
As always thanks in advance for the response.
Take Care

RiverRider · July 8, 2001, 01:32 PM

Hey Swamp...

I've used H-335 for years for my .223 handloading and have had very good results. I have found that it meters beautifully. I think you can expect W748 to perform virtually the same. Some folks insist that W748 and H-335 are the very same propellant. Maybe they are, but don't get ME to lyin' to ya!

I tried some 748 when I first attempted to handload for my new Model 70 in .223 Remington. I think I got my data from the Lyman 46th Edition that time. Because of my experiences with handloading for .280 Remington, I took a rather incautious approach and did not start with the lightest loads first. On my first two shots, I thought there was something wrong with my chronograph---I was getting around 3500 fps using 50-grain Nosler Ballistic Tips! "NO WAY!" I thought. When I saw the target up close, I found that the bullets were keyholing. I then decided that maybe my chrono was right, and I went home and pulled bullets on the rest of the loads I had planned to try.

Anyway, I would urge you to try some 748 for your .223. I think you'll be pleased!

dick w. holliday · July 8, 2001, 10:15 PM

26.2 grains of 748 with 55 gr FMJ has worked well in all my guns for years....Dick

Poodleshooter · July 10, 2001, 10:23 AM

748 meters great! Just make sure your powder measure is static free, as it does tend to be really clingy compared to stick powders. It is pretty temperature sensitive. I've had 55gr loads around 26.5 grains that showed mild pressure signs at cooler temperatures, blow primers on a really hot day (85+). I personally found best accuracy in my Colt around 24.5-25grains with 55-FMJ, but I was using military 5.56 cases. If it turns out that you like 748, but want to save some money- try military pulldown powder WC846. It's almost identical to WW-748 and costs $87 shipped for 8# of the stuff. www.wideners.com

George Helser · July 12, 2001, 02:50 AM

Swamp Yankee,

I have been using WW748 for many years in my AR15 SP1. I settled on WW748 after testing some IMR powders in the 70s.

I have been very happy with WW748:
- Functions well in my AR15
- Very low flash
- Good accuracy
- Very high velocity
- It meters very well

One problem I ran into is with temperature. I initially was testing in winter conditions (around freezing) and used loading data of up to 28.5 gr WW748 which showed low pressure. Years later I fired this ammo at 100F and had excess pressure with primers
popping out!
Today I load 52-55gr bullets with 27.0 gr WW748 giving 3100 fps in my AR15 and pressure is fine.

Good luck!

Regards,
George
In sunny Arizona

MIKE14 · July 12, 2001, 06:54 AM

I like using Win748 for my .223 and .308 plinking loads for the simple fact it meters so well. in a batch of 50 I've found the 748 varied only .5 gr out of my old Lee powder measure. I'd expect you would see more consistancy from a better powder measure. I've never used the 748 for match grade stuff. I have never realy tested the 748 loads so I dont know how accurate they are. Hodgon BL-C2 meters about the same as 748 also check it out as well and see which one performs the best. JMO

labgrade · July 12, 2001, 09:02 AM

Do y'all use standard small rifle primers with W748?

I've heard that it is sometimes "better" to use magnums with the ball-type powders.

Poodleshooter · July 12, 2001, 10:05 AM

I personally have never seen a need for magnum primers in any standard action length cartridges up to 30/06, regardless of powder type. Most manuals do indicate magnum primers for all ball powders, but I doubt that very many people follow that advice. The .223 just isn't voluminous enough to warrant it IMHO. I save my magnum primers for 7mmRM and similar high volume cases.

George Helser · July 13, 2001, 03:14 AM

I use standard rifle primers in 223 & 308 with WW748 ball powder. I never saw a magnum primer recommended.

Regards,
George
In sunny Arizona

mcshot · July 13, 2001, 07:12 AM

I use Rem. bench rest primers with H. Bl(c)2. They make a big difference in accuracy. I've seen recommendations to use magnum or hot primers for all ball powders and I understand match or BR primers are hotter. Works for me anyway.
mac

July 8, 2001, 10:21 AM	#1
Swamp Yankee Senior Member Join Date: November 26, 2000 Location: Northeastern Ct. Posts: 1,019	Comments on Winchester 748? In the next couple of weeks I'll be making up a some .223 loads for target and varmit shooting. Typically use Speer 50 gr. TNT-HP and 52 gr Match BT-HP. In the past I've used 3031. Had good results but was never impressed with the way it metered. Shooting buddy recommended I try 748. Ballistics look good from the data. My question how does it meter and does anyone have any comments about 748 in .223 loads either pro or con? As always thanks in advance for the response. Take Care

July 8, 2001, 01:32 PM	#2
RiverRider Senior Member Join Date: November 30, 2000 Posts: 341	Hey Swamp... I've used H-335 for years for my .223 handloading and have had very good results. I have found that it meters beautifully. I think you can expect W748 to perform virtually the same. Some folks insist that W748 and H-335 are the very same propellant. Maybe they are, but don't get ME to lyin' to ya! I tried some 748 when I first attempted to handload for my new Model 70 in .223 Remington. I think I got my data from the Lyman 46th Edition that time. Because of my experiences with handloading for .280 Remington, I took a rather incautious approach and did not start with the lightest loads first. On my first two shots, I thought there was something wrong with my chronograph---I was getting around 3500 fps using 50-grain Nosler Ballistic Tips! "NO WAY!" I thought. When I saw the target up close, I found that the bullets were keyholing. I then decided that maybe my chrono was right, and I went home and pulled bullets on the rest of the loads I had planned to try. Anyway, I would urge you to try some 748 for your .223. I think you'll be pleased! __________________ NO Compromise!

July 12, 2001, 06:54 AM	#6
MIKE14 Senior Member Join Date: November 26, 2000 Posts: 147	I like using Win748 for my .223 and .308 plinking loads for the simple fact it meters so well. in a batch of 50 I've found the 748 varied only .5 gr out of my old Lee powder measure. I'd expect you would see more consistancy from a better powder measure. I've never used the 748 for match grade stuff. I have never realy tested the 748 loads so I dont know how accurate they are. Hodgon BL-C2 meters about the same as 748 also check it out as well and see which one performs the best. JMO __________________ M-14 OUT

July 13, 2001, 07:12 AM	#10
mcshot Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 1999 Location: Over da bridge, Mi Posts: 754	ball powders I use Rem. bench rest primers with H. Bl(c)2. They make a big difference in accuracy. I've seen recommendations to use magnum or hot primers for all ball powders and I understand match or BR primers are hotter. Works for me anyway. mac __________________ "In my opinion, anyone pushing through anti-gun legislation is a bloody traitor and should be sent up for treason" N.H. Stuart

July 8, 2001, 10:15 PM	#3
dick w. holliday Senior Member Join Date: January 13, 2001 Location: NC Posts: 589	26.2 grains of 748 with 55 gr FMJ has worked well in all my guns for years....Dick

July 10, 2001, 10:23 AM	#4
Poodleshooter Senior Member Join Date: August 7, 2000 Location: Floating down the James River in VA Posts: 2,599	748 meters great! Just make sure your powder measure is static free, as it does tend to be really clingy compared to stick powders. It is pretty temperature sensitive. I've had 55gr loads around 26.5 grains that showed mild pressure signs at cooler temperatures, blow primers on a really hot day (85+). I personally found best accuracy in my Colt around 24.5-25grains with 55-FMJ, but I was using military 5.56 cases. If it turns out that you like 748, but want to save some money- try military pulldown powder WC846. It's almost identical to WW-748 and costs $87 shipped for 8# of the stuff. www.wideners.com

July 12, 2001, 02:50 AM	#5
George Helser Senior Member Join Date: November 25, 2000 Location: Scottsdale AZ Posts: 242	Swamp Yankee, I have been using WW748 for many years in my AR15 SP1. I settled on WW748 after testing some IMR powders in the 70s. I have been very happy with WW748: - Functions well in my AR15 - Very low flash - Good accuracy - Very high velocity - It meters very well One problem I ran into is with temperature. I initially was testing in winter conditions (around freezing) and used loading data of up to 28.5 gr WW748 which showed low pressure. Years later I fired this ammo at 100F and had excess pressure with primers popping out! Today I load 52-55gr bullets with 27.0 gr WW748 giving 3100 fps in my AR15 and pressure is fine. Good luck! Regards, George In sunny Arizona

July 12, 2001, 09:02 AM	#7
labgrade Member In Memoriam Join Date: November 29, 1999 Location: west of a small town, CO Posts: 4,346	Do y'all use standard small rifle primers with W748? I've heard that it is sometimes "better" to use magnums with the ball-type powders.

July 12, 2001, 10:05 AM	#8
Poodleshooter Senior Member Join Date: August 7, 2000 Location: Floating down the James River in VA Posts: 2,599	I personally have never seen a need for magnum primers in any standard action length cartridges up to 30/06, regardless of powder type. Most manuals do indicate magnum primers for all ball powders, but I doubt that very many people follow that advice. The .223 just isn't voluminous enough to warrant it IMHO. I save my magnum primers for 7mmRM and similar high volume cases.

July 13, 2001, 03:14 AM	#9
George Helser Senior Member Join Date: November 25, 2000 Location: Scottsdale AZ Posts: 242	I use standard rifle primers in 223 & 308 with WW748 ball powder. I never saw a magnum primer recommended. Regards, George In sunny Arizona