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Old February 24, 2018, 02:16 PM   #76
Thomas Clarke
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Protecting Our Children in School

I am sure that someone will not like this response. To all of you I apologize. There are too many laws now, almost all too expensive, difficult, and impossible to enforce now. We need fewer laws and greater accountability, not more laws and more dispersal of accountability. The paid professionals in the community are accountable. Those in charge at the time should resign and be replaced by new folks who understand that the laws need to be enforced. This needs to start at the community level and go to the families of all those impacted. Once that happens the movement of accountability needs to proceed to the next largest entity until it comes to the state. Our Constitution demands this and so should all of us.
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Old February 25, 2018, 08:57 AM   #77
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I can think of hundreds of ways to fortify a school, for panic locks to all the doors, funneling all the kids into x-number of doors with metal detectors and armed guards, arming the teachers who want to be armed and willing to take the training.
And after school starts, any visitor can only obtain access via one door that lead into a room where the employees are behind bullet proof glass and they can open another door into the school via an electronic lock system.
However, if you have some crazy nut case who wants to shoot kids with whatever gun they can get a hold of, they can wait till the kids are in the parking lot. Then they can use a semi-auto up close to kill a lot, or they can find a bell tower somewhere and fire away like Whitman did years ago.
Raising the age won't stop the determined nut from getting a gun, didn't stop Lanza. More info in background checks MIGHT have stopped a shooting or two; no one can say for sure.
And if you get rid of all the guns....knives can be used. Just look to China, one guy killed 12 in a mall, a few guys killed over 33 in a station all with knives.
Or do what the guy did back in the 20s in Bath MI, blow it all up.
There is NO way to totally protect the kids or anyone for that matter. Even if there was one cop for every kid, it cannot do the job.
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Old February 25, 2018, 09:37 AM   #78
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Advertising how something is gun free and screaming come here to unleash your evil because we are a soft target sure isn’t helping.
My church and my father in law’s church, my pastor and his priest have both reached out to the congregation for ccw holders to step up and discreetly assist with security.
Time to step up. In the movie We Were Soldiers, the portrayed Joe Galloway said he was a non combatant and Sam Elliot replied that there was no such thing today...yep, time to step up.
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Old February 25, 2018, 10:15 AM   #79
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Thinking about this I made a realization about the scale of the hardening every school in the US. Doing so would likely exceed the scale of the conspicuous domestic security and site hardening accomplished in WWII. If one REALLY wanted to do it the first step would be to significantly reduce the number of sites by combining schools to central campuses.
My School district has one HS, two MS, 8 ES, and two pre-K. 13 locations.
There are nearly 130,000 schools nationwide.
https://nces.ed.gov/fastfacts/display.asp?id=84
If wikipedia is correct and there are currently approximately 1.2 million full and part time officers in the US, then 10% of the police force would be securing schools. Really more since you would need an officer from the beginning of sports at 6am to the end at 10pm and on weekends.
Just hiring new officers isn't as easy as it sounds. The closest large city recently reduced the educational requirement of officers because they were having trouble recruiting.
Nowhere close to practical.

There is nothing stopping schools from hiring armed guards now. There is nothing stopping one of you from starting an armed guard service that specializes in school protection and employs guards at reduced rates and charges the schools reduced rates. If there are all these vets willing to volunteer they should be willing to do it for minimum wage with proper liability and workman's comp insurance also. If you think a current teacher is suited to the work then a recently retired teacher should be as well. Teachers are eligible for benefits as young as 51 years old.
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Old February 26, 2018, 09:28 PM   #80
SonOfScubaDiver
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Good idea

This video clip was on my FB page the other day. This seems like a cost effective way to add a layer of protection in schools. What do y'all think?


https://www.facebook.com/cnn/videos/10158015280971509/
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Old February 26, 2018, 10:15 PM   #81
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How about when there is a school shooting the media is not allowed to publish the attackers name and/or picture? They currently plaster the guy's name and face all over the TV and Internet for at least a week and make him into a rock star. (I think that's deliberate; they *want* to encourage all the other looneys out there to do likewise because it makes good television.)

The shooters want infamy. Instead, erase them from history as if they were never born; let no one ever speak their name again or even remember what they looked like.

The fun part will be throwing some high-profile journalist in jail for violating the gag order since they have so much contempt for our Second Amendment rights; shoe is on the other foot.
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Old February 26, 2018, 11:19 PM   #82
brian33x51
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Schools should have no special status when it comes to conceal carry. People are always responsible for their own protection, that includes teachers.

Also above poster is correct. Don't give any of these idiots any fame.
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Old February 26, 2018, 11:25 PM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manta49 View Post
Then he will wait to school closing and wait outside the school.
And the state schools here require me to disarm before going up to the school itsrlf. That burns me every time.
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Old February 27, 2018, 05:48 AM   #84
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I’m sure many will disagree, but I bet if the shooter were literally drawn and quartered instead of offered a cushy cell until they are put to sleep, the next would be shooter would think twice.

I also think maybe we could look at what is done to protect schools in countries like Israel.
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Old February 27, 2018, 06:56 AM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HughScot
If someone doesn't come up with a real solution to protecting children while at school people will pass legislation that we won't like.
The President has suggested hardening schools. The opposition calls that crazy.

Yet: Judges work in "hardened" courthouses. The Congress works in a "hardened" Capitol Building. The President works in a "hardened" White House. Why is it "crazy" to suggest offering our children the same protections our elected officials enjoy?
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Old February 27, 2018, 09:33 AM   #86
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This mother just walked in like nothings happening and no nobody questioned her to prove her point. There's a pretty long video of her just walking thorough the school here in San Antonio the other day.

Clearly we need to have better security in our schools today along with ending GFZ's.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/mother-walk...ry?id=53304996
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Old February 27, 2018, 10:25 AM   #87
OzeanJaeger
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Let anyone who is employed by a School Board and works in a school (already fully background checked) carry if they have a CCW permit (additional background checks), and a NICS check when they bought their pistol.

Cost = ZERO (aside from paying the legislators we're already paying)

Good guy guns into the fight ? But, this I can tell you; a teacher who is armed (there ARE conservative teachers in our schools) and in a building with an active shooter doesn't have to decide whether to go into the building. He's already in the fight, and only has to choose to fight back to save the lives of his students and his own.

Given the choice of relying on a police officer run towards the sound of gun fire, and a teacher who being fired upon, I will trust the teacher to return fire.

You're crazy if you don't think just being shot at by an "untrained" person isn't going to ruin these psycho's mass murder fantasy, reset their OODA loop, and save lives whether the teacher even hits them or not.

No down side, all up side.
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Old February 27, 2018, 10:33 AM   #88
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We know, for a fact, that teachers, coaches, and administrators DO respond to these mass shootings - at least some of them. We hear about the heroics of those men and women after nearly every school shooting. Those who make an individual decision to be armed and commit to training should be allowed to be. A minimal pay increase to cover this increased responsibility would be a fairly low cost to show appreciation as well and encourage those on the fence. Not not every teacher should be armed and it should not be mandated. I don't know how good police training in regards to active shooters is now days in small towns but I don't think it is some golden standard from what I have heard or unattainable by those who are not police officers.
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Old February 27, 2018, 10:47 AM   #89
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I am going to make this a separate post.

Just yesterday I went to pick up my daughter from school. By LAW I had to remove my pistol which I then unloaded and locked in my truck. I went inside the school, got my child, and then walked back to my truck where I replaced my pistol in its holster.

Think this through. The state has already determined I meet the min. requirements to carry a handgun. But I may NOT carry in a school. In the extremely unlikely event a mass shooter entered the building my ability to respond effectively would have been hampered by the law itself. The very tool that could have helped an effective response would have been locked up a hundred yards or so away. We would likely be discussing my "heroic" attempt to stop someone with some improvised weapon because schools are also designed in manners that make effective flight or barricade difficult at best. And we wonder why these places become targets?

Do you think the law is really going to matter to someone who is intent on committing mass murder? Yet we assure a population within those school buildings that is much more likely to be unarmed.
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Old February 27, 2018, 11:07 AM   #90
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Quote:
How about when there is a school shooting the media is not allowed to publish the attackers name and/or picture? They currently plaster the guy's name and face all over the TV and Internet for at least a week and make him into a rock star. (I think that's deliberate; they *want* to encourage all the other looneys out there to do likewise because it makes good television.)
Won't matter because all of the kids will be uploading it live instead of running for cover
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Old February 27, 2018, 11:22 AM   #91
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Maybe we should rethink how we educate our kids. These shootings, at least for the most part, seem to involve high-school age (or thereabouts) kids in large prison-scale campuses with thousands of students in multiple buildings. What if we reversed the normal student school methods. Most places have a large number of elementary schools that feed a decent number of middle schools that feed a very few high schools. If it was reversed, the population of high schools would be small (as would class size), the campus easier to secure, everyone would have a much better chance of knowing everyone (and in more detail) so anyone about to "lose it" should be discovered early enough to prevent it from happening in the first place.

Another thing that seems to have come to light is that the school in Florida was under/not reporting behavioral incidents to keep their crime stats low. That does nothing to stop folks like these.
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Old February 27, 2018, 11:26 AM   #92
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Why not just get rid of the consolidated school districts entirely, allow schools of choice so students can move across geographic boundaries if they desire, and return entire school systems to much smaller systems. Why are rural students forced to go to school fifteen miles away in the various cities and towns with class sizes that do not represent the rural population?
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Old February 27, 2018, 11:40 AM   #93
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With the ability to go to school on-line, not just for college, but now from elementary school, why not abolish it. Between charter schools, on-line, parochial and home-schooling, a lot of wasted money could be better put to use. Getting rid of the admin overhead and unfunded mandates would allow more money for actually educating kids AND finding ways to deal with the mental issues that seem to be behind these shootings.
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Old February 27, 2018, 11:51 AM   #94
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Perhaps if the press stopped making these deranged shooters media darlings,
some of the motivation would be removed. Time and again these individuals have
mentioned their desire to be famous.
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Old February 27, 2018, 12:06 PM   #95
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Press could stop immediately, but 2000 kids with smart phones won't. It is this instantaneous in your face news that seems to help fuel some of these events unfortunately.
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Old February 27, 2018, 02:23 PM   #96
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Time to close this one. We've wandered a long way from anything gun- or even defense-related.
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