The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > Hogan's Alley > Handguns: The Semi-automatic Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old May 24, 2022, 01:56 PM   #26
TunnelRat
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 22, 2011
Posts: 11,711
Quote:
Originally Posted by kilotanker22 View Post
For example, if Glock would develop a better trigger and install fully supported chambers, I might not ever buy another handgun. But when the Walther pistols are the same price as a Glock 17, but better in every conceivable way, except for the slightly higher bore axis. It is hard to buy a Glock.
I own both a PDP and a number of Glocks. I too am thinking about buying another PDP. I wouldn’t say a PDP is better in every conceivable way.

The market has the options it does for a reason. Different people like different things and what one person likes another does not. If a product isn’t popular enough it eventually disappears, which can be bad news for the people that like it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
TunnelRat is offline  
Old May 24, 2022, 02:38 PM   #27
BornFighting88
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 1, 2021
Posts: 442
Quote:
Originally Posted by TunnelRat View Post
I own both a PDP and a number of Glocks. I too am thinking about buying another PDP. I wouldn’t say a PDP is better in every conceivable way.

The market has the options it does for a reason. Different people like different things and what one person likes another does not. If a product isn’t popular enough it eventually disappears, which can be bad news for the people that like it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Tell me that last line isn’t the honest truth. I am the one that likes oddball things, and because of that, I am on the short end of that stick. Hahah
BornFighting88 is offline  
Old May 25, 2022, 11:14 AM   #28
Pistoler0
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 15, 2019
Location: Conifer, CO
Posts: 595
Sig modular

I think that the SIG Sauer modular P320 system is actually a leap forward.

The ability to convert from one caliber to another, and to go from full size to carry sizes is exciting. I think that modularity in firearms is the future.
__________________
Life is simply an inter-temporal problem of constrained optimization.
Pistoler0 is offline  
Old May 25, 2022, 04:38 PM   #29
BornFighting88
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 1, 2021
Posts: 442
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pistoler0 View Post
I think that the SIG Sauer modular P320 system is actually a leap forward.

The ability to convert from one caliber to another, and to go from full size to carry sizes is exciting. I think that modularity in firearms is the future.
See the thread on the CZ 600. While it is a promising premise, practical applications have not panned out well for many platforms outside of the P250/P320. Even that is a rehash…. The P250 was out first, and then the P320 refined some of the rough edges of that.

Savage has a corner of the market with the nut locked barrel. End user, with proper tools, can headspace themselves.

You do see a few other companies following suit. So you have a point, for sure.
BornFighting88 is offline  
Old May 26, 2022, 08:57 AM   #30
Skans
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 20, 2008
Posts: 11,048
I have to agree that the Laugo Alien is an intriguing design. I'd like to see one in person.
Skans is offline  
Old May 26, 2022, 09:41 AM   #31
Jim Watson
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 25, 2001
Location: Alabama
Posts: 17,652
Born, you might be interested in the WMP, the Walther Magnum Pistole.
15 x .22 WRM
https://waltherarms.com/wmp/

I don't know if that qualifies as exciting, but it is a new model.
Jim Watson is offline  
Old May 27, 2022, 08:21 AM   #32
BornFighting88
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 1, 2021
Posts: 442
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Watson View Post
Born, you might be interested in the WMP, the Walther Magnum Pistole.
15 x .22 WRM
https://waltherarms.com/wmp/

I don't know if that qualifies as exciting, but it is a new model.
Jim,

I belong to Waltherforums and that place is (go figure) abuzz with talk of that pistol. Color me interested.
BornFighting88 is offline  
Old May 27, 2022, 05:16 PM   #33
Cosmodragoon
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 18, 2013
Location: Northeastern US
Posts: 1,853
The Sig P365 was a game changer. Of course, they left us DA/SA guys out in the cold.

The Sig P320 X-Ten does something similar in being a double-stack 10mm that can hold 15. Also similarly, too bad for Sig's old school DA/SA people...

If you didn't guess, I haven't been excited about new handguns in a very long time.
Cosmodragoon is offline  
Old May 29, 2022, 09:58 AM   #34
Pistoler0
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 15, 2019
Location: Conifer, CO
Posts: 595
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cosmodragoon View Post
The Sig P365 was a game changer. Of course, they left us DA/SA guys out in the cold.

The Sig P320 X-Ten does something similar in being a double-stack 10mm that can hold 15. Also similarly, too bad for Sig's old school DA/SA people...

If you didn't guess, I haven't been excited about new handguns in a very long time.
I share your disappointment in the lack of options for us DA/SA people, specially in the carry/compact segment.

I am so desperate that I am even considering the Taurus th9c.
__________________
Life is simply an inter-temporal problem of constrained optimization.
Pistoler0 is offline  
Old May 29, 2022, 09:38 PM   #35
44 AMP
Staff
 
Join Date: March 11, 2006
Location: Upper US
Posts: 25,291
Its been a long time since I was actually excited about a handgun design, and these days I see almost nothing that actually interests me, once I get a chance to examine one in my hands.

We have endless variations of long used design principles, but very little that I find actually interesting, different and weird just isn't enough, either.

The bar for commercial success is pretty high, these days. Every new design has to do something better than previously done, or at least as well, and do it at a price point competitive with long established models. AND it has to be popular enough that not only will people buy it, but they will continue to buy them, so the maker can stay in business.

There have been many really good designs (and designs with the potential to be really good) that simply were not popular enough on the commercial market to remain in production.

The market is something where the timing can matter more than the quality of the product.
__________________
All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.
44 AMP is offline  
Old May 31, 2022, 09:12 AM   #36
adamBomb
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 19, 2015
Location: coastal NC
Posts: 639
The pocket guns and micro 9mm's are awesome. I think its super exciting. So many guns that didn't exist 20 yrs ago. Finally options and gun makers going after the CCW demographic.

Now if they would just give us hammer fired, DA, and DA/SA options! Hopefully that's coming soon...
adamBomb is offline  
Old May 31, 2022, 09:57 AM   #37
Jim Watson
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 25, 2001
Location: Alabama
Posts: 17,652
Will the world embrace the FN Hiper?
https://fnherstal.com/en/defence/por...pons/fn-hiper/
https://www.events.fnherstal.com/en

Won't the odd controls be FUN to learn?
Jim Watson is offline  
Old June 1, 2022, 10:53 AM   #38
10-96
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 19, 2005
Location: Tx Panhandle Territory
Posts: 4,145
Quote:
Its been a long time since I was actually excited about a handgun design, and these days I see almost nothing that actually interests me, once I get a chance to examine one in my hands.
Same here. I do wish somebody would take another shot at that "Tri-Action Trigger" business that those Daewoo 9mm & .40S&W pistols had. I had one on .40 but I just couldn't get any appreciated level of accuracy out of it. It wasn't horrible, I just couldn't group as well with it as I did with the other .40's I'd owned- Smith & Walther P99 and EAA Witness.
__________________
Rednecks... Keeping the woods critter-free since March 2, 1836. (TX Independence Day)

I suspect a thing or two... because I've seen a thing or two.
10-96 is offline  
Old June 1, 2022, 01:32 PM   #39
seanc
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 28, 1998
Posts: 519
Innovation is still there, it's just not where you're looking: it's in new bullet designs.

The old Silver Tip/Hydra Shock designs have given way to modern Gold Dots/HST/Lehigh designs that outperform anything beyond 25+ years ago. That's just to name a few. The Gold Dots sort of straddle the tail end of that previous era, but they've also evolved since then too.
seanc is offline  
Old June 1, 2022, 09:22 PM   #40
AustinTX
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 19, 2010
Posts: 2,130
Quote:
Originally Posted by seanc View Post
Innovation is still there, it's just not where you're looking: it's in new bullet designs.
Yeah . . . but he's talking about handguns. Not bullets, or lubricants, or coffee makers, or rocket engines.
AustinTX is offline  
Old June 3, 2022, 07:04 AM   #41
Fishbed77
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 23, 2010
Posts: 4,836
Did the world embrace the following?:

Browning BDM
Forty-Nine
FNP
FNX
FNS
509
New “High Power”

I think you have your answer.

FN just can’t seem to successfully follow up the Hi-Power, no matter how hard they try.

And yeah - I’m preemptively calling the new “High Power” a failure based on its specs and price. Not sure who the market is even supposed to be for this thing.
Fishbed77 is offline  
Old June 3, 2022, 11:40 AM   #42
chadio
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 29, 2011
Posts: 922
Friend of mine had an FNP. It was among the most pleasant semi - auto pistols that I have ever fired. Myself or my friend would not hesitate to recommend the FNP / FNX to those who like a hammer - fired pistol.

I know, yesterday's news...
__________________
Ex - Navy, Persian Gulf Veteran. Loved shooting the M14, 1911, M60, M2
chadio is offline  
Old June 3, 2022, 05:00 PM   #43
dogtown tom
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 23, 2006
Location: Plano, Texas
Posts: 2,839
Quote:
Fishbed77

Did the world embrace the following?:

Browning BDM
Forty-Nine
FNP
FNX
FNS
509
New “High Power”

I think you have your answer.

FN just can’t seem to successfully follow up the Hi-Power, no matter how hard they try.

And yeah - I’m preemptively calling the new “High Power” a failure based on its specs and price. Not sure who the market is even supposed to be for this thing.
The problem with FN is FN, not their firearms. The company has for decades been an absolute failure at marketing to the civilian world.
Their Browning and Winchester subsidiaries do just fine, but give the same gun to FN and it dies. They couldn't sell ice water in hell.

For examples look at every one of those FN pistols above and note how many made it to the belts of US law enforcement. Remember when FNUSA tried selling their FN marked Hi Powers twenty years ago? I do. It was such a miserable failure that they sold thousands to CDNN to liquidate at firesale prices.....I bought several for around $400 NIB. The same HP from Browning was retailing for $699.

FN has a great history of military sales, but for some reason can't grasp the civilian market.
__________________
Need a FFL in Dallas/Plano/Allen/Frisco/McKinney ? Just EMAIL me. $20 transfers ($10 for CHL, active military,police,fire or schoolteachers)

Plano, Texas...........the Gun Nut Capitol of Gun Culture, USA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pELwCqz2JfE
dogtown tom is offline  
Old June 4, 2022, 10:19 AM   #44
tex45acp
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 18, 2005
Location: The Great State of Texas
Posts: 1,017
One of the coolest guns to ever be invented, in my opinion, especially due to the caliber is the Automag in 44mag. Don't get me wrong, the Desert Eagle is a hell of a gun, but the Automag is a real looker. I've been lucky enough to shoot them both and due to its size absorbs the recoil better than the Automag but I really like the 1911ish grip of the Automag.
__________________
“All that is required for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing.“
tex45acp is offline  
Old June 6, 2022, 08:55 AM   #45
brian33x51
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 24, 2005
Location: Denver area
Posts: 213
It seems to me that out of the box reliability of new pistols has definitely improved and prices are reasonable, not crazy. Much of the innovation comes from manufacturing technology and refinement of the pistol platform as we know it. The micro 9s are great example of this.
brian33x51 is offline  
Old June 6, 2022, 07:21 PM   #46
Alan0354
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 15, 2021
Posts: 473
Quote:
Originally Posted by brian33x51 View Post
It seems to me that out of the box reliability of new pistols has definitely improved and prices are reasonable, not crazy. Much of the innovation comes from manufacturing technology and refinement of the pistol platform as we know it. The micro 9s are great example of this.
I hope the new design like Glock is more reliable than the older ones from the 80s. NONE of my semi auto handgun except the Ruger Mark II and the Beretta 950BS are reliable. I had to do a lot of work to make them reliable. Guns include Colt Gold Cup, S&W 659 and Walther PPKS.

I did my own gun smithing, I had to reshape the extractor, polish the feed ramp and work on the ejector to make them reliable. One of the problem with the old designs is the ejector port is so small. You really have to work on the extractor and ejector to make the shell coming out within a small acceptable angle, or else, it will jam.

The worst one is the Gold Cup which is the most expensive. You won't believe how rough the inside of the gun is. But it is very accurate.

I bought a Glock 26, seems to be better, I have not fired it yet.

Last edited by Alan0354; June 6, 2022 at 07:27 PM.
Alan0354 is offline  
Old June 7, 2022, 11:27 AM   #47
pbcaster45
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 23, 2010
Posts: 120
44 AMP,

Talk about old gun designs! My 44 Auto Mag finally arrived! Very reliable and accurate when I figured out the right amount of W296 to use with the Hornady 240 grain XTP-HP.

pbcaster45 is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:13 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2021 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Page generated in 0.05906 seconds with 9 queries