Well I did it argggggggggggggggg

Wildalaska · July 28, 2009, 12:31 AM

I must of not been paying attention, my resize of the third 7.62 nagant case of the evening ended up stuck in the sizing die, with the teeny tiny rim torn off...

And its live too..yep, after priming, charging and seating that bullet way down into the case, it has to get lightly run into the sizing die again before the crimp.

So I gots me a live round stuck in the die.

Suggestions? Im tempted to clamp the die into a vise in front of the trap, take a punch and whack it. The hole for the decapper is big enough to act like a barrel

Arg...double arg.....

2nd choice, cut off the head with a dremel and take it from there....

WildwhatasuckynightAlaska TM

Skan21 · July 28, 2009, 12:33 AM

Ever heard about the Center for Army Lessons Learned? This goes into the Center for Reloading Lessons Learned, WildAlaska chapter. I'm going to remember that for when I start reloading. Tell me how you end up getting it out.

Wildalaska · July 28, 2009, 12:40 AM

Keep in mind that one NEVER puts a loaded case in a sizing die...except

I have to play with funky rounds

WildthebadwiththegoodiguessAlaska TM

steve4102 · July 28, 2009, 07:16 AM

Put it in the freezer?

**Mike Irwin** · July 28, 2009, 07:21 AM

Freezer and penetrating oil.

ZeSpectre · July 28, 2009, 07:45 AM

Wild,
I haven't done anything like that (yet) but I feel yer pain!
I was thinking Kroil and a freezer as well.

rantingredneck · July 28, 2009, 08:08 AM

Wild,

Set it up on a stand somewhere safely down range and shoot the primer with a .17HMR.......

.

Just kidding of course, but please let us know how you manage to get it unstuck.

freakshow10mm · July 28, 2009, 08:38 AM

Take the center screw out of the die. Drill the bullet through with a drill bigger than the OD of the flash hole, dump the powder out. Stick a punch down and tap the casing out with the die being held in a vise.

Happened to a local guy here that loads Nagant. That's how he does it. Don't know if it's best but works for him.

brickeyee · July 28, 2009, 08:44 AM

Quote:

Drill the bullet through with a drill bigger than the OD of the flash hole, dump the powder out.

Being sure the drill bit does not heat up enough to ignite the powder.

BAD idea.

Freezer time and hope.

freakshow10mm · July 28, 2009, 08:45 AM

It will not heat up enough to ignite anything.

goodspeed(TPF) · July 28, 2009, 08:49 AM

Find an interesting way to make it go boom. Be sure to film it for us. Make sure you are safe. -Goodspeed

Ranger325 · July 28, 2009, 08:50 AM

Send it back to the manufacturer - I hear they have great customer service and a lifetime warranty!!!

Gbro · July 28, 2009, 09:03 AM

Quote:

Suggestions? Im tempted to clamp the die into a vise in front of the trap, take a punch and whack it. The hole for the decapper is big enough to act like a barrel

If there is clearance (like you posted), use the die like a kinetic bullet puller.
OR. instead of drilling all the way through the bullet, just a pilot hole and then a washer and wood/metal screw to pull bullet.

Then you have the stuff to market a kit if it works

Farmland · July 28, 2009, 10:10 AM

I have no clue what I would do or try. It would worry the living day lights out of me that the round would go off.

Pulling the bullet sounds like the best bet, however just remember you working over the top of a live round.

If these didn't get stuck all the time I might scrap this die.

Be safe and good luck.

goodspeed(TPF) · July 28, 2009, 10:25 AM

How about clamping it in a vise at 100yds and shooting it? Both with a rifle and a camera?

P.S. Send it to me and I'll do it. (no foolin)

farmall · July 28, 2009, 12:01 PM

Walk away??? I think I'd try using the die like a kinetic puller first.
YMMV (and even detonate)!

Andy

brickeyee · July 28, 2009, 12:20 PM

Quote:

It will not heat up enough to ignite anything.

This from experience?

Or are you volunteering to do the drilling?

Do you know the ignition temperature of smokeless powder?

It is a very foolish suggestion to bring a drill near a live cartridge in a chamber.

RKG · July 28, 2009, 12:28 PM

1. Remove the lock ring and seater plug and chuck the die horizontally in a vise.

2. Construct a scatter shield between you and the work, and a mirror for indirect viewing.

3. Using a hack saw (not powered) to cut off the end of the case where it protrudes from the die.

4. Dump the powder.

5. Re-install the seater plug and seat the bullet as far as the seater plug will go down. Finish by removing the seater plug and with a piece of wood dowel or steel rod, drive the bullet all the way into the case, from which it should now fall out.

6. Run a broken shell extractor up into the case. http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=2...HELL_EXTRACTOR

7. Whole assembly in the freezer for an hour.

8. Quickly remove from freezer, install in press, work a shell holder over the case extractor rim and into the ram, hit the upper part of the die with some heat, and you should be able to remove the split case from the die.

9. Wipe brow and make sign: "loaded ammo never goes into anything but gun chamber."

Lavid2002 · July 28, 2009, 12:35 PM

what he said^

Wildalaska · July 28, 2009, 12:46 PM

What we have done so far is with a 1/16 drill bit, hand drilled the primer and we now have penetrating oil soaking it for a few hours more.

Quote:

Wipe brow and make sign: "loaded ammo never goes into anything but gun chamber."

We KNOW that already..except for funky Nagants that have to be shoved in sizing dies

WildtheburdenoffunkinessAlaska ™

mkl · July 28, 2009, 12:48 PM

First thing I'd try would be to use the die like a inertial bullet puller.

Clamp a set of vice grips around the die body, and give it a good smack over the side of your workbench. Lay a quilt on the floor so when the cartridge comes out it does not impact on a concrete floor.

**Unclenick** · July 28, 2009, 12:48 PM

A seater plug in a sizing die?

First, don't shoot the thing. The liklihood that the head will blow off and fly at you is too great.

Second, no matter what approach you take, wear a face shield and hearing protection, a welder's leather apron and gloves at a minimum. The scatter shield is a better idea.

I like the inertial puller approach, but if this is a standard sizing die and the neck has got caught in the neck sizing portion of the case it will be more like firing a round with an over-long neck jammed into the chamber throat. In other words, the bullet will go nowhere but the case might blow out backward.

Soaking the thing in Kroil is a good idea. A week's soak should succeed at creeping into the primer and killing it. There are lots of stories of that sort of thing not working, but any possible advantage should not be overlooked. It could also loosen the case.

Finally, explain more completely why are you finding you have to run a loaded round into the sizing die? The only thing that came to my mind was the case getting shortened and fattened by the pressure of the bullet seating into the neck or compressing the powder causing the base to bulge. If the first of these is so, the neck tension is probably too tight, and I would look at getting a sizing die that uses neck bushings so you can adjust that tension by choosing the right bushing. Such a bushing can be removed so your post-load sizing, if you still had to do it, could be done with nothing at all in the way of the neck and bullet.

Second, get a Redding or Forster Competition Seater die. These have a sliding sleeve that surrounds the case and should help limit or prevent bulging. Whether that works out or not, you'll probably like the accuracy improvement near-perfect bullet alignment makes.

freakshow10mm · July 28, 2009, 02:07 PM

Quote:

This from experience?

Yes.

Quote:

Or are you volunteering to do the drilling?

Yes.

Quote:

Do you know the ignition temperature of smokeless powder?

160-180 Centigrade or 320-360 Fahrenheit

Drilling into a bullet will not heat the drill up enough to boil water let alone ignite smokeless powder.

Wildalaska · July 28, 2009, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Finally, explain more completely why are you finding you have to run a loaded round into the sizing die?

Are you familiar with the 7.62 Nagant round?

WildtrustmeithastogointothesizerijustgotabitsloppyAlaska ™

freakshow10mm · July 28, 2009, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Finally, explain more completely why are you finding you have to run a loaded round into the sizing die?

He's loading the 7.62 Nagant for the Nagant revolver, the one that seals the cylinder gap upon firing by moving the cylinder forward. That is a cartridge that's a PITA to handload, due in part, because of the weird ways you have to load it such as FL sizing live rounds before you crimp them. It's just the way it is with that cartridge. No way around it.

July 28, 2009, 12:31 AM	#1
Wildalaska Junior member Join Date: November 25, 2002 Location: In my own little weird world in Anchorage, Alaska Posts: 14,172	Well I did it argggggggggggggggg I must of not been paying attention, my resize of the third 7.62 nagant case of the evening ended up stuck in the sizing die, with the teeny tiny rim torn off... And its live too..yep, after priming, charging and seating that bullet way down into the case, it has to get lightly run into the sizing die again before the crimp. So I gots me a live round stuck in the die. Suggestions? Im tempted to clamp the die into a vise in front of the trap, take a punch and whack it. The hole for the decapper is big enough to act like a barrel Arg...double arg..... 2nd choice, cut off the head with a dremel and take it from there.... WildwhatasuckynightAlaska TM

July 28, 2009, 12:33 AM	#2
Skan21 Senior Member Join Date: May 29, 2009 Location: New Hampshire Posts: 463	Ever heard about the Center for Army Lessons Learned? This goes into the Center for Reloading Lessons Learned, WildAlaska chapter. I'm going to remember that for when I start reloading. Tell me how you end up getting it out. __________________ "An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life."- Robert Heinlein Some of you guys need to trade in a few of those Safe Queens and see if you can get a good deal on a Sense of Humor.- Me

July 28, 2009, 07:21 AM	#5
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,390	Freezer and penetrating oil. __________________ "The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.

July 28, 2009, 07:45 AM	#6
ZeSpectre Senior Member Join Date: June 4, 2007 Location: Shenandoah Valley Posts: 3,276	Wild, I haven't done anything like that (yet) but I feel yer pain! I was thinking Kroil and a freezer as well. __________________ "The dogs may bark but the caravan moves on"

July 28, 2009, 08:08 AM	#7
rantingredneck Senior Member Join Date: January 12, 2007 Location: North Carolina Posts: 4,728	Wild, Set it up on a stand somewhere safely down range and shoot the primer with a .17HMR....... . Just kidding of course, but please let us know how you manage to get it unstuck. __________________ NRA Member NC Hunter's Education Instructor PCCA Member (What's PCCA you ask? <- Check the link)

July 28, 2009, 12:40 AM	#3
Wildalaska Junior member Join Date: November 25, 2002 Location: In my own little weird world in Anchorage, Alaska Posts: 14,172	Keep in mind that one NEVER puts a loaded case in a sizing die...except I have to play with funky rounds WildthebadwiththegoodiguessAlaska TM

July 28, 2009, 07:16 AM	#4
steve4102 Senior Member Join Date: December 23, 2005 Location: Minnesota Posts: 2,955	Put it in the freezer?

July 28, 2009, 08:38 AM	#8
freakshow10mm Junior member Join Date: January 23, 2008 Location: MI Posts: 1,398	Take the center screw out of the die. Drill the bullet through with a drill bigger than the OD of the flash hole, dump the powder out. Stick a punch down and tap the casing out with the die being held in a vise. Happened to a local guy here that loads Nagant. That's how he does it. Don't know if it's best but works for him.

July 28, 2009, 08:45 AM	#10
freakshow10mm Junior member Join Date: January 23, 2008 Location: MI Posts: 1,398	It will not heat up enough to ignite anything.

July 28, 2009, 08:49 AM	#11
goodspeed(TPF) Senior Member Join Date: January 19, 2009 Location: WI Posts: 1,162	Find an interesting way to make it go boom. Be sure to film it for us. Make sure you are safe. -Goodspeed __________________ It's a trick. Get an axe. http://www.thepiratefleet.com/index.shtml

July 28, 2009, 08:50 AM	#12
Ranger325 Senior Member Join Date: April 23, 2005 Location: NW Ohio Posts: 428	Send it back to the manufacturer - I hear they have great customer service and a lifetime warranty!!! __________________ Ranger325 "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf. " George Orwell

July 28, 2009, 10:10 AM	#14
Farmland Senior Member Join Date: July 5, 2009 Posts: 869	I have no clue what I would do or try. It would worry the living day lights out of me that the round would go off. Pulling the bullet sounds like the best bet, however just remember you working over the top of a live round. If these didn't get stuck all the time I might scrap this die. Be safe and good luck.

July 28, 2009, 10:25 AM	#15
goodspeed(TPF) Senior Member Join Date: January 19, 2009 Location: WI Posts: 1,162	How about clamping it in a vise at 100yds and shooting it? Both with a rifle and a camera? P.S. Send it to me and I'll do it. (no foolin) __________________ It's a trick. Get an axe. http://www.thepiratefleet.com/index.shtml

July 28, 2009, 12:01 PM	#16
farmall Senior Member Join Date: December 7, 2004 Location: Beatrice Nebraska Posts: 613	Walk away??? I think I'd try using the die like a kinetic puller first. YMMV (and even detonate)! Andy

July 28, 2009, 12:28 PM	#18
RKG Senior Member Join Date: June 18, 2009 Location: Boston Posts: 562	1. Remove the lock ring and seater plug and chuck the die horizontally in a vise. 2. Construct a scatter shield between you and the work, and a mirror for indirect viewing. 3. Using a hack saw (not powered) to cut off the end of the case where it protrudes from the die. 4. Dump the powder. 5. Re-install the seater plug and seat the bullet as far as the seater plug will go down. Finish by removing the seater plug and with a piece of wood dowel or steel rod, drive the bullet all the way into the case, from which it should now fall out. 6. Run a broken shell extractor up into the case. http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=2...HELL_EXTRACTOR 7. Whole assembly in the freezer for an hour. 8. Quickly remove from freezer, install in press, work a shell holder over the case extractor rim and into the ram, hit the upper part of the die with some heat, and you should be able to remove the split case from the die. 9. Wipe brow and make sign: "loaded ammo never goes into anything but gun chamber."

July 28, 2009, 12:35 PM	#19
Lavid2002 Senior Member Join Date: April 6, 2007 Posts: 2,568	what he said^ __________________ Math>Grammar

July 28, 2009, 12:48 PM	#21
mkl Senior Member Join Date: April 25, 2008 Location: DFW area, Texas Posts: 494	First thing I'd try would be to use the die like a inertial bullet puller. Clamp a set of vice grips around the die body, and give it a good smack over the side of your workbench. Lay a quilt on the floor so when the cartridge comes out it does not impact on a concrete floor.

July 28, 2009, 12:48 PM	#22
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,063	A seater plug in a sizing die? First, don't shoot the thing. The liklihood that the head will blow off and fly at you is too great. Second, no matter what approach you take, wear a face shield and hearing protection, a welder's leather apron and gloves at a minimum. The scatter shield is a better idea. I like the inertial puller approach, but if this is a standard sizing die and the neck has got caught in the neck sizing portion of the case it will be more like firing a round with an over-long neck jammed into the chamber throat. In other words, the bullet will go nowhere but the case might blow out backward. Soaking the thing in Kroil is a good idea. A week's soak should succeed at creeping into the primer and killing it. There are lots of stories of that sort of thing not working, but any possible advantage should not be overlooked. It could also loosen the case. Finally, explain more completely why are you finding you have to run a loaded round into the sizing die? The only thing that came to my mind was the case getting shortened and fattened by the pressure of the bullet seating into the neck or compressing the powder causing the base to bulge. If the first of these is so, the neck tension is probably too tight, and I would look at getting a sizing die that uses neck bushings so you can adjust that tension by choosing the right bushing. Such a bushing can be removed so your post-load sizing, if you still had to do it, could be done with nothing at all in the way of the neck and bullet. Second, get a Redding or Forster Competition Seater die. These have a sliding sleeve that surrounds the case and should help limit or prevent bulging. Whether that works out or not, you'll probably like the accuracy improvement near-perfect bullet alignment makes. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle Last edited by Unclenick; July 28, 2009 at 01:01 PM.