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Old June 18, 2018, 02:26 PM   #1
Metal god
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Need to improve single action trigger creep on GP-100

Good day everyone . I recently bought a GP-100 and have since polished all the inner trigger parts and changed the hammer and trigger return springs as well as shimmed the hammer . This has REALLY smoothed out the double action pull and reduced it from well over 11lbs to 8.5lbs . I'm very happy with that aspect of the work .

However I now have what I consider quite a bit of trigger creep when pulling the trigger on single action pulls . Before the work there was creep but I think it hung up enough to feel like a crisper break at a heavier weight . Now that the mating surfaces have been smoothed just a tad , I did not do much to the hammer seer . Just a couple swipes of 600 grit and a few of 1000 grit . Now when pulling real slow I can feel the trigger move well before the hammer falls . In fact I can pull the trigger , feel it move and stop and the gun does not fire . If I had to put a number on it I'd say the trigger can move at least .005 and maybe as much as .008 before the hammer releases .

I know the GP-100 is not known for it's great rigger but I have to assume there is something that can be done . I think I know what will reduce that pull but I feel I'd sand/grind/file through the hardened part of the hammer seer . This also seem like it is above my pay grade and I don't have a problem taking it to a gunsmith or send it back to Ruger . Although if I send it to Ruger my warranty will likely be voided because of the polishing and spring replacements I've done .

I'm looking to understand what's needed to be done in order to know what type of work to expect and know how to explain to whom ever does the work what I want .

Thanks ahead of time
Metal
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Last edited by Metal god; June 18, 2018 at 02:57 PM.
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Old June 18, 2018, 08:27 PM   #2
shurshot
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I bought a GP100 3" recently... between shooting an old box of Federal 125 magnums through it and plenty of dry fire (and some 3 in 1 oil), it has smoothed out nicely. Much better than when I first bought it. So much that I am not even considering any additional trigger work, aside from more dry fire. I'm pretty happy with mine.
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Old June 18, 2018, 09:08 PM   #3
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Snap! Snap! Snap! Goes the weasel!!!

(with snap caps, of course!!)

Seriously, you might find dry firing the gun smoothes it out real good like.

If not, Google "poor boy trigger job" to smooth the mating surfaces.
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Old June 18, 2018, 11:18 PM   #4
Metal god
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Sorry I might need to be more clear . I believe the problem is that the trigger is to smooth now and i can easily drag the trigger across the hammer seer . I think the mating surface of the trigger and hammer in single action has to long a distance to clear each other . I believe what i need is to shorten the surface area so it breaks quicker . ????
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If you have some time IMO this is worth a listen/watch but it takes a few minutes to really get going .
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Old June 19, 2018, 12:16 AM   #5
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Decreeping is indeed by reducing engagement. But for SA revolver, it is trickier than the others, say a auto pistol. I would suggest letting the professional to make some money.

-TL

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Old June 19, 2018, 12:27 PM   #6
T. O'Heir
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A couple swipes of sand paper does nothing. You need to polish, not sand, all the mating parts.
Just dry firing is wearing of the parts. Isn't a trigger job.
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Old June 20, 2018, 08:14 AM   #7
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No one is listening to his question.

It isn't smoothness, it's creep-ie, extra MOVEMENT.
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Old June 20, 2018, 11:11 AM   #8
Radny97
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This is a sear engagement issue. You’ll have to actually remove material on the single action sear. It’s delicate work and a mistake can really mess things up. I recommend you send it to a reputable gunsmith. Bowen, TK Custom and others can take care of you.

Don’t send to Ruger. They will just remove your after market parts like the springs and shims, and then test and tell you it’s within their specs. They don’t have a custom shop like S&W does.


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Old July 5, 2018, 03:42 AM   #9
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BTT to get some more interest .
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If you have some time IMO this is worth a listen/watch but it takes a few minutes to really get going .
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USg3NR76XpQ&t=3265s or a picture of Mohamed https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VwpwP_fIqY
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Old July 5, 2018, 02:59 PM   #10
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So you changed out the springs, added some hammer shims, polished stuff up, etc. Did you have any idea what you were doing? If you had, you would not have reduced your DA to 8.5 lbs, plus you would know how to reduce creep. I suggest a good gunsmith.
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Old July 5, 2018, 04:17 PM   #11
4V50 Gary
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Engagement point between the sear and the hammer must be attended to. I won't go into details here, but there's probably good (and bad) stuff on the interweb.
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Old July 5, 2018, 06:47 PM   #12
Metal god
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Scortch : yes i did know , i was smoothing out the trigger parts and reducing trigger pull , I thought I said that ? Are you saying I screwed something up ? Please eladerate if so , I surely don’t know everything about the firearm but do believe i accomplished what I was trying to do . The trigger creep was there before it’s just more noticeable now because everything is smoother .
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Tolerate- allow the existence, occurrence, or practice of something that one does not necessarily like or agree with , without interference.
If you have some time IMO this is worth a listen/watch but it takes a few minutes to really get going .
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USg3NR76XpQ&t=3265s or a picture of Mohamed https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VwpwP_fIqY

Last edited by Metal god; July 5, 2018 at 06:54 PM.
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Old July 5, 2018, 09:56 PM   #13
4V50 Gary
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Sounds like you increased the surface contact and thus the creep.
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Old July 5, 2018, 11:39 PM   #14
Metal god
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Quote:
Sounds like you increased the surface contact and thus the creep.
No the creep was there before . I believe that the surface between the trigger and hammer area was rough and when I pulled the trigger in single action mode it hung up a bit but when it let go it was enough to pull through the creep . That surface area is just a tad smoother and now I'm using Geissele's lube that comes with there national match triggers . So now just light pressure gets the trigger moving .

I'm not going to say impossible but it's very unlikely I created more surface area . I folded a 600 grit sand paper over a razor blade and did 3 swipes at most on the hammer sear then 4 or 5 swipes with a razor blade and 1k grit . Then did the same on the trigger . I just don't see how that could of sanded the metal down .005 or more . That's just not going to happen with a hardened metal with that fine of sand paper . I've stoned and or sanded several mil-spec AR triggers and did maybe 20x more sanding on those and removed very little material .I work with my hands doing finish work for a living , granted not metal work , I believe I had a good feel and understanding of what I was doing there .

Removing to much material is my fear and why I'm asking here what people do . What I should be asking is if a GP-100 can have a single action trigger like a good smith or 1911 . My Springfield 1911 mil-spec has a slightly better ( crisper with less creep ) then this Ruger has . I also shot my buddy's S&W revolver the other day and his trigger had zero creep , I did not feel his trigger move even when the hammer dropped .

Anyways I do think I caused the problem but not by creating more surface area but rather a smoother lighter pull that moves easier .
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Tolerate- allow the existence, occurrence, or practice of something that one does not necessarily like or agree with , without interference.
If you have some time IMO this is worth a listen/watch but it takes a few minutes to really get going .
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USg3NR76XpQ&t=3265s or a picture of Mohamed https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VwpwP_fIqY

Last edited by Metal god; July 6, 2018 at 02:50 PM.
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Old July 6, 2018, 12:23 AM   #15
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Quote:
Please eladerate if so ,
Not so sure what that means, but I suppose you want to know why I said that. In a revolver action, the relationship between parts all adds up to timing and how the action feels. Polish too much and you can cause other issues. An action job is not simply polishing metal, although that does help a bit. Smoothing an action involves maintaining the geometry of the parts and their relationship to one another. Once you have taken metal away, it cannot be added back, you have to take it off some other part in order to keep the proper timing and relationships. If you need creep removed and are not sure how to do it, take it to a smith.
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Old July 6, 2018, 12:31 AM   #16
Metal god
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Quote:
If you need creep removed and are not sure how to do it, take it to a smith.
Your right , now to find one in San Diego I trust to do the work .
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Tolerate- allow the existence, occurrence, or practice of something that one does not necessarily like or agree with , without interference.
If you have some time IMO this is worth a listen/watch but it takes a few minutes to really get going .
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USg3NR76XpQ&t=3265s or a picture of Mohamed https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VwpwP_fIqY
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Old July 6, 2018, 01:08 PM   #17
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Don't use sandpaper. Use emery stones and a vise.
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Old July 6, 2018, 02:04 PM   #18
Metal god
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Quote:
Don't use sandpaper. Use emery stones and a vise.
Thanks for the advice , will do in the future . Do they make them that thin to fit in that very small space on the hammer ? That's why I wrapped/folded the sand paper over a razor blade edge . It allowed for a very thin flat ridged surface likely not to unlike a sanding stone . I did not put the hammer in a vice and that is an excellent idea , that way at least one of the components will be fixed in place reducing the likelihood of rounding the edges .
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Tolerate- allow the existence, occurrence, or practice of something that one does not necessarily like or agree with , without interference.
If you have some time IMO this is worth a listen/watch but it takes a few minutes to really get going .
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USg3NR76XpQ&t=3265s or a picture of Mohamed https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VwpwP_fIqY

Last edited by Metal god; July 6, 2018 at 02:46 PM.
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Old July 7, 2018, 07:34 AM   #19
4V50 Gary
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The AGI video on the Colt Single Action pistol explains how to get the desirable trigger. The instructor, Bob Dunlap, was my instructor at several courses at Lassen College.
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Old July 7, 2018, 02:00 PM   #20
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MG,

The sandpaper backing has some flexibility to it, so it tends to round the edges of a surface. The only thing resembling sandpaper that I've used on engagements is microtome paper adhered to a flat surface like plate glass, a surface plate, or hardened and ground steel. It is designed for sharpening microtome blades, which have to slice off tissue samples one layer of cells at a time, so it is fairly tuned for flat material removal duty.
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Old July 7, 2018, 07:54 PM   #21
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UncleNick - that's how I was taught at Lassen to use emery paper. Generally we used stones (ditto with TSJC), a shim and a vise.
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Old July 8, 2018, 07:52 PM   #22
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Yes, and to be entirely candid, I've used wet/dry paper with spray adhesive on granite surface plates, too. Usually when cleaning up a sectioned case's edges, but I've sharpened knives and chisels that way, too.

The microtome paper differs in three ways. One is simply that it has the adhesive already, with peel-off release paper. The backing is Mylar and is thinner and harder than paper. The abrasive is remarkably aggressive. I designed a three-axis hand-held 1911 sear jig about 30 years ago based on using the "papers" adhered to a scrap of plate glass. It takes no more than ten strokes on each grade to arrive at an angle-corrected and mirror finished sear nose. However, the abrasive dulls about that quickly, too. The third correction takes a lot longer to make.

I also put thin strips of the stuff on a hardened and ground plate about 1×4 inches, with a ground recess the thickness of the papers along one edge. This I use with my Garand/M1A hammer and sear jigs to serve as a series of slip stones, but ones that work faster than normal.
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Old July 8, 2018, 08:32 PM   #23
Metal god
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Quote:
I've used wet/dry paper with spray adhesive on granite surface plates,
Now that's a good idea , maybe not for trigger work but in general to make a nice sanding block . I really like the idea of gluing the sand paper onto another flat surface , I'm going to do that in the future for sure for different sanding projects .
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Tolerate- allow the existence, occurrence, or practice of something that one does not necessarily like or agree with , without interference.
If you have some time IMO this is worth a listen/watch but it takes a few minutes to really get going .
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USg3NR76XpQ&t=3265s or a picture of Mohamed https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VwpwP_fIqY
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