Wet tumble without de-capping first.

[BondoBob]

I have been wet tumbling and de-capping first with a universal de-capping die. I want to shorten my process a bit by completing resize/decap/re-prime in one pull on my single stage press with a lee primer feeder attached. So, I'd leave the primers in during wet tumble.

My concern is could some water/moister be trapped between the primer pocket and spent primer if I do this? I don't want to foul a powder charge with a potential small amount of water trapped in there. I bake for 20 min at 225 after towel drying the brass.

I realize this is no problem with a dry media tumble but we can't do that due to asthma and allergies in the home.

Thanks,

[Shadow9mm]

I have been considering this as well recently. I have the frankford wet/dry medial separator. kind of like a salad spinner for my brass. that gets most of the water out. After that I usually dump them on a towel and shake them around in it. They they go in a cardboard box with silica gel to dry out for about 2 days.

I would think this process would work equally well with non deprimed cases. And will be trying with with my next batch of 9mm. I'm hoping it will be a good time saver.

We will find out in a few hours. Just put in about 1000 filthy 9mm casings.
15 min rinse, water, a 9mm case full of lemi shine, a dash of dawn and pins
1hr 30min with the frankford cleaning packets, with pins
flush with water to get the soap out
15 min with fresh water and a bit of diswhasher drying booster
then it will go media separator, towel, box with silica gel.

[Unclenick]

I did it a long time ago just using the old NRA vinegar and salt solution and shaking the brass in a milk jug with brass and that solution. Leaving the primer in extended the drying time by a factor of three or so, IIRC. I think the problem is that because you leave all the primer residue dust inside the primer pocket, it gets damp and holds the water well. So figure to have to use heated drying. You'll have some leaded powder residue in that same dust, and while a lot won't come out through the flash hole, you can also figure this should not be done in a food dehydrator that you actually use for food.

[nhyrum]

I often wet tumble with the primer left in. It does trap a good deal of water. 30 minutes in the oven might do the trick, you might need longer. At 225°F you're not going to do any damage to the brass almost no matter how long you leave it in there. So, if you need, you can always leave them in the oven longer.

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[Shadow9mm]

Originally Posted by Unclenick

I did it a long time ago just using the old NRA vinegar and salt solution and shaking the brass in a milk jug with brass and that solution. Leaving the primer in extended the drying time by a factor of three or so, IIRC. I think the problem is that because you leave all the primer residue dust inside the primer pocket, it gets damp and holds the water well. So figure to have to use heated drying. You'll have some leaded powder residue in that same dust, and while a lot won't come out through the flash hole, you can also figure this should not be done in a food dehydrator that you actually use for food.

I thought salt and vinegar made a weak form of sulphuric acid. I can see the extended drying time. Running some now. curious to see how long it takes.

[USSR]

Another issue in regards to doing this is that you will get a pin trapped in some of the primers. While it may be more time consuming, you are better served (and will have nice clean primer pockets) by decapping before wet tumbling.

Don

[Shadow9mm]

Originally Posted by USSR

Another issue in regards to doing this is that you will get a pin trapped in some of the primers. While it may be more time consuming, you are better served (and will have nice clean primer pockets) by decapping before wet tumbling.

Don

true, however this could be remedied by not using pins. I have not tried it as of yet, but I will probably be trying it in the near future.

[Joe-ker]

I’ll never wet tumble with primers intact again. It takes forever to dry. I want my loads as free of defects as possible, and damp cases would be a big one.

[Shadow9mm]

Originally Posted by Joe-ker

I’ll never wet tumble with primers intact again. It takes forever to dry. I want my loads as free of defects as possible, and damp cases would be a big one.

damp cases would be bad. I'm not overly worried about it. my rifle brass has to get tumbled again to get the lube off after sizing and it should dry fine. my 9mm have big enough case mouths, they will dry ok. I have a humidity gauge, I can afford to wait a few extra days if need be until it gets down to relative humidity levels. Its still less actual time on brass prep, just a touch more wait time. For small batches that I need right away I probably will punch primers. But for my bigger batches its easier to wash a few tumblers full and let them dry for a week or 2 if needed.

[Metal god]

As many know I prep in bulk 500+ at a time . I tried leaving the primers in a few times . As UN points out dry time x3 . I let the cases dry for 3 days then started sizing/decapping , about 2/3 of the way (350 cases ) there was enough water building up it was dripping down my press ram . That and primer pockets as dirty as ever maybe worse with some , I stopped trying that and just deprime first for all .

[STORM2]

Do it right the first time. Primers hide dirt and add dirt to the solution. Get them out, then tumble; otherwise the pocket will be dirty. I want my brass to look like the day it was made before I use it. I tumble after I size....every time. I don’t load pistol ammo.

[Shadow9mm]

Jerry Miculek stated he never cleaned his primer pockets, and tumbles with primers in place. Yes it looks nice. makes a difference in any other way than dry time and looks? I don't think so. Plenty of people dry tumble and get good results despite all the extra carbon inside the case that usually gets left behind. I am trying with primers in and no pins. I can afford a week or 2 of dry time if needed. Better than a full day of depriming dirty casings.

I typically prep 1000 at a time. I'm currently working through a 5gal bucket full of 223.

[MarkCO]

Originally Posted by Joe-ker

I’ll never wet tumble with primers intact again. It takes forever to dry. I want my loads as free of defects as possible, and damp cases would be a big one.

This.

And I don't use pins either. No need.

[Shadow9mm]

Originally Posted by MarkCO

This.

And I don't use pins either. No need.

I'm trying no pins currently, with dawn and lemi shine. 30min rinse with just lemi shine. and water. Then 90min with dawn and lemi shine. So far its working great, about half way through a 5 gal bucket of 223, hoping to finish today. It does seems the insides are not getting quite as clean without the pins though, but the outsides are looking amazing.

[MarkCO]

If you can find some Woolite Dark, give it a try. I use that, Lemi-Shine and cold water, no pins. It has some buffering in it that is beneficial and works a little better with cold water.

I rinse, then 2 hours with the solution, rinse, then 5 min with just cold water. Drain and dry. My dryer is a 5 gallon bucket with a 4" duct fan in the side and a 10" hydroponics bucket lid. I run a LOT at a time.

[Shadow9mm]

Originally Posted by MarkCO

If you can find some Woolite Dark, give it a try. I use that, Lemi-Shine and cold water, no pins. It has some buffering in it that is beneficial and works a little better with cold water.

I rinse, then 2 hours with the solution, rinse, then 5 min with just cold water. Drain and dry. My dryer is a 5 gallon bucket with a 4" duct fan in the side and a 10" hydroponics bucket lid. I run a LOT at a time.

I have some regular woolite on hand. Will get some woolite dark next time I'm at the store. Have the large frankford, 7qt I think. About how much woolite do you recommend adding?

[MarkCO]

About how much woolite do you recommend adding?

I add about 1/3 of the cap. I guess I should actually measure that someday. Maybe 1 ounce.

[Shadow9mm]

Originally Posted by MarkCO

I add about 1/3 of the cap. I guess I should actually measure that someday. Maybe 1 ounce.

I usually eyeball my measurements too. It's good enough for my wife's cooking. I think I put in about 2oz of regular woolite. Will see how I looks in about 90min.

[Metal god]

Lol Jerry shoots pistol at 10 yards , don’t think it matters what’s going on in his primer pockets . My bet is he throws all of his charges doesn’t turn his necks shoot cheap lead bullets etc. etc.

As much as I question Eric‘s teaching skills , in this context I would listen to him way before Jerry haha .

And for even more context Jerry uses a cement mixer to tumble his brass because he does 5gal buckets full at a time . Yeah I don’t think I would decap All of those either . He also sizes them all and tumbles again .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O5y_dsP3dsM

[Shadow9mm]

He does shoot 3 gun I believe, does some 223 rifle stuff out to 500 or so, but ringing steel at that distance is not exactly precision rifle shooting.

I usually do a 15min wet tumble after sizing to get the lanolin off. For my bulk 223 that should be enough to get the primer pockets reasonably clean. I will probably deprime first on my 308 and 30-06 since those are what I am working on in my precision loads and are a LOT smaller volume.

[Unclenick]

Originally Posted by Shadow9mm

I thought salt and vinegar made a weak form of sulphuric acid.

Neither salt nor vinegar has sulfur atoms in them so, short of a nuclear reaction, that would not be possible. BUT, even if it were possible, pickling brass in sulfuric acid is done. Obliquely related, sulfamic acid is what was in some commercial liquid cartridge brass cleaners in the past.

[Shadow9mm]

So to report. I processed approximately 5000, 1 5gal bucket full, of 223 casings without depriming first. I left the bucket open let it air dry for about 1 week. After that I put in a 2lb safe sized silica gel canister. I recharged it once a week for 3 weeks. It got the humidity in the bucket down to about 15% so I would say its dry.

Yes it took about 4 weeks total to dry. However it did save me several hours of de-priming and letting it sit and dry was pretty much zero work.

[zplinker]

I like to keep things simple, and just finished 20K 9's, using a Dillon 1050 to process. Size and decap, swage, add a Lyman M die to bell, then clean in ss media, dry overnight, and they are ready to go. It is easy to run at about 1800/hr., getting them ready to clean. Dawn, lemishine, cold water rinse, and that is it. They look like jewelry.

[Grey_Lion]

I reduced my miss-fire / hang-fire count from 3 per 10000 rounds to less than 1 per 10000 rounds after I started wet tumbling with primer out and after I switched from Winchester to CCI primers. I cannot say for certain which change made the difference. Purely from a case inspection standpoint, I have never had to ream a primer pocket clean after the change to wet tumbling with primers out. I have never had a primer " fall out " but have heard of it happening to others. I attribute that, in part, to spent primer residue holding a loose primer in when, if you had a perfectly clean case, you'd have noticed it whilst reloading and rejected the round. Some focus on speed and reload counts. I tend to focus on quality and reliability. My rounds are designed for the defense of me & mine. I do not distinguish between a carry round and a plinking round as I make them all equally good. Consider those points when coming to your process decision.

[gwpercle]

Don't let wet tumbled brass sit around for long with fired primers in the pocket ...
the moisture in the primer pocket and primer residue will cause corrosion between primer and case ... when you go to decap them the bottom of the primer will push out and leave a corroded cup ring stuck in the pocket ...and trust me , they are a devil to get out .

I used to pick up outdoor range brass , rain caused the primers to corrode in place in no time ... so be careful when wet tumbling cases with fired primers ...don't let them corrode on you .
Gary