first .308 rifle - powder questions

Trajan · December 5, 2008, 11:14 AM

just got my first ever .308 rifle. It's a Savage 10FP with a 20" heavy barrel. I have not shot it yet. I put a Nikon Buckmasters 4.5-14x40 scope on it.

I've loaded 15 test rounds so far... I'm at work now and don't have the info in front of me, but I think this is what I used:

5 rounds with Hornady 150gr bullets, FMJ BT (#3037 I think). Reloder-15 powder, a "medium" load. COL 2.78" per the Hornady book.
5 rounds with the same bullets and COL, but a different powder (IMR 4895? I can't remember)
5 rounds with Speer 165gr BT-FMJ soft point bullets, and a medium load of R-15 powder. 2.80" COL per the speer book.

I'm wondering about the 20" barrel, actually. I don't have any other rifles with that short of a barrel. Was wondering about powder recommendations and bullet recommendations for this particular rifle.

I have 40 new Rem brass cases and 100 new Lapua cases available for reloading. The only .308 bullets I currently have are 150gr hornady and 165gr speer.

Thanks for any tips!

Jim Watson · December 5, 2008, 11:46 AM

Barrel length means very little to powder and bullet choice. Re 15 and 4895 are fine for any .308.

My .308 is strictly for target shooting and it gets Sierra Match King and Lapua Scenars. I have no use for FMJs or softpoints. What is yours FOR?

Trajan · December 5, 2008, 12:02 PM

I just shoot paper. Mostly at 100 and 200 yds. Maybe occasionally at 300yds.

I plan to buy Lapua 155gr Scenar bullets once I use up the rest of the speer 165gr bullets I have.

I thought the short barrel might like certain powders (ie "not too slow"). I imagine I will lose 150fps or so compared to a 22" barrel.

this rifle will only be for target shooting, and learning how to shoot properly... I've never used sierra MKs, they are more expensive than others, and most of my rifles are just old milsurps. I may try the 155gr SMKs too.

tbtrout · December 6, 2008, 01:47 PM

I use IMR 4895. 4064 also works well.

crowbeaner · December 6, 2008, 02:01 PM

WW 748, BLC2, H380, either 4895, RL12 and RL15, and IMR4320 will do fine jobs with good bullets. There are too many good powders to detail here; that's why there are several sources of reloading manuals.

nate45 · December 6, 2008, 02:16 PM

I have used Win 748 for years, it is the powder that was originally developed for the .308. Lately I have also used Varget, it produces some good loads too.

Trajan · December 6, 2008, 03:18 PM

Quote:

There are too many good powders to detail here; that's why there are several sources of reloading manuals.

I have several reloading manuals... I wanted to get some comments from people here...

plus, the reloading manuals I have have test firearms with 22" barrels, mine as stated is a 20". I was wondering if certain powders worked better with the shorter barrel.

I may try varget, 4064 and Vihta N-140. Haven't ever used any of those.

thanks!

Sarge · December 6, 2008, 04:11 PM

The best advice I can give you is this. I have tried about every rifle powder available over the past 35 years. Some of it I bought and some were given to me by guys who were getting out of the hobby. Other than the ultra-slow (slower than 4350) rifle powders, I've probably loaded it.

It struck me as odd that I never found any H4895 in these 'cleanout' assortments and since I had read good things about it, I bought a pound. I've now tried it in everything from .223 through 30-06 and it has produced fine accuracy and often duplicates factory velocities, several tenths this side of 'max'. I can think of no better powder for modern, medium-capacity bottleneck rifle cartridges.

So you can do what I did or you can just go buy some H4895 and be done with it. It is now the only rifle powder you will find on my bench.

rn22723 · December 6, 2008, 05:28 PM

When you work up loads you need to do a stair step fashion of increasing the powder charge working up towards the max load. You are supposed to work the loads by reducing the max charge by 10percent and then work up in in say 0.5gr increments. Looking for pressure signs and of course accuracy.

You can not swap loads in and out of brass. Once you work a load up in say WW or Lapua brass you can not load it in say Fed or RP brass. The case capacity is different.

There are many things in life that are easy, and the 308 is a great cartridge to load for.
Varget and BR primers
RL15 and Fed 210M primers
IMR 4064 and 4895 along with WLR primers

For accuracy look at
Hornady 178 and 208 AMax
Nosler 155 CC, Nosler 168 CC
Sierra 175 SMK
Lapua 155 167 170LB

Trajan · December 6, 2008, 07:35 PM

thanks, rn22723. I think I'm gonna buy some bulk Lapua Scenars, either 155gr or 167gr. Does it matter in my 1:10 twist 20" barrel... I mean, does either bullet work better with that twist?

velocette · December 6, 2008, 07:41 PM

I gotta agree with Sarge. I've tried several different powders with my DPMS LR308B. Some work as well as IMR 4895 some not as well. However, when I load for the best accuracy & consistency, its the tried & true 4895 & Sierra 168gr HPBT match kings with Fed match primers, consistent sub moa groups.
It also is the powder of choice in my beloved DCM (the daddy of todays CMP) M1 Garand. It does not do too bad in my .222 Rem either.
Sometimes the old standards are old standards for a REASON. Bullseye still shoots best in my match .45 and Smith m-14 too and I have the trophies to prove it.

Happy days and Xs to ya.

Roger

totalloser · December 8, 2008, 12:32 AM

I've been having pretty good luck with military surplus wc846. A little faster burning than win748, but otherwise very similar. Use blc-2 data, and it's available for $95 bucks for 8 pound kegs from www.patsreloading.com The price is what made me switch from win748, which I think was costing me about $150 and took a slightly heavier charge. Meters very consistently, and did I mention $95 for 8 pounds?

Hard to beat.

Alaska-Bush-Man · December 9, 2008, 09:00 PM

Hands Down favorite!

Varget or Relader 15 in 308 Win

Favorite Load 308 win

45.0 Varget
168 Sierra MK
CCI Br 2 Primer
Fed GM Case

2.80" COL

Hunter0924 · December 9, 2008, 09:14 PM

For .308 Winchester I have had the best results with IMR 4895 and the 168gr Sierra Matchkings.
Federal Gold Match primers also seem to be the most consistent.

BurkGlocker · December 10, 2008, 03:56 AM

Been using H4895 with 168 gr Hornady Moly BTHP, 165 gr Sierra HPBT Gamekings and 150 gr Hornady SSTs, and I have had exceptional accuracy with all of these bullets, but I have to think it may be the powder. All of these loads will produce 1/2" groups consitently.

My favorite hunting load is with the 165 gr GKs over 42.5 grs of H4895 and WLR primers in some really nice military brass that I picked up, but they are just as accurate as my target loads though. And what else is good is that my hunting load shoots to the same POI as my target load, so no guess work there.

the_right_reverend · December 10, 2008, 04:42 AM

well your hooked now

powders that I've use....Varget works well in a variety of cartridges especially the 308....... IMR 4895 at one time was the go to for 308 close to the military Load....... IMR4064 excellent give me match accuracy in my model 12 F/TR.

The 165gr Speers worked great in my M1A1 with IMR 4895 ..... I am lucky if I get any type of group with the F/TR......

the Horn 150s grouped nice for Me

Try some Hornady 110 gr VMAX With either Varget or BenchMark.. They are cheap.... seem to bee always in stock and I got some seriously impressive dime size groups..... even impressed The USMC snipers I shoot with "never dreamed a old blind lefty can shoot like that"

December 5, 2008, 11:14 AM	#1
Trajan Member Join Date: May 19, 2007 Posts: 51	first .308 rifle - powder questions just got my first ever .308 rifle. It's a Savage 10FP with a 20" heavy barrel. I have not shot it yet. I put a Nikon Buckmasters 4.5-14x40 scope on it. I've loaded 15 test rounds so far... I'm at work now and don't have the info in front of me, but I think this is what I used: 5 rounds with Hornady 150gr bullets, FMJ BT (#3037 I think). Reloder-15 powder, a "medium" load. COL 2.78" per the Hornady book. 5 rounds with the same bullets and COL, but a different powder (IMR 4895? I can't remember) 5 rounds with Speer 165gr BT-FMJ soft point bullets, and a medium load of R-15 powder. 2.80" COL per the speer book. I'm wondering about the 20" barrel, actually. I don't have any other rifles with that short of a barrel. Was wondering about powder recommendations and bullet recommendations for this particular rifle. I have 40 new Rem brass cases and 100 new Lapua cases available for reloading. The only .308 bullets I currently have are 150gr hornady and 165gr speer. Thanks for any tips!

December 6, 2008, 02:01 PM	#5
crowbeaner Senior Member Join Date: June 4, 2007 Location: Upstate SC Posts: 1,943	WW 748, BLC2, H380, either 4895, RL12 and RL15, and IMR4320 will do fine jobs with good bullets. There are too many good powders to detail here; that's why there are several sources of reloading manuals. __________________ If you want your children to follow in your footsteps, be careful where you walk. Beware the man that only owns one gun; he probably knows how to use it. I just hope my ship comes in before my dock rots.

December 6, 2008, 02:16 PM	#6
nate45 Senior Member Join Date: July 15, 2007 Location: Illinois Posts: 3,746	I have used Win 748 for years, it is the powder that was originally developed for the .308. Lately I have also used Varget, it produces some good loads too. __________________ "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms."- Thomas Jefferson ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ (>_<)

December 6, 2008, 04:11 PM	#8
Sarge Senior Member Join Date: May 12, 2002 Location: MO Posts: 5,457	The best advice I can give you is this. I have tried about every rifle powder available over the past 35 years. Some of it I bought and some were given to me by guys who were getting out of the hobby. Other than the ultra-slow (slower than 4350) rifle powders, I've probably loaded it. It struck me as odd that I never found any H4895 in these 'cleanout' assortments and since I had read good things about it, I bought a pound. I've now tried it in everything from .223 through 30-06 and it has produced fine accuracy and often duplicates factory velocities, several tenths this side of 'max'. I can think of no better powder for modern, medium-capacity bottleneck rifle cartridges. So you can do what I did or you can just go buy some H4895 and be done with it. It is now the only rifle powder you will find on my bench. __________________ People were smarter before the Internet, or imbeciles were harder to notice.

December 6, 2008, 07:41 PM	#11
velocette Senior Member Join Date: May 25, 2007 Location: South Florida Posts: 924	I gotta agree with Sarge. I've tried several different powders with my DPMS LR308B. Some work as well as IMR 4895 some not as well. However, when I load for the best accuracy & consistency, its the tried & true 4895 & Sierra 168gr HPBT match kings with Fed match primers, consistent sub moa groups. It also is the powder of choice in my beloved DCM (the daddy of todays CMP) M1 Garand. It does not do too bad in my .222 Rem either. Sometimes the old standards are old standards for a REASON. Bullseye still shoots best in my match .45 and Smith m-14 too and I have the trophies to prove it. Happy days and Xs to ya. Roger __________________ Trigger control + Breath control + Sight alignment = Gun Control. http://www.hrpclub.info/ NRA Smallbore Prone Master, High Power Master

December 5, 2008, 11:46 AM	#2
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,541	Barrel length means very little to powder and bullet choice. Re 15 and 4895 are fine for any .308. My .308 is strictly for target shooting and it gets Sierra Match King and Lapua Scenars. I have no use for FMJs or softpoints. What is yours FOR?

December 5, 2008, 12:02 PM	#3
Trajan Member Join Date: May 19, 2007 Posts: 51	I just shoot paper. Mostly at 100 and 200 yds. Maybe occasionally at 300yds. I plan to buy Lapua 155gr Scenar bullets once I use up the rest of the speer 165gr bullets I have. I thought the short barrel might like certain powders (ie "not too slow"). I imagine I will lose 150fps or so compared to a 22" barrel. this rifle will only be for target shooting, and learning how to shoot properly... I've never used sierra MKs, they are more expensive than others, and most of my rifles are just old milsurps. I may try the 155gr SMKs too.

December 6, 2008, 01:47 PM	#4
tbtrout Senior Member Join Date: April 27, 2007 Location: New Jersey Posts: 234	I use IMR 4895. 4064 also works well.

December 6, 2008, 05:28 PM	#9
rn22723 Junior member Join Date: December 10, 2001 Location: Burbs of Minneapolis Posts: 676	When you work up loads you need to do a stair step fashion of increasing the powder charge working up towards the max load. You are supposed to work the loads by reducing the max charge by 10percent and then work up in in say 0.5gr increments. Looking for pressure signs and of course accuracy. You can not swap loads in and out of brass. Once you work a load up in say WW or Lapua brass you can not load it in say Fed or RP brass. The case capacity is different. There are many things in life that are easy, and the 308 is a great cartridge to load for. Varget and BR primers RL15 and Fed 210M primers IMR 4064 and 4895 along with WLR primers For accuracy look at Hornady 178 and 208 AMax Nosler 155 CC, Nosler 168 CC Sierra 175 SMK Lapua 155 167 170LB

December 6, 2008, 07:35 PM	#10
Trajan Member Join Date: May 19, 2007 Posts: 51	thanks, rn22723. I think I'm gonna buy some bulk Lapua Scenars, either 155gr or 167gr. Does it matter in my 1:10 twist 20" barrel... I mean, does either bullet work better with that twist?

December 8, 2008, 12:32 AM	#12
totalloser Senior Member Join Date: October 19, 2007 Location: Fort Bragg, CA Posts: 679	I've been having pretty good luck with military surplus wc846. A little faster burning than win748, but otherwise very similar. Use blc-2 data, and it's available for $95 bucks for 8 pound kegs from www.patsreloading.com The price is what made me switch from win748, which I think was costing me about $150 and took a slightly heavier charge. Meters very consistently, and did I mention $95 for 8 pounds? Hard to beat. __________________ You only truly believe in freedom if you believe in the freedom of those you disagree.

December 9, 2008, 09:00 PM	#13
Alaska-Bush-Man Junior Member Join Date: February 22, 2008 Location: North Pole, Alaska Posts: 5	Reloader 15 or Varget Hands Down favorite! Varget or Relader 15 in 308 Win Favorite Load 308 win 45.0 Varget 168 Sierra MK CCI Br 2 Primer Fed GM Case 2.80" COL

December 9, 2008, 09:14 PM	#14
Hunter0924 Senior Member Join Date: September 12, 2007 Location: North Carolina Posts: 472	For .308 Winchester I have had the best results with IMR 4895 and the 168gr Sierra Matchkings. Federal Gold Match primers also seem to be the most consistent. __________________ My firearms review site. http://rangehot.com/

December 10, 2008, 03:56 AM	#15
BurkGlocker Senior Member Join Date: May 18, 2008 Location: Sheppard AFB, TX Posts: 568	Been using H4895 with 168 gr Hornady Moly BTHP, 165 gr Sierra HPBT Gamekings and 150 gr Hornady SSTs, and I have had exceptional accuracy with all of these bullets, but I have to think it may be the powder. All of these loads will produce 1/2" groups consitently. My favorite hunting load is with the 165 gr GKs over 42.5 grs of H4895 and WLR primers in some really nice military brass that I picked up, but they are just as accurate as my target loads though. And what else is good is that my hunting load shoots to the same POI as my target load, so no guess work there.

December 10, 2008, 04:42 AM	#16
the_right_reverend Senior Member Join Date: January 19, 2008 Location: Sneads Ferry, Nc Posts: 232	well your hooked now powders that I've use....Varget works well in a variety of cartridges especially the 308....... IMR 4895 at one time was the go to for 308 close to the military Load....... IMR4064 excellent give me match accuracy in my model 12 F/TR. The 165gr Speers worked great in my M1A1 with IMR 4895 ..... I am lucky if I get any type of group with the F/TR...... the Horn 150s grouped nice for Me Try some Hornady 110 gr VMAX With either Varget or BenchMark.. They are cheap.... seem to bee always in stock and I got some seriously impressive dime size groups..... even impressed The USMC snipers I shoot with "never dreamed a old blind lefty can shoot like that" __________________ It does not take a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of men....