By their fruits shall ye know them

**Aguila Blanca** · July 10, 2019, 08:17 PM

Or, in legalese, "fruits of a poisoned tree."

https://www.lohud.com/story/news/cri...en/1692313001/

Two men arrested and charged with a variety of firearms charges in New York State are now free, because a judge ruled the police who arrested them had no probable cause to initiate the actions that led up to the arrest. As a result, the prosecutor couldn't use any of the evidence.

I'm not a lawyer but perhaps one of the lawyer types on here can provide a better explanation. The good news is that, for once, the police weren't allowed to railroad a couple of people into a conviction.

2damnold4this · July 10, 2019, 08:36 PM

What are the chances of them getting their guns back?

**Aguila Blanca** · July 10, 2019, 10:37 PM

The third person charged is a New York resident, and his case is moving forward. It's unclear (to me, anyway) if the guns can still be used as evidence against him.

To be honest, I don't understand how/why they got off. So what if they owned the guns legally in New Jersey? If I understand the article correctly, they were shooting in New York, where their possession of the guns was NOT legal.

I hope somebody smarter than I am can make some sense out of it.

7.62 man · July 10, 2019, 10:56 PM

I got a feeling there is more to this story than is being told.
I bet they were after the 3rd guy for some reason & I bet he gets the book thrown at him.
It sounds like there was some backroom deals worked out, is why the first two walked.

**Frank Ettin** · July 11, 2019, 01:52 AM

There simply isn’t enough information. As we often say, “details matter”, and we have none.

We might guess that whatever the police did, and however they did it, they somehow ran afoul of the Fourth Amendment. So perhaps they entered private property without permission, or without a warrant, or under circumstances not supporting entry without a warrant. Or the police improperly detained the subjects.

But that’s all speculative. Whatever the cops did, the judge thought they were wrong. It’ll be interesting to see if the prosecution appeals.

July 10, 2019, 08:17 PM	#1
Aguila Blanca Staff Join Date: September 25, 2008 Location: CONUS Posts: 18,460	By their fruits shall ye know them Or, in legalese, "fruits of a poisoned tree." https://www.lohud.com/story/news/cri...en/1692313001/ Two men arrested and charged with a variety of firearms charges in New York State are now free, because a judge ruled the police who arrested them had no probable cause to initiate the actions that led up to the arrest. As a result, the prosecutor couldn't use any of the evidence. I'm not a lawyer but perhaps one of the lawyer types on here can provide a better explanation. The good news is that, for once, the police weren't allowed to railroad a couple of people into a conviction.

July 11, 2019, 01:52 AM	#5
Frank Ettin Staff Join Date: November 23, 2005 Location: California - San Francisco Posts: 9,471	There simply isn’t enough information. As we often say, “details matter”, and we have none. We might guess that whatever the police did, and however they did it, they somehow ran afoul of the Fourth Amendment. So perhaps they entered private property without permission, or without a warrant, or under circumstances not supporting entry without a warrant. Or the police improperly detained the subjects. But that’s all speculative. Whatever the cops did, the judge thought they were wrong. It’ll be interesting to see if the prosecution appeals. __________________ "It is long been a principle of ours that one is no more armed because he has possession of a firearm than he is a musician because he owns a piano. There is no point in having a gun if you are not capable of using it skillfully." -- Jeff Cooper

July 10, 2019, 08:36 PM	#2
2damnold4this Senior Member Join Date: August 12, 2009 Location: Athens, Georgia Posts: 2,526	What are the chances of them getting their guns back?

July 10, 2019, 10:37 PM	#3
Aguila Blanca Staff Join Date: September 25, 2008 Location: CONUS Posts: 18,460	The third person charged is a New York resident, and his case is moving forward. It's unclear (to me, anyway) if the guns can still be used as evidence against him. To be honest, I don't understand how/why they got off. So what if they owned the guns legally in New Jersey? If I understand the article correctly, they were shooting in New York, where their possession of the guns was NOT legal. I hope somebody smarter than I am can make some sense out of it.

July 10, 2019, 10:56 PM	#4
7.62 man Senior Member Join Date: April 30, 2009 Location: Cyber-world USA Posts: 258	I got a feeling there is more to this story than is being told. I bet they were after the 3rd guy for some reason & I bet he gets the book thrown at him. It sounds like there was some backroom deals worked out, is why the first two walked.