Looking at my first .308 rifle.

FloridaGuy · August 5, 2018, 07:02 PM

My question here is should I build it as an AR-10 or go with a bolt gun? It is only going to be a range gun. The longest it will be shot would be possibly 600 yards. This will be my first .308 Rifle.

Mobuck · August 6, 2018, 07:04 AM

"Building" an AR 10 isn't as questionable as it once was but there may still be "fitment" issues.
FWIW
An AR 10 with a decent weight/length barrel is a heavy SOB. I own one in .308 (plus a 2nd upper in 6.5C from the same company) but haven't fired either yet. The first comment from everyone who's handled the AR 10 is "Wow, that's heavy". I have a nice .308 Mauser w/24" semi-target barrel rifle that's about the same weight and haven't heard anyone make this comment about it.

jugornot · August 6, 2018, 08:29 AM

I have both, and it depends on your personality. If you hand load and like to experiment with all the variables mag length may interfere with the length. My bolt action is single shot. I bought the bolt actions first. The ar10 is almost as accurate as the bolt but is .1" to .2" larger 5 shot groups. I have single shot bolts and ARs in both 223 and 308. Both are economical rounds to shoot. All 4 rifles with scope weigh close to 15 Lbs. All are bull barrelled.

Don Fischer · August 6, 2018, 09:07 AM

Just depends on what you like. Myself you couldn't give me an AR type rifle if you paid me. I'm sure they have their purpose but da*n are they ugly! If your building one just for the range, I'd suggest a laminated stock and a heavy barrel. Laminate stock are heavy and super stable. Then again I don't care for the look's of most of them, they try to turn them into modern art but, I've seen a few walnut on walnut stock that were very nice. Think I'd go with a thumb hole too on a range only rifle. Supposed to put your hand in a better position. And for me, I love Sierra match King bullet's for target shooting. They are the only match bullet I've ever used but I just can't imagine improving accuracy over what I've got over the years.

jmr40 · August 6, 2018, 09:58 AM

You'll get a lot more gun, with better accuracy, with less weight to lug around, with better reliability, for a lot less money with a bolt gun. And you can load ammo to just about any safe pressure level and still have it function in the rifle. Semi's have to use ammo loaded within a fairly narrow pressure range in order to function.

You can get get a semi to shoot well, but it is just a lot easier and cheaper to do with a bolt gun. But if you want to shoot fast and have 20 rounds of ammo available the semi is the way to go.

I like this. Street price in blue is about $900, about $1000 in SS. Mine is 8.5 lbs scoped. A little on the heavy side for hunting but manageable. Will out shoot most semi's costing twice as much and still holds 10+1 rounds if you want to carry lots of ammo.

http://www.tikka.fi/en-us/rifles/tik...tactical-rifle

T. O'Heir · August 6, 2018, 12:30 PM

"...will be my first .308 rifle..." That doesn't matter. Neither does, "only going to be a range gun", really. A guy's toys are personal. Which one speaks to you?
The major difference between a semi-auto and a bolt action .308 is the felt recoil. Felt recoil is more important for a 'range gun' than hunting rifles. There's virtually none with a semi. The bolt will depend more on its weight for recoil absorption.

agtman · August 6, 2018, 04:23 PM

Quote:

My question here is should I build it as an AR-10 or go with a bolt gun? It is only going to be a range gun. The longest it will be shot would be possibly 600 yards. This will be my first .308 Rifle.

Dude, just asking the question implies the answer ...

Newbies and Tyros should begin their .308 experience with a bolt-gun of some make, not a semi-auto.

Leave the 7.62/.308 autoloaders (like my LMT LM8) to trained professionals, ... or at least to those folks who've actually taken AR tac courses where you can run your .30-cal AR hard over several days of intense training, and get to know it, which isn't going to happen just firing 10- or 20-rds off the bench on a lazy Sunday afternoon at your range.

You can thank me later.

std7mag · August 6, 2018, 08:25 PM

I'm with Mr. Fischer. You couldn't pay me to build/own an AR.

Now an M1A is a different story.

:

T.o. is right about recoil impulse, For a bolt gun, weight and stock shape will effect felt recoil. Not that the 308 is in the same league as say a 460 Weatherby.

Bfglowkey · August 7, 2018, 05:44 AM

If you want a range AR I would keep it in 556. Cheaper to plink/blast. If 308 is your true desire I most truly agree that a bolt gun is a safer bet for enjoyment long term. It will grow and shift usefulness as the years go by, should you decide lo range bench rest...you can do it. Hunting..yep that too.

kenny53 · August 7, 2018, 12:56 PM

I have two guns in 308. The first is my M1A, second is a Savage axis II. The M1A was a few bucks, the Savage was one of their entry level scope and gun combo (it was under $400). Both gun shoot great, both gun can hold a good group if I do my part.

Model12Win · August 7, 2018, 04:51 PM

The AR-10 has a lot more firepower and can be used for home defense with 110 grain TAPs.

Get the AR.

FloridaGuy · August 7, 2018, 06:41 PM

after Reading all the comments here it seems I may need to get both of them.��

Charlie98 · August 8, 2018, 07:37 AM

Quote:

I have two guns in 308. The first is my M1A, second is a Savage axis II.

Sort of the same/same... I have an M1a and a Savage 10T, they are certainly two different animals. Added to which, I also have a Savage 99 lever action in .308... which adds a 3rd dimension to the OP's question.

Generically, I will agree with bfglowkey... if all you are going to do is poke holes at the range, just stick with 5.56mm. If you are really going to get down with 100yds plus shooting, then the .308 makes more sense...

PlatinumCore16 · August 8, 2018, 05:48 PM

First question would be what other rifles do you have, if any? Secondly, I would still opt more for a bolt for punching paper to 600yds. However if you truly are only punching paper to 600yds, 5.56 will do that just fine. You'll start to see wind effects over 300ish yards, but that's just part of the game. If you are dead set on a 308, I would go bolt, but that's just my opinion.

FloridaGuy · August 8, 2018, 09:05 PM

Below are the current rifle configurations I have.

AR-15’s
.300 Blackout
5.56
6.5 Grendel
6.8 SPC
.50 Beowulf
.224 Valkyrie

Bolt Guns
6.5 Creedmoor

LineStretcher · August 8, 2018, 09:37 PM

If you want to keep your options open then you might consider the Thompson/Center Encore. I have three quick change barrels for mine. They are .308, 7mm Rem Mag and .500 Magnum. I bought mine used with these barrels and really enjoy it out at the range. I also have a DPMS Style LR .308 that's a lot of fun to shoot at the range. I built it as a range gun with a bull barrel and it is heavy but that extra weight makes it easy to shoot.

That said, If this was my first .308 and all I was going to do was shoot at the range with my primary concern being shooting skill development that might lead to long range accuracy then I would be all over one of the Tikka T3x rifles, probably the TAC.

Charlie98 · August 9, 2018, 08:27 AM

Having shot them side by side... my Savage 10T in .308 and an RPR in 6.5CM, if you are just looking for a range gun, stick with the 6.5 bolt gun you have. Having said that, and assuming you are just looking for something different, why not an M1a? You obviously have the AR bases covered...

PlatinumCore16 · August 9, 2018, 11:41 AM

Ah, okay, so this seems more of a 308 gun to have. A nice bolt gun will punch paper far beyond 600yds. However if you aren't looking for something that is 1/2MOA or close to, you might look into something along the AR10 lines, OR I will suggest something completely different: an H&K style roller lock 308. Your options are find an H&K and spend $3k+, go with a respected maker (PTR, Zenith, Omega) and spend around $1k, or take a chance on a C308 from CAI for around $500-$700 (depending on whether you went used or new). My C308 runs great and sits a little better than 2MOA, by my best estimates (still having issue with the scope). However most don't. So I would recommend if you are going the roller-lock route, PTR makes the GI which is actually usually under $1k.

Just beware, roller-locks come with side effects: You can't have just one.

Bfglowkey · August 9, 2018, 12:07 PM

Based on your current stockpile of rifles...a solid bolt gun in 308 is what I recommend. I see you already have a good representation from all calibers mostly...Grendel is a fun round, so ya....take your time and find a manufacturer that you trust or maybe even wished you had and go for the bolt 308.

davidsog · August 9, 2018, 12:48 PM

Quote:

an H&K style roller lock 308.

Good advice. A solid shooting rifle that you can get a lifetime supply of magazines for the cost of a basic load in other .308's.

http://fromthetrenchesworldreport.co...k-system/47516

Get one that includes the European Style magazine release (paddle) standard.

Quote:

PTR makes the GI which is actually usually under $1k.

Yes and it comes standard with the European Style magazine release!

Get the GIR as it also comes with a rail if you decide to run optics.

http://ptr-us.com/products/7-62-x-51-mm/

COSteve · August 10, 2018, 10:26 AM

My advice is to get what makes you feel good, not what anyone else tells you to get. Everyone has their 'image' of themselves shooting and that's what does it for them. Some like to be all tactical, some like to be a fudd, some want space guns, and some want an old trusty.

If you like a bolt gun, get one. If you like an AR10, build one. If you want something like a M1A, buy one. It's your money, your time, and your enjoyment you are talking about, not someone else's. Don't let anyone tell you what you want isn't right.

That said, it's also OK to go different ways. For instance, I have 8 leverguns, 11 semi-autos, and 2 bolt actions in my shooting collection. Clearly, I haven't settled on a single type of platform as I'm also considering adding a Pedersoli Little Betsy Sharps Single Shot in 357mag to try my hand at longer range (300-400yd) shooting with a pistol bullet!!

As part of my collection, in .308/7.62x51 I have both an newer Springfield NM M1A and a beautiful scoped 1959 Winchester Model 88 as well as a couple of 30-06/M2 Ball shooters: a scoped 1950 Winchester Model 70 and a 1954 Springfield Special Service M1 Garand.

I handload 150grn loads in the 2,850fps range for all of them (as well as other bullet weights and velocities), shoot them from 200-450yds, and have a ball with all of them so I guess I've sort of got one of each.

Reloadron · August 10, 2018, 02:28 PM

Get a rifle that suits your taste in a rifle. What I think likely matters not unless we share a taste in rifles. There are plenty of nice semi-automatic gas guns out there like the AR 10 or M1A and certainly no shortage of bolt guns and lever guns all chambered in .308 Winchester so get what suits you.

Ron

Bfglowkey · August 10, 2018, 04:17 PM

And 308 is such a easy caliber to find just the right rifle for. Every manufacturer is represented...its a smorgasbord!

shaunpain · August 10, 2018, 05:52 PM

I have a few bolt guns and like them, but they are not my preference for anything other than range toys. I feel that autos are infinitely more useful for almost any other application and prefer the AR/LR types. That said, they are heavy!

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

bamaranger · August 15, 2018, 04:23 AM

All the comments regards capacity,weight, reliability and so on are correct, but I didn't see much commentary on COST. You can buy a very practical and useful .308 bolt rifle, and scope it, for far less than an AR-10 or an M1A.

The Savage Scout, , the assorted MVP's, the Savage Hog, are all good .308 launchers. that can be had for far less than a semi, and they will (should) function with any ammo you feed them, and will probably shoot lights out farther than one can hold. Heck, I saw 2 Savage Axis rifles today w/ economy scope, for $199 dollars, new!

August 5, 2018, 07:02 PM	#1
FloridaGuy Senior Member Join Date: December 8, 2012 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 237	Looking at my first .308 rifle. My question here is should I build it as an AR-10 or go with a bolt gun? It is only going to be a range gun. The longest it will be shot would be possibly 600 yards. This will be my first .308 Rifle. __________________ Μολὼν λαβέ Authorized Blackhound Optics Dealer www.blackhoundoptics.com/CWFT

August 6, 2018, 09:58 AM	#5
jmr40 Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 2008 Location: Georgia Posts: 10,805	You'll get a lot more gun, with better accuracy, with less weight to lug around, with better reliability, for a lot less money with a bolt gun. And you can load ammo to just about any safe pressure level and still have it function in the rifle. Semi's have to use ammo loaded within a fairly narrow pressure range in order to function. You can get get a semi to shoot well, but it is just a lot easier and cheaper to do with a bolt gun. But if you want to shoot fast and have 20 rounds of ammo available the semi is the way to go. I like this. Street price in blue is about $900, about $1000 in SS. Mine is 8.5 lbs scoped. A little on the heavy side for hunting but manageable. Will out shoot most semi's costing twice as much and still holds 10+1 rounds if you want to carry lots of ammo. http://www.tikka.fi/en-us/rifles/tik...tactical-rifle __________________ "If you're still doing things the same way you were doing them 10 years ago, you're doing it wrong" Winston Churchill

August 6, 2018, 12:30 PM	#6
T. O'Heir Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 12,453	"...will be my first .308 rifle..." That doesn't matter. Neither does, "only going to be a range gun", really. A guy's toys are personal. Which one speaks to you? The major difference between a semi-auto and a bolt action .308 is the felt recoil. Felt recoil is more important for a 'range gun' than hunting rifles. There's virtually none with a semi. The bolt will depend more on its weight for recoil absorption. __________________ Spelling and grammar count!

August 6, 2018, 08:25 PM	#8
std7mag Senior Member Join Date: June 23, 2013 Location: Central Taxylvania.. Posts: 3,609	I'm with Mr. Fischer. You couldn't pay me to build/own an AR. Now an M1A is a different story. : T.o. is right about recoil impulse, For a bolt gun, weight and stock shape will effect felt recoil. Not that the 308 is in the same league as say a 460 Weatherby. __________________ When our own government declares itself as "tyrannical", where does that leave us??!! "Januarary 6th insurrection". Funny, I didn't see a single piece of rope...

August 7, 2018, 06:41 PM	#12
FloridaGuy Senior Member Join Date: December 8, 2012 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 237	after Reading all the comments here it seems I may need to get both of them.�� __________________ Μολὼν λαβέ Authorized Blackhound Optics Dealer www.blackhoundoptics.com/CWFT

August 6, 2018, 07:04 AM	#2
Mobuck Junior member Join Date: February 2, 2010 Posts: 6,846	"Building" an AR 10 isn't as questionable as it once was but there may still be "fitment" issues. FWIW An AR 10 with a decent weight/length barrel is a heavy SOB. I own one in .308 (plus a 2nd upper in 6.5C from the same company) but haven't fired either yet. The first comment from everyone who's handled the AR 10 is "Wow, that's heavy". I have a nice .308 Mauser w/24" semi-target barrel rifle that's about the same weight and haven't heard anyone make this comment about it.

August 6, 2018, 08:29 AM	#3
jugornot Senior Member Join Date: September 20, 2017 Posts: 197	I have both, and it depends on your personality. If you hand load and like to experiment with all the variables mag length may interfere with the length. My bolt action is single shot. I bought the bolt actions first. The ar10 is almost as accurate as the bolt but is .1" to .2" larger 5 shot groups. I have single shot bolts and ARs in both 223 and 308. Both are economical rounds to shoot. All 4 rifles with scope weigh close to 15 Lbs. All are bull barrelled.

August 6, 2018, 09:07 AM	#4
Don Fischer Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2017 Posts: 1,868	Just depends on what you like. Myself you couldn't give me an AR type rifle if you paid me. I'm sure they have their purpose but da*n are they ugly! If your building one just for the range, I'd suggest a laminated stock and a heavy barrel. Laminate stock are heavy and super stable. Then again I don't care for the look's of most of them, they try to turn them into modern art but, I've seen a few walnut on walnut stock that were very nice. Think I'd go with a thumb hole too on a range only rifle. Supposed to put your hand in a better position. And for me, I love Sierra match King bullet's for target shooting. They are the only match bullet I've ever used but I just can't imagine improving accuracy over what I've got over the years.

August 7, 2018, 05:44 AM	#9
Bfglowkey Senior Member Join Date: May 27, 2018 Posts: 302	If you want a range AR I would keep it in 556. Cheaper to plink/blast. If 308 is your true desire I most truly agree that a bolt gun is a safer bet for enjoyment long term. It will grow and shift usefulness as the years go by, should you decide lo range bench rest...you can do it. Hunting..yep that too.

August 7, 2018, 12:56 PM	#10
kenny53 Senior Member Join Date: December 30, 2015 Location: My back yard Posts: 971	I have two guns in 308. The first is my M1A, second is a Savage axis II. The M1A was a few bucks, the Savage was one of their entry level scope and gun combo (it was under $400). Both gun shoot great, both gun can hold a good group if I do my part.

August 7, 2018, 04:51 PM	#11
Model12Win Junior member Join Date: October 20, 2012 Posts: 5,854	The AR-10 has a lot more firepower and can be used for home defense with 110 grain TAPs. Get the AR.

August 8, 2018, 05:48 PM	#14
PlatinumCore16 Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2017 Location: Colorado Posts: 424	First question would be what other rifles do you have, if any? Secondly, I would still opt more for a bolt for punching paper to 600yds. However if you truly are only punching paper to 600yds, 5.56 will do that just fine. You'll start to see wind effects over 300ish yards, but that's just part of the game. If you are dead set on a 308, I would go bolt, but that's just my opinion.

August 8, 2018, 09:05 PM	#15
FloridaGuy Senior Member Join Date: December 8, 2012 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 237	Below are the current rifle configurations I have. AR-15’s .300 Blackout 5.56 6.5 Grendel 6.8 SPC .50 Beowulf .224 Valkyrie Bolt Guns 6.5 Creedmoor __________________ Μολὼν λαβέ Authorized Blackhound Optics Dealer www.blackhoundoptics.com/CWFT

August 8, 2018, 09:37 PM	#16
LineStretcher Senior Member Join Date: June 14, 2018 Posts: 619	If you want to keep your options open then you might consider the Thompson/Center Encore. I have three quick change barrels for mine. They are .308, 7mm Rem Mag and .500 Magnum. I bought mine used with these barrels and really enjoy it out at the range. I also have a DPMS Style LR .308 that's a lot of fun to shoot at the range. I built it as a range gun with a bull barrel and it is heavy but that extra weight makes it easy to shoot. That said, If this was my first .308 and all I was going to do was shoot at the range with my primary concern being shooting skill development that might lead to long range accuracy then I would be all over one of the Tikka T3x rifles, probably the TAC.

August 9, 2018, 08:27 AM	#17
Charlie98 Senior Member Join Date: September 6, 2006 Location: Great state of Texas Posts: 1,077	Having shot them side by side... my Savage 10T in .308 and an RPR in 6.5CM, if you are just looking for a range gun, stick with the 6.5 bolt gun you have. Having said that, and assuming you are just looking for something different, why not an M1a? You obviously have the AR bases covered... __________________ _______________ "I have this pistol pointed at your heart!" "That is my least vulnerable spot."

August 9, 2018, 11:41 AM	#18
PlatinumCore16 Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2017 Location: Colorado Posts: 424	Ah, okay, so this seems more of a 308 gun to have. A nice bolt gun will punch paper far beyond 600yds. However if you aren't looking for something that is 1/2MOA or close to, you might look into something along the AR10 lines, OR I will suggest something completely different: an H&K style roller lock 308. Your options are find an H&K and spend $3k+, go with a respected maker (PTR, Zenith, Omega) and spend around $1k, or take a chance on a C308 from CAI for around $500-$700 (depending on whether you went used or new). My C308 runs great and sits a little better than 2MOA, by my best estimates (still having issue with the scope). However most don't. So I would recommend if you are going the roller-lock route, PTR makes the GI which is actually usually under $1k. Just beware, roller-locks come with side effects: You can't have just one.

August 9, 2018, 12:07 PM	#19
Bfglowkey Senior Member Join Date: May 27, 2018 Posts: 302	Based on your current stockpile of rifles...a solid bolt gun in 308 is what I recommend. I see you already have a good representation from all calibers mostly...Grendel is a fun round, so ya....take your time and find a manufacturer that you trust or maybe even wished you had and go for the bolt 308.

August 10, 2018, 10:26 AM	#21
COSteve Senior Member Join Date: September 6, 2009 Posts: 1,344	My advice is to get what makes you feel good, not what anyone else tells you to get. Everyone has their 'image' of themselves shooting and that's what does it for them. Some like to be all tactical, some like to be a fudd, some want space guns, and some want an old trusty. If you like a bolt gun, get one. If you like an AR10, build one. If you want something like a M1A, buy one. It's your money, your time, and your enjoyment you are talking about, not someone else's. Don't let anyone tell you what you want isn't right. That said, it's also OK to go different ways. For instance, I have 8 leverguns, 11 semi-autos, and 2 bolt actions in my shooting collection. Clearly, I haven't settled on a single type of platform as I'm also considering adding a Pedersoli Little Betsy Sharps Single Shot in 357mag to try my hand at longer range (300-400yd) shooting with a pistol bullet!! As part of my collection, in .308/7.62x51 I have both an newer Springfield NM M1A and a beautiful scoped 1959 Winchester Model 88 as well as a couple of 30-06/M2 Ball shooters: a scoped 1950 Winchester Model 70 and a 1954 Springfield Special Service M1 Garand. I handload 150grn loads in the 2,850fps range for all of them (as well as other bullet weights and velocities), shoot them from 200-450yds, and have a ball with all of them so I guess I've sort of got one of each.

August 10, 2018, 02:28 PM	#22
Reloadron Senior Member Join Date: June 8, 2016 Location: Cleveland, Ohio Suburbs Posts: 1,750	Get a rifle that suits your taste in a rifle. What I think likely matters not unless we share a taste in rifles. There are plenty of nice semi-automatic gas guns out there like the AR 10 or M1A and certainly no shortage of bolt guns and lever guns all chambered in .308 Winchester so get what suits you. Ron

August 10, 2018, 04:17 PM	#23
Bfglowkey Senior Member Join Date: May 27, 2018 Posts: 302	And 308 is such a easy caliber to find just the right rifle for. Every manufacturer is represented...its a smorgasbord!

August 10, 2018, 05:52 PM	#24
shaunpain Senior Member Join Date: September 12, 2008 Location: Chicago Posts: 854	I have a few bolt guns and like them, but they are not my preference for anything other than range toys. I feel that autos are infinitely more useful for almost any other application and prefer the AR/LR types. That said, they are heavy! Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

August 15, 2018, 04:23 AM	#25
bamaranger Senior Member Join Date: October 9, 2009 Location: North Alabama Posts: 8,300	cost All the comments regards capacity,weight, reliability and so on are correct, but I didn't see much commentary on COST. You can buy a very practical and useful .308 bolt rifle, and scope it, for far less than an AR-10 or an M1A. The Savage Scout, , the assorted MVP's, the Savage Hog, are all good .308 launchers. that can be had for far less than a semi, and they will (should) function with any ammo you feed them, and will probably shoot lights out farther than one can hold. Heck, I saw 2 Savage Axis rifles today w/ economy scope, for $199 dollars, new!